Uvalde Texas Killing

[KLB]

I have one of each.

Ex wife #1- Crazy as ****. Ex wife #2- Cant stand me at all.

No guns for you!

 

[jamil]

I'm going to need a cite about the states not notifying the FBI, I think I've heard about that happening in one shooting like this and it wasn't a state that didn't notify it was iirc the Army.

7 cops in the building 2 minutes after he entered the school. If the timeline is correct, which honestly I have my doubts.

I've heard so much conflicting information so far that the timeline posted is probably not reliable for anything other than showing that the cops did not perform as expected.

 

[KLB]

Why would anyone expect accurate information at this stage? We all know how unreliable reports are about anything in the early days after an event.

 

[Ingomike]

I wouldn’t make up your mind about what actually happened until the coverup is complete

FIFY…

 

[Ingomike]

Why would anyone expect accurate information at this stage? We all know how unreliable reports are about anything in the early days after an event.

And we will get accurate info after the investigation? If yes you have more faith in the system than I…

 

[Expat]

And we will get accurate info after the investigation? If yes you have more faith in the system than I…

Yeah, but they have the top men from the FBI on the case

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Yeah, but they have the top men from the FBI on the case

Well…with school about to let out for the summer and (I assume) no school board meetings for awhile, those agents need to be kept busy doing something.

 

[jamil]

And we will get accurate info after the investigation? If yes you have more faith in the system than I…

Too many people using “information” for ideological purposes.

Look how many of these shooting investigations have been locked down? What really happened in Las Vegas? What about the shooting in the theater in Denver? I suspect this one might be the same. We get a bunch of conflicting information. Then it fades from people’s memory. And then nothing.

Really. Why can’t the all the facts learned in the Los Vegas shooting be released? All of it.

 

[JCSR]

 

[Keith_Indy]

I was merely bringing up the difficulty regarding the placing of people who may have mental issues that don't rise to the immediate threat to self or others.

 

[Creedmoor]

I'm going to need a cite about the states not notifying the FBI, I think I've heard about that happening in one shooting like this and it wasn't a state that didn't notify it was iirc the Army.

This has been going on since nics started what, 20+ years ago. If your waiting for a cite for that, load a cooler and bring it and a stand and pee, it will be awhile.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

I'd say no. I don't think background checks were ever a solution to violent crime with firearms. I think if we're gonna play games trying to predict who's gonna be violent, let's try to be more accurate, like I said in the previous post.

No more arbitrary criteria that prohibits whole classes of people as groups. If people are going to lose rights it should be as an individual, and there needs to be a way to restore those rights. So maybe have a database of people who have been judged by a court as having lost their right to own firearms. And then you fight it in court if you think you don't deserve to be on that list.

While I would prefer this to what is currently in effect. I'm more along the lines of if they aren't currently locked up... or to put it another way, No free man shall be disbarred the use of arms.

I was merely bringing up the difficulty regarding the placing of people who may have mental issues that don't rise to the immediate threat to self or others.

Why place them anywhere? I know quite a few people that have mental issues, and some of them own firearms. I don't have a problem with it.

This has been going on since nics started what, 20+ years ago. If your waiting for a cite for that, load a cooler and bring it and a stand and pee, it will be awhile.

Let me rephrase it a bit. How many of these shooters were prohibited persons and should have been reported to nics and were not?

 

[Creedmoor]

Let me rephrase it a bit. How many of these shooters were prohibited persons and should have been reported to nics and were not?

More than one, and that for me,
would be too many.

Im truly not that interested in the exact number, if you are Google away my friend.

 

[KLB]

While I would prefer this to what is currently in effect. I'm more along the lines of if they aren't currently locked up... or to put it another way, No free man shall be disbarred the use of arms.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

More than one, and that for me,
would be too many.

Im truly not that interested in the exact number, if you are Google away my friend.

Only one I know of, was the military that didn't report it. I've heard of no others let alone multiple. As I stated there are more iirc that bought them in a private sale, should those be banned? I know of some where they stole them, if it's more than one shouldn't ownership be banned?

 

[The Bubba Effect]

Really. Why can’t the all the facts learned in the Los Vegas shooting be released? All of it.

My suspicion is that to release all the info would involve discussing the m249b, where it came from and why he had one.

I know people that have met in Vegas hotel rooms to sell weapons and weapon systems to foreign actors. (With the blessing of our sttre dept/dod).
From what I have seen, it is not out of line to suggest that there are arms dealers wining and dining international clients in Vegas hotel rooms on any given night.

I wouldn't be surprised if this guy was some kind of "cutout" for a company or group that supply weapons to foreign entities.

I would be surprised if there was not something like an m249b in that room (some kind of proper machine gun that takes a beta mag).

 

[Creedmoor]

Only one I know of, was the military that didn't report it. I've heard of no others let alone multiple. As I stated there are more iirc that bought them in a private sale, should those be banned? I know of some where they stole them, if it's more than one shouldn't ownership be banned?

Without losing sight of the larger perspective that most who are violent are not mentally ill, and most of the mentally ill are not violent, our message is that mental health providers, lawyers and the public should be made aware that some unmedicated patients do pose an increased risk of violence," wrote researchers led by Dr. Ira Glick, from Stanford University's School of Medicine.
Glick's team studied 35 mass shooting cases that occurred in the United States between 1982 and 2019 and involved shooters who survived and were brought to trial.
Analysis of various sources of medical evidence on the mass shooters showed that 28 had mental illness diagnoses. Eighteen had schizophrenia and 10 had other diagnoses including bipolar disorder, delusional disorder, personality disorders and substance-related disorders.
Of the 28 shooters with a mental illness diagnosis, none were medicated or received other treatment for their disorders prior to their crimes, according to the study published recently in the Journal of Clinical Psychopharmacology.
Glick and his colleagues also examined 20 mass shooters who died at the crime scene and found that eight had schizophrenia, seven had other mental health diagnoses, and five had unknown diagnoses. None were receiving appropriate medications.
The investigators pointed out that despite the high frequency of mass shooting events in the United States, there has been almost no medical research on the nature and incidence of mental illness among people who commit these crimes.

https://www.usnews.com/news/health-news/articles/2021-06-15/many-us-mass-shooters-had-untreated-mental-illness-study

 

[Timjoebillybob]

Without losing sight of the larger perspective that most who are violent are not mentally ill, and most of the mentally ill are not violent, our message is that mental health providers, lawyers and the public should be made aware that some unmedicated patients do pose an increased risk of violence," wrote researchers led by Dr. Ira Glick, from Stanford University's School of Medicine.
Glick's team studied 35 mass shooting cases that occurred in the United States between 1982 and 2019 and involved shooters who survived and were brought to trial.
Analysis of various sources of medical evidence on the mass shooters showed that 28 had mental illness diagnoses. Eighteen had schizophrenia and 10 had other diagnoses including bipolar disorder, delusional disorder, personality disorders and substance-related disorders.
Of the 28 shooters with a mental illness diagnosis, none were medicated or received other treatment for their disorders prior to their crimes, according to the study published recently in the Journal of Clinical Psychopharmacology.
Glick and his colleagues also examined 20 mass shooters who died at the crime scene and found that eight had schizophrenia, seven had other mental health diagnoses, and five had unknown diagnoses. None were receiving appropriate medications.
The investigators pointed out that despite the high frequency of mass shooting events in the United States, there has been almost no medical research on the nature and incidence of mental illness among people who commit these crimes.

https://www.usnews.com/news/health-news/articles/2021-06-15/many-us-mass-shooters-had-untreated-mental-illness-study

So what should be done? Should anyone who is seeking treatment become a prohibited person? How many of those were adjudicated mentally defective? Which as I understand is what is required to be placed on the prohibited list.

If you have a child who has been diagnosed with a mental illness, should you be prohibited from owning firearms? How about a spouse? Have friends that come over that have been diagnosed?

You also didn't answer my questions, since more than one bought their firearms in a private sale, should private sales be banned and all transfers be required to go through a FFL? Since more than one stole their firearms, should private ownership be banned?

 

[Creedmoor]

So what should be done? Should anyone who is seeking treatment become a prohibited person? How many of those were adjudicated mentally defective? Which as I understand is what is required to be placed on the prohibited list.

If you have a child who has been diagnosed with a mental illness, should you be prohibited from owning firearms? How about a spouse? Have friends that come over that have been diagnosed?

For Christ Sake Man, give it a rest.
WTF

 

[mmpsteve]

... I'm more along the lines of if they aren't currently locked up... or to put it another way, No free man shall be disbarred the use of arms.

...

While I'm inclined to agree with you in theory, what do you say about the violent-weapons felon who's served his time? Technically he's free. Should he be able to carry? Just trying to clarify your thoughts on this, because I'm not sure myself what the right answer is.

.