To mask or not to mask....That is the question. Part II

JCSR

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Who wants in on a group buy? :lmfao:
E03kUeeVEAQro2Q.jpg
 

NHT3

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Masks aren't going away on planes or transit until Biden/Harris are out of office. Maybe not even then.
Mark my words, the criminal element is relishing the idea of concealing their identity under the guise of virus concerns. Since the current administration seems inclined to give the benefit of doubt to the more lawless among us masks may continue until they are banned in certain areas as they once were.
 

J Galt

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Mark my words, the criminal element is relishing the idea of concealing their identity under the guise of virus concerns. Since the current administration seems inclined to give the benefit of doubt to the more lawless among us masks may continue until they are banned in certain areas as they once were.

They already are. I literally watched a guy, with a full shopping cart in a hardware store, walk past the registers and into the parking lot, without paying. He had the bandana over his mouth (for safety and health), hat, and glasses. He walked past me and I would not be able to pick him out if I saw him again.

At least the chance of catching / spreading a virus with a 99.7% survival rate was decreased for that thief.
 

jamil

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I get that the mask mandates are stupid, but where do you guys keep coming up with this 99.something survival rate figure? Are you getting it from memes? :dunno:

I don’t think the CDC’s estimates are all that accurate either, because I think the case rates aren’t accurate and the death rate isn’t that accurate. But I suspect that the CDC rates are closer to reality.
 

Bugzilla

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No one is talking about how the flu was wiped off the face of the planet this past year!
Made a mask out of 1/4” blue berry netting. Wore it to Menards the other day. Got a few stink eye looks but no one told me anything.
 

sparky32

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I get that the mask mandates are stupid, but where do you guys keep coming up with this 99.something survival rate figure? Are you getting it from memes? :dunno:

I don’t think the CDC’s estimates are all that accurate either, because I think the case rates aren’t accurate and the death rate isn’t that accurate. But I suspect that the CDC rates are closer to reality.
1.8% so 98% for USA

Lots of people like me lost taste and smell and just never got tested to be part of the covid data pool so I imagine is closer to 99%
 

jamil

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1.8% so 98% for USA

Lots of people like me lost taste and smell and just never got tested to be part of the covid data pool so I imagine is closer to 99%
Okay. So “imagination” explains it? That may be useful to using for a meme, but it’s far from a hard figure as well. And to be fair I’m not gonna say you’re imagining it. It seems you meant that to communicate that this is what you suspect. And fine. Ut people are throwing those fugures aroun when they’re based on less data than the CDC used, and are likely less accurate.
 

sparky32

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Okay. So “imagination” explains it? That may be useful to using for a meme, but it’s far from a hard figure as well. And to be fair I’m not gonna say you’re imagining it. It seems you meant that to communicate that this is what you suspect. And fine. Ut people are throwing those fugures aroun when they’re based on less data than the CDC used, and are likely less accurate.
So what do you believe? Im just posting what info they have. Do I believe it? No. That seems a "hard figure" as you can get. I dont know and really dont care at this point because its all political now and no real data driven science any more. I know a ton of people that have had the taste and smell loss but never got tested so that is where im getting my data locally so the number is prob much higher of a survival rate. Is that what you think or do you suspect higher death rate? Guess that is what im trying to figure out

What does the CDC think? I dont think they know there elbow from an ***hole as much as they change there mind on everything.
 

gregr

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All of this. I for one am sick of the Kirks constantly talking down to anyone that disagrees, calling them anti-science and pulling the myeeee riiiiiights ********. Either have a rational argument that you can defend or shut the **** up. We don’t need more of this divisive ********. If you can’t understand there’s more going on than your black and white narrative then you really have no place in this conversation.
I think everyone has the right to decide for themselves whether to mask or not. As do businesses. If the business says mask or don`t come in, either mask or don`t go in. Pretty straightforward.

Our church has made masks optional for a really long time now. A few wear masks, most do not. The understanding is that there will be no condemnation of whatever position one takes tolerated. Again, pretty straightforward.
 

jamil

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So what do you believe? Im just posting what info they have. Do I believe it? No. That seems a "hard figure" as you can get. I dont know and really dont care at this point because its all political now and no real data driven science any more. I know a ton of people that have had the taste and smell loss but never got tested so that is where im getting my data locally so the number is prob much higher of a survival rate. Is that what you think or do you suspect higher death rate? Guess that is what im trying to figure out

What does the CDC think? I dont think they know there elbow from an ***hole as much as they change there mind on everything.
I can’t disagree with that. What do I believe? I think the number is somewhere near zero for young healthy people, and a few percent for older people and overweight/unhealthy people.
 

Ingomike

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Okay. So “imagination” explains it? That may be useful to using for a meme, but it’s far from a hard figure as well. And to be fair I’m not gonna say you’re imagining it. It seems you meant that to communicate that this is what you suspect. And fine. Ut people are throwing those fugures aroun when they’re based on less data than the CDC used, and are likely less accurate.
How about just fu***** real life observations since most agree that any numbers related to this China virus are politicized?
 

nonobaddog

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Well, we do not have a "hard" number for the deaths actually caused by the virus and we do not have a "hard" number for the the cases of the virus.
Nobody will ever have "hard", accurate numbers for either the numerator nor the the denominator so nobody will ever have a "hard", accurate value for the fraction or the percentage.

Personally I believe the "official" number of deaths actually caused by the virus are inflated due to political and financial incentives to do so and I believe the "official" number of cases is inaccurate due to testing inaccuracies and a population of people that have had cases so mild that they either didn't bother to get tested or didn't even know they had it.

It doesn't much matter if the number comes from CDC or PTA or a meme - it isn't accurate. I sure won't bother to pick on any survival numbers anybody wants to use because I do not have anything better.
 

jamil

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How about just fu***** real life observations since most agree that any numbers related to this China virus are politicized?
Plural of anecdotes is not data. If I went by real life observations I would have to say I don’t personally know anyone who’s died from it. Can I say the death rate is zero? A point I made last year was that it’s really hard to know the denominator unless everyone was tested. Best they can do us use the positive rate and extrapolate. But them that could be politicized too and inaccurately reported, or even manipulated. If I had to give an accurate death rate I’d have to give a range because it’s hard to know. I suspect that it’s really easy for some folks to believe that survival rate is 99.whatever% is the truth. Maybe in younger healthy people. But that’s not what they’re saying.
 

jamil

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Well, we do not have a "hard" number for the deaths actually caused by the virus and we do not have a "hard" number for the the cases of the virus.
Nobody will ever have "hard", accurate numbers for either the numerator nor the the denominator so nobody will ever have a "hard", accurate value for the fraction or the percentage.

Personally I believe the "official" number of deaths actually caused by the virus are inflated due to political and financial incentives to do so and I believe the "official" number of cases is inaccurate due to testing inaccuracies and a population of people that have had cases so mild that they either didn't bother to get tested or didn't even know they had it.

It doesn't much matter if the number comes from CDC or PTA or a meme - it isn't accurate. I sure won't bother to pick on any survival numbers anybody wants to use because I do not have anything better.
Agreed. And because of that it’s silly to go around claiming the survival rate is 99.whatever% as if the virus has no impact at all. Likewise it’s silly to go around locking **** down and forcing mass behavioral changes in society, as if the virus has massive impacts on all of society.
 

nonobaddog

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Agreed. And because of that it’s silly to go around claiming the survival rate is 99.whatever% as if the virus has no impact at all. Likewise it’s silly to go around locking **** down and forcing mass behavioral changes in society, as if the virus has massive impacts on all of society.
Exactly.
Also the virus does have an age dependent effect so it is not ideal to treat society as one monolithic entity. They should not have applied mitigation measures universally across all of society.
 

BugI02

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Okay. So “imagination” explains it? That may be useful to using for a meme, but it’s far from a hard figure as well. And to be fair I’m not gonna say you’re imagining it. It seems you meant that to communicate that this is what you suspect. And fine. Ut people are throwing those fugures aroun when they’re based on less data than the CDC used, and are likely less accurate.
Via worldometers:

US deaths per million 1791

US total cases per million 100585

1791 ÷ 100585 = 0.
0178 or 1.78% CFR
 
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jamil

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Via worldometers:

US deaths per million 1791

US total cases per million 100585

1791 ÷ 100585 = 0.178 or 1.78% CFR
Okay. And for young healthy people it’s way less than that. And for older/unhealthy people it’s way more than that. So you throw out numbers. That one’s pretty meaningless other than for comparison’s sake. We don’t really know the denominator and the numerator isn’t a lot better when deaths that may not actually have been caused by covid are counted as covid.
 

BugI02

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So what's your point, there Goldilocks. All I'm getting is YOU think 0.2% CFR is too low and 1.8% CFR is too high, but you want reliable estimates from unreliable numbers. We are using multiple sources to obtain our data, we thought that was what you wanted?

The upshot is, something like one or two people per 100 at most will catch this and die from it.
It's not Marburg and people should probably stop acting like they're never going to die if they are just careful enough
 
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