Vaccine coercion/bribery

[JettaKnight]

If Covid were the legitimate threat to our species it's been claimed to be there would have been a global effort to develop a vaccine or other methods of stopping it. Instead, we have a few companies making billions of dollars selling the "cure". The only global effort we've seen has been in sales and marketing.

So when the SHTF, capitalism has to go out the window and socialism must take over?

And if you don't want large companies with the skills and production capabilities to produce a vaccine,then who should?

Personally, I think the response was appropriate for the level of severity.

 

[Jaybird1980]

My time here is limited, very likely much more so than my wife and certainly my children. I'm essentially the sole breadwinner and if I'm gone that money stops showing up. They're my focus and my concern 10 fold over my own. Their safety and security are worth the gamble if it paid off the house and I didn't lose my job from refusing.

These are the exact reasons that led me to get the vaccine.
My time is already limited and my health makes Covid a very real danger for me, if I'm gone my family's life will be changed for the worse.
No I don't think Covid is a real danger to the majority of people, but it is a real danger to some.
I tried to remove the fact that some people are taking advantage of a situation for gain. I recognize that they are going to do that with every situation that they possibly can, and that shouldn't be my influence.

 

[Jaybird1980]

Well, not so fast. What kind of ice cream are we talkin'?

Actually you're right, crap I might have screwed myself out of some good ice cream.

I've never been a good negotiator.

 

[defaultdotxbe]

Actually you're right, crap I might have screwed myself out of some good ice cream.

I've never been a good negotiator.

 

[JettaKnight]

I'm more annoyed with using taxpayer money to fund the vaccine, taxpayer money to find its distribution, and then more taxpayer money to fund the bribery.

In an actual pandemic, wouldn't folks be throwing money at the pharmacy to get it for themselves?

If they have the money.

In the midst of a pandemic you don't want people making that choice based on personal economics.


States have an incentive to get people working and economies high, and if they run the numbers and decide that it is in their best interest to offer incentives to fence-sitters, then so be it.

The goal is to get as many people vaccinated as fast as possible; carrots are better than sticks, and outside the box thinking is good.

 

[jamil]

If they have the money.

In the midst of a pandemic you don't want people making that choice based on personal economics.


States have an incentive to get people working and economies high, and if they run the numbers and decide that it is in their best interest to offer incentives to fence-sitters, then so be it.

The goal is to get as many people vaccinated as fast as possible; carrots are better than sticks, and outside the box thinking is good.

Maybe there's a compromise. Maybe the government can solicit people to donate from their own income directly to fund the vax prize. How much can we put you down for?

 

[JettaKnight]

Maybe there's a compromise. Maybe the government can solicit people to donate from their own income directly to fund the vax prize. How much can we put you down for?

Lighthouse and autopsies....

 

[SheepDog4Life]

Not what I said. There have been global efforts but those efforts have been and will continue to be profit based (sales & marketing), not an "all skate" situation where saving lives was the goal. It's been about money and power from day one.

Ok, sure, let's change gears...

So, now, since corporations have made and are making money/profits on vaccines, they are de facto not saving lives?

Taken to it's extreme, I read your position as IF the vaccines were saving lives, or principally about saving lives, Pfizer et al would altruistically be giving them away free... even if it meant bankruptcy... IMO, smacks of a "if it saves just one life" theme.

tl;dr: Saving lives and making profits are not mutually exclusive.

 

[BugI02]

Natural reluctance of a percentage of the population to let others do the "beta testing". "You first"--only natural.

I have no problem paying people to take it, incentives over coercion, any day, every day.

The longer the vaccine is out, the more people will voluntarily take it.

As an Ohioan, my perspective is they decided late in the game that they wanted a vaccine registry. I came to that conclusion because you have to opt in and register to be eligible for the drawing, not merely prove your status to claim the prize. That says they don't have a database to pull names from

 

[Ingomike]

As an Ohioan, my perspective is they decided late in the game that they wanted a vaccine registry. I came to that conclusion because you have to opt in and register to be eligible for the drawing, not merely prove your status to claim the prize. That says they don't have a database to pull names from

Of course, makes perfect sense...

 

[defaultdotxbe]

As an Ohioan, my perspective is they decided late in the game that they wanted a vaccine registry. I came to that conclusion because you have to opt in and register to be eligible for the drawing, not merely prove your status to claim the prize. That says they don't have a database to pull names from

If its anything like Indiana they do have a central database, but perhaps need the opt-in to use the data for the lottery (for HIPPA compliance you can't just access medical data and use it for whatever you want without patient consent)

Edit: you can access your record here

https://eportal.isdh.in.gov/C19VaccinationPortal/

 

[BugI02]

If its anything like Indiana they do have a central database, but perhaps need the opt-in to use the data for the lottery (for HIPPA compliance you can't just access medical data and use it for whatever you want without patient consent)

I'm skeptical. From what I've been told by people who opted in, registry was more than just a name and contact info. They wouldn't need any more than that if they had a database they could compare names to upon opt in

Oh, and they're using Biden Bucks to fund the prizes

 

[phylodog]

Ok, sure, let's change gears...

So, now, since corporations have made and are making money/profits on vaccines, they are de facto not saving lives?

Taken to it's extreme, I read your position as IF the vaccines were saving lives, or principally about saving lives, Pfizer et al would altruistically be giving them away free... even if it meant bankruptcy... IMO, smacks of a "if it saves just one life" theme.

tl;dr: Saving lives and making profits are not mutually exclusive.

Sorry you’re getting upset, I know you’re all in concerning Covid 19 but I’m not.

 

[phylodog]

So when the SHTF, capitalism has to go out the window and socialism must take over?

And if you don't want large companies with the skills and production capabilities to produce a vaccine,then who should?

Personally, I think the response was appropriate for the level of severity.

What I'm saying is the "severity" of the pandemic does not balance with a profit based approach. I'm all for capitalism and people making money by whatever legal means they choose, right up to the point they become part of a scam. Scaring people into locking themselves indoors for months and rewarding them their freedom with a "vaccine" which was developed with their own money then purchased (again) with their own money I take issue with, yes.

Well, take issue may not be the appropriate description. I really don't care as worrying about how the DC vultures are doling out made up money makes about as much sense as worrying about the sun flipping into a black hole overnight...there ain't a damned thing I can do about it so I don't waste the time. That said, we will be arriving soon at the point where they begin outright compelling people to get the vaccine. Kind of like government mandated insurance you "must" purchase (assuming you're dumb enough to work for a living) or be financially penalized. Then I'll actually take issue.

Yay for freedom

 

[SheepDog4Life]

Sorry you’re getting upset, I know you’re all in concerning Covid 19 but I’m not.

Upset? No, more like amused at the pretzel contortions, lol... just pointing out that capitalist profit motive/competition WORKS.

And produced the top three (ok, maybe J&J tied for third) because the companies knew that the first to market with the best vaccine would make the most money.

And, at Warp Speed!

 

[jamil]

Evaluating the severity of the threat level is opinion... definitiely not "end of the species" level threat, IMO...

But to assert there haven't been global efforts to develop treatments and vaccines?




Eh, I don't think of it that way.

The collaborative approach leads to CDC ****ing up the first COVID tests... to all of EU betting on the AstroZeneca vaccine.

Trump/OWS seeded 5 vaccines to compete to come up with the best... and to ensure that at least one, worked... it's why we, the US, have three to choose from.

Competition is the opposite of cronyism, IMO.
n't been global efforts for vaccines and treatments?

Who paid for it?

 

[SheepDog4Life]

Who paid for it?

We did... we always do... for everything, one way or another.

So, if I'd paid my dues to earn the "crony" title... and was told, sure I'd get my shot along with every one of the major pharma companies, I wouldn't exactly feel like my back had been sufficiently scratched reciprocal-crony-style.

IIRC, Warp Speed provided seed funding to 5 companies, and Pfizer wasn't one of them, they self-funded... and unless it's been kept quiet, I haven't heard of any advance orders for any of the others (other than Pfizer/Moderna/J&J)... so this isn't exactly a Solyndra-type thing... i.e. picking the crony/winner and heaping money upon them.

 

[Colt556]

Now that Kroger is offering a million bucks or a years worth of groceries to some folks it’s pretty tempting.

 

[MCgrease08]

I don't like using tax payer money to find these incentive programs. Period. Full stop.

That said, government is gonna do what government does, and that's pass around cash we don't have for things we don't want. With that out of the way, just from a marketing perspective, I would wager these lottery type programs are vastly more effective in getting people vaccinated then "awareness campaigns."

What is Ohio spending on these lottery prizes and college scholarships, $6-7 millon? I've seen estimates that cities like New York and LA are spending double that amount just for "awareness" campaigns, as if people aren't aware that vaccines are out there. The return on investment for these incentive programs is easier to track and more effective than traditional government programs. By making people sign up for the lottery you can directly tie that vaccine appointment back to the campaign. If the rate of people signing up for vaccines goes up, it can be attributed back to the activity. Metrics like this are table stakes for businesses. Frankly, I think it's something we should expect from government too. Why aren't we demanding that politicians give us analytics on the money they're spending?

Frankly, this seems like a step in the right direction.

 

[JettaKnight]

Devil's advocate here: What's the difference between this and offer Acme huge incentives to move operations to the state?

Let's assume the economic impact is the same.