Defending against dogs with lethal force?

[Joniki]

i had to GOOGLE this only to find out I am guilty of it. Also, it is misspelled... LOL

Although I love animals, I have a bit of a problem with the current anthropromorphization of them.

 

[2A_Tom]

i had to GOOLE this only to find out I am guilty of it. Also, it is misspelled... LOL

I stand corrected.

Actually the spell check gave me that option and I took it.

 

[Joniki]

I stand corrected.

Actually the spell check gave me that option and I took it.

I had to ask my Shepherd for the correct spelling...

 

[T.Lex]

Scooby Doo approves of this thread derailment.

And Mickey Mouse.

Not so much Pluto.

 

[churchmouse]

Scooby Doo approves of this thread derailment.

And Mickey Mouse.

Not so much Pluto.

When I step in with a strong opinion I have no issue's to rebuttals or differing points of view if put forth in civil conversation.
I have friends that cherish their pets. Literally cherish them a few above their kids. That is just odd to me. Well, more than odd.
I will not even attempt to type out the big word 2AT used but I know the meaning.
I believe the entire point of this thread is to contain your pets. Keep them on your property. Have them under control when out for a walk. Thats just being a good neighbor. And its part of the reasons not to have a dog living in close quarters if you do not intend to maintain the animal.
Cats. Now thats another thing all together...

 

[JettaKnight]

Why is it ok to call cats and dogs "fur babies", but not call infants "hairless humans"?

 

[littletommy]

i had to GOOLE this only to find out I am guilty of it. Also, it is misspelled... LOL

I knew what it meant because of a Haywood Banks song.

 

[2A_Tom]

When I step in with a strong opinion I have no issue's to rebuttals or differing points of view if put forth in civil conversation.
I have friends that cherish their pets. Literally cherish them a few above their kids. That is just odd to me. Well, more than odd.
I will not even attempt to type out the big word 2AT used but I know the meaning.
I believe the entire point of this thread is to contain your pets. Keep them on your property. Have them under control when out for a walk. Thats just being a good neighbor. And its part of the reasons not to have a dog living in close quarters if you do not intend to maintain the animal.
Cats. Now thats another thing all together...

and pick up their

Any cat out by itself is a feral cat aka target.

 

[churchmouse]

and pick up their

Any cat out by itself is a feral cat aka target.

Yeah I am huge on people policing up the animals

The local Coyotes and Hawkes have dessimated the cat problems around here. Possibly some of the free range dogs as well.

 

[IndyBeerman]

Alrighty, then.... assuming a 25 kg dog:

ΔE = 19,005.5 J = mV²/2 = (25 kg * V²)/2
V² = 2 * 19,005 J/ 25 kg = 1530.4
V ≈ 39 m/s

ETA: Of course that assumes a perfect transfer of energy and doesn't account for "absorption" within the dog.

Shouldn't this be "squish factor"?

 

[littletommy]

Yeah I am huge on people policing up the animals

The local Coyotes and Hawkes have dessimated the cat problems around here. Possibly some of the free range dogs as well.

My next door neighbor (rest his soul) was sitting on his back porch late one night watching some stray kittens playing around under the dusk to dawn light on his garage, and a huge owl flew in and grabbed one and disappeared. He said it was kinda sad, but very cool.

 

[Bill of Rights]

When I step in with a strong opinion I have no issue's to rebuttals or differing points of view if put forth in civil conversation.
I have friends that cherish their pets. Literally cherish them a few above their kids. That is just odd to me. Well, more than odd.
I will not even attempt to type out the big word 2AT used but I know the meaning.
I believe the entire point of this thread is to contain your pets. Keep them on your property. Have them under control when out for a walk. Thats just being a good neighbor. And its part of the reasons not to have a dog living in close quarters if you do not intend to maintain the animal.
Cats. Now thats another thing all together...

Ever seen the thing about, “The more I know most people, the more I love my dog”?

That.

And cats make great targets for a paintball marker, when they’re getting into the garbage cans. Or so I’m told.

And my dog never came to me asking for money or to borrow the car.

 

[SheepDog4Life]

Shouldn't this be "squish factor"?

Well, I hesitated to call it by its official name.

 

[Slonsteady]

Slime, aka pepper spray. Very effective on canines, even shepherds run away when doused in the face with it. this is my personal experience against a large charging shepherd. Consider it a suppressed concealed carry for critters.

 

[Angrysauce]

One of our members here had a considerable amount of gastric discomfort and some not-insignificant legal fees, I'd imagine, in part because he fired a warning shot to scare the dogs off.

The words "warning" and "shot" shouldn't ever be used in the same sentence in the context of civilian use of force encounters.
Are you trying to divert the course of a ship on the open ocean?
Are you or another actively under threat of great bodily harm or death?
If you answered no, firing a gun will likely only make the situation worse.

 

[Bill of Rights]

The words "warning" and "shot" shouldn't ever be used in the same sentence in the context of civilian use of force encounters.
Are you trying to divert the course of a ship on the open ocean?
Are you or another actively under threat of great bodily harm or death?
If you answered no, firing a gun will likely only make the situation worse.

The answer in that case, if I recall, was yes, reference great bodily harm.

 

[Angrysauce]

The answer in that case, if I recall, was yes, reference great bodily harm.

If you discharge a firearm to "scare dogs away" that leaves reasonable doubt that you were in fear of life and limb. You shoot things to neutralize threats, not to scare away would be threats.

 

[printcraft]

To the OP:

Is it a valid option to defend against dogs with deadly force? Yes, it is. Before the day comes that you have to, evaluate your local laws and buy an hour of a local attorney's time. One of our members here had a considerable amount of gastric discomfort and some not-insignificant legal fees, I'd imagine, in part because he fired a warning shot to scare the dogs off.

I am NOT pointing fingers with this post. Both attorneys did the job they are sworn to do, defend the interests of their client.

Hope this helps.

Blessings,
Bill

I'll point a finger. Still pisses me off to this day.
Jacking someone up with an arbitrary interpretation of law when he was trying to protect himself is the hallmark of bad faith action.
Joining here to data mine to use posts here against the same party is bad faith.
I'm not granting a pass, it should have never happened.
Just following orders doesn't pass the common sense freedom smell test.

 

[Twangbanger]

A dog ran out in front of my jeep at a busy intersection, in front of a restaurant at lunchtime last summer. I hit the dog, felt it under my jeep. I was afraid to look. I got out, dog had run off. Then this trashy version of an obese Karen shows up and starts screeching at me that i need to find the owners and tell them, and that i need to call the police. When i asked why the police, she screamed that she saw me hit the dog, everyone saw me hit the dog, and it's the right thing to do. I was already upset, she wouldn't listen to me, just kept going on and on, until i finally told her i don't need her telling me what to do, and to shut up and call the cops herself. Evidently she thinks it's a crime to accidentally hit a dog.

Late to this convo, and have only read the most recent posts.

My Son in Law (a) lives in a nice semi-country setting, he has a problem with nuisance animals. My other Son in Law (b) is a nuisance trapper, and set traps around (a's) house. (A's) neighbor has an aggressive and loud dog. Said dog got lose and ran into (a's) yard and my daughter heard loud whiney, plantive, barking outside and when she looked out the window the neighbor was carrying the dog back to their own yard.

They have not had a problem with that dog since.

Although I love animals, I have a bit of a problem with the current anthropromorphization of them

Before this thread turns into a cheezeburger group-hump and falls off the dashboard, it should probably be noted: the above posts point out something about situational awareness, which would probably be taken for granted in human encounters, but can't be forgotten when a dog is the target.

"Dog encounters" _are_ human encounters. People are stoopid emotional about animals, not even just their own. Don't assume the "incident" is over when the animal is dispatched, if you are ever in a situation where you need to shoot one. "3S" may have been the rule of the land when you lived in the country, but in town, Karens are everywhere. People stop being rational when animals are involved.

Cellphones and RING Doorbells are EVERYwhere. ASSUME you will be on the 5 o'clock news.

Keep your SA up, de-escalate by leaving the area if necessary, assume the Police will be called, and make sure you win the race to 911. It's a terrible thing to have to think about, but...having to "shoot the human" after you "shot the dog" is not an unthinkable scenario. If I had access to police records from across the country, I'm sure example(s) are already out there.

Also, go back and read the "knowingly and intentionally" part in BBI's post. If you ever accidentally hit a dog with your car on your travels, the inability of people to be rational about animals unfortunately comes into play. There have been more than one account of a child being hit in the street by a car, and ghetto residents "settling" the issue with "street justice" when the driver stopped to do the right thing. Many people look at Dogs as their children. They cannot draw that line in their mind. Don't assume anything. In today's environment, the question of whether to stop after you hit a dog, unfortunately requires more personal reflection than it once did. This is admittedly an inexact science, but... always consider where you are. The old "Tried by 12 than carried by 6" adage comes to mind, but sometimes, it may be better to avoid the question altogether. I realize saying that may not win me the "Andy Griffith Citizenship Award" among the stodgy old white man dog-lover crowd, but there it is.

Also note - BBI's excerpt would seem to indicate that Indiana Law apparently gives other peoples' animals carte blanche to run on your property without being shot, as long as they're not actively damaging anything of yours. File for reference, since the concept of the "free roaming cat" seems to be in-vogue today (if your local NextDoor social media feed is any indication).

 

[dudley0]

Had a very wily groundhog that was living under a rental. Tried everything to get it, live traps with all different types of bait. Considered a conibear but was worried about neighborhood cats.

Talked to a CO who said the cat shouldn't be under the house so set the trap. His opinion was that no harm no foul if it got killed there.

I didn't do it because I was worried a kid would happen upon the dead pet before I could get to it. I got the groundhog eventually, but now have a couple more at a different property.