GOP rep introduces nationwide concealed carry reciprocity

[JAL]

I personally have NO problem with Fix NICs as long as the system works like it's supposed to.
Plus, That's going to be the only way to pass national reciprocity through the Senate.

Democrats can't vote against NICs or they'll get blasted from the anti-gun folks and it takes 60 votes. With the slim majority Republicans have, they don't have enough to make this happen. This way it puts Democrats into a box and jams it through.

Was confident it will get through the House with this Congress. It was getting 60 votes to get it through the Senate that concerned me and by itself that would be pushing a huge boulder up a steep hill. Had not thought about the combination strategy with the NICS fix. I agree that it pushes the Dems into a corner in which they cannot oppose a bill that should make the NICS more effective. Too many recent events in which the active shooter wouldn't have been able to purchase any firearms if NICS was working as originally intended.

John

 

[jedi]

But nics is still vounteary for the states to send thier info into, is it not? If so its still a faciliy of safety and an inftignment of 2a.

 

[MCgrease08]

Was confident it will get through the House with this Congress. It was getting 60 votes to get it through the Senate that concerned me and by itself that would be pushing a huge boulder up a steep hill. Had not thought about the combination strategy with the NICS fix. I agree that it pushes the Dems into a corner in which they cannot oppose a bill that should make the NICS more effective. Too many recent events in which the active shooter wouldn't have been able to purchase any firearms if NICS was working as originally intended.

John

I disagree. The Dems will say the same thing you see in the OP. They will accuse the GOP of adding a "poison pill" by combining it with reciprocity. They will demand that the NICS fix be voted on separately and accuse Republicans of obstruction.

ETA: I confused this thread with another on the same topic. So when I referenced the OP, I was referring to the following thread:

https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...gun-control-natl-reciprocity.html#post7329035

 

[KellyinAvon]

I sent e-mails to our Senators and to 4th District Congressman Rokita. This was the reply from Rep Rokita:

December 4, 2017
​

Dear Mr. KellyinAvon,


Thank you for contacting me regarding the Second Amendment . It is good to hear from you.

As a gun owner and as a Member of Congress, I strongly oppose any legislation that prevents law-abiding Americans from responsibly exercising their God-given right to protect themselves, as manifested in the Second Amendment . I will always defend the rights of conscientious, patriotic, and responsible gun owners.

I continue to support responsible pro-gun legislation. You may be interested to know t hat I am a cosponsor of H.R. 38 . This legislation was introduced by Representative Richard Hudson of Nor th Carolina on January 3, 2017. H.R. 38 would allow any person with a valid concealed carry permit to carry a concealed firearm in any state that does not prohibit concealed carry. I believe we must protect Second Amendment rights and tra ditions for future generations. I appreciate your comments and will continue to fight to prot ect our constitutional rights.


Again, thank you for contacting me, and please stay in touch as I continue fighting for all Hoosiers so they can build better lives for themselves and their families.

Sincerely,

Todd Rokita
Member of Congress

 

[KellyinAvon]

From Bail-out Joe, I couldn't help but notice he didn't actually say he supports the legislation. "Friend" is a big assumption on his part.

December 4, 2017​

Dear Friend,
​

Thank you for taking the time to contact me regarding S. 446, the Constitutional Concealed Carry Reciprocity Act of 2017 . Like you, I believe this is an issue that deserves thoughtful consideration.
Whether a gun owner or not, we can all agree that we can take steps to reduce violent crime without sacrificing the Second Amendment rights of law-abiding citizens. I have always recognized that the overwhelming majority of gun owners exercise their Second Amendment rights in a responsible and law-abiding manner.
As you may know, all fifty states and the District of Columbia allow for individuals to carry concealed handguns if they meet certain criteria. Currently, laws related to concealed carry are enacted at the state level and vary between individual states. Indiana, in addition to issuing carry permits to Hoosiers and certain non-residents, recognizes all carry permits issued by other states. While many states also recognize Indiana permits, 18 states, including Illinois, do not honor carry permits issued by Indiana.
The Constitutional Concealed Carry Reciprocity Act was introduced in the Senate on February 27, 2017. If enacted into law, this bill would authorize an individual who is not prohibited by federal law from possessing a firearm and who is entitled by his or her state of residence to carry a concealed handgun to carry a concealed handgun in any state, provided he or she possesses a validly issued state permit, or, if from a state that does not require a separate permit, a government-issued photo ID. Authorized gun owners who do decide to carry across state lines, however, still would be required to adhere to the respective firearms laws of each state.
Supporters of this legislation argue that the current interstate reciprocity framework for carry permits can hinder their ability to lawfully carry a handgun across state lines while on business or recreational travel. Some opponents of the bill argue that the federal government should not make it easier for individuals to carry concealed handguns, while others argue that the states are in the best position to ensure the public safety of their citizens and should be allowed to choose which carry permits to honor.
The Constitutional Concealed Carry Reciprocity Act is currently pending before the Senate Judiciary Committee. Should this legislation come to the floor of the Senate for a vote, I will be sure to keep your thoughts in mind.

It is a privilege to represent you and all Hoosiers in the Senate. Your continued correspondence is welcome and helps me to better represent our state. I encourage you to write, call, or email if my office can ever be of assistance. You can also check out my Facebook page, follow me on Twitter , or visit my website . Please note when contacting my Senate office that I am only able to respond to questions or concerns related to official Senate business. As such, this letter addresses the issues you raised, which relate to my work in the United States Senate.
​

 

[JAL]

I disagree. The Dems will say the same thing you see in the OP. They will accuse the GOP of adding a "poison pill" by combining it with reciprocity. They will demand that the NICS fix be voted on separately and accuse Republicans of obstruction.

ETA: I confused this thread with another on the same topic. So when I referenced the OP, I was referring to the following thread:

https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...gun-control-natl-reciprocity.html#post7329035

Getting the two separated now requires an amendment, the likelihood of that passing currently being nil. If the Senate passes something that varies by so much as an inconsequential punctuation difference (i.e. an omitted comma somewhere) it requires a joint committee between the House and Senate to try to iron out the differences. If that fails, the bill dies. If there is some form of compromise, it has to go back to both chambers for votes again. If that fails in either chamber, it dies. There are nearly countless ways a bill can die in Congress, starting with the sub-committee where it originated, and only one in which it can pass: both House and Senate passing exactly the same thing with a quorum present during the session of Congress in which it was introduced (two years based on House election years). The current session runs until the new Congress is sworn in during January 2019 following the 2018 elections.

I anticipate there will be all manner of back room maneuvering in the Senate regarding who does and does not vote in favor of the combined House version on the Democrat side. It's not uncommon, so that those who would suffer most the soonest in reelection effort can vote against and those that would suffer least with reelection coming much later can vote for it. I wouldn't characterize it as a "poison pill". It's hard for me to imagine very many Republicans opposing the NICS legislation, if any at all, especially in the Senate. Without something like the "NICS Fix", National Carry Permit Reciprocity would fail in the Senate on its own as it would not have the 60 vote super majority it needs to pass. Combined with the NICS Fix, eight or so senators will take one for the Dem Team and vote for it to get it passed to get the NICS part of it for everyone who actually wants it while the rest can go home and claim they made a moral stand against everyone from somewhere else running amok in their states armed with concealed guns. The senators from Illinois and California will undoubtedly be among those voting against it. There's a lot of public posturing that goes on while deals get made in the cloak rooms.

Compare the speed with which this is proceeding compared to all the extreme gun control (i.e. gun ban) bills introduced in both houses by Dems after the Las Vegas shooting and pushed again after the Texas shooting.

John

 

[JAL]

But nics is still vounteary for the states to send thier info into, is it not? If so its still a faciliy of safety and an inftignment of 2a.

As I understand it, the voluntary part is whether or not a state chooses to establish a POC (point of contact) for the state to handle the 4473 background check with NICS versus going straight to the FBI for the FBI to conduct the NICS background check. Most states - over 2/3 - do not even have a partial state opereated POC. What the NICS legislation does is create greater incentive for states to submit the required information to NICS, NCIC, etc., compliance with which has been one of the major problems with NICS. There's no reason for Indiana to have a POC as there are no "permit" requirements to purchase or own any firearm. The only permit is a LTCH and you don't need one unless you're carrying one around in public.

The feds cannot "force" a state to submit the required information but they can make a state wish it had complied. States have sovereignty in that regard with very nearly everything. The exceptions are very, very few and they're very firmly constitutional. Typically the means to induce compliance is withholding federal funds for related grants and projects. An example was the requirement to enact 55 mph max speed limits followed by sufficient enforcement of them, as measured by average open Interstate speeds, or suffering loss of federal highway funds. California nearly lost massive amounts of federal highway funds on several occasions over inability to convince people to obey 55 mph speed limits on the Interstate highways. It got to a point where the CHP was driving patrol cars side by side at 55 mph to block all lanes, leading massive traffic jam parades and causing enormous freeway gridlocks when it backed up into major cities. The threat to cut off federal funds of various kinds to sanctuary cities and states is another example. If you want the kids to comply with some rules, threaten their allowance.

I'd have to read the bill to see what the increased inducements for NICS data submission requirements are.

John

 

[vangurley]

I sent my liberal (non) representative Visclosky a letter too but he’s anti 2nd Amendment. But we all must write or call our elected officials and try to get National Reciprocity passed

 

[2A_Tom]

I wrote another e mail to Petty.

Sir,


It is imperative that the NICS fix bill pass and be signed into law. There have been many criminal acts committed by peole who never should have had a firearm who passed NICS checks. Why? Because NICS is broken. The States and courts are not reporting to the proper authorities.


The NICS fix bill addresses theis, and, appropriates funds to accomplish it.


Please expidite this bill through the proper channels and get it to the President. Your constituents are dependinging on you. It would be a shame for one more Hoosier child to die at the hands of a maniac that should never have had a gun.


Thank you for your service.


The last sentence may be over kill but I couldn't resist.

 

[KLB]

I wrote another e mail to Petty.

Sir,


It is imperative that the NICS fix bill pass and be signed into law. There have been many criminal acts committed by peole who never should have had a firearm who passed NICS checks. Why? Because NICS is broken. The States and courts are not reporting to the proper authorities.


The NICS fix bill addresses theis, and, appropriates funds to accomplish it.


Please expidite this bill through the proper channels and get it to the President. Your constituents are dependinging on you. It would be a shame for one more Hoosier child to die at the hands of a maniac that should never have had a gun.


Thank you for your service.


The last sentence may be over kill but I couldn't resist.

I think you are misguided. That bill will stop little to nothing.

 

[Viper1973]

I think you are misguided. That bill will stop little to nothing.

You know that and I know that (It's safe to say all of us here know that)... However, the anti-gun folks think that ANY law they can get passed will cure cancer, solve world peace, and discover life on distant worlds.

Sometimes it's better to beat your opponent at their own game and use their emotions again them.

 

[87iroc]

I need to write our senators...but I suspect this will be a straight party line vote and some RINOs may bail due to the 'evil' that has happened lately.

 

[bulldogg]

Hound not need any permission or permit to carry if you are of age anywhere anytime....

 

[2A_Tom]

The point is that the NICS Fix bill is now linked to National Reciprosity.

Pete is anti gun and would never vote for NR but he may vote for the combined bill.

 

[jedi]

The point is that the NICS Fix bill is now linked to National Reciprosity.

Pete is anti gun and would never vote for NR but he may vote for the combined bill.

Nope he wont vote for it np matter what.
He is true anti-2a and has enough lemmings in indiana that will continue to vote for him.

 

[Viper1973]

Nope he wont vote for it np matter what.
He is true anti-2a and has enough lemmings in indiana that will continue to vote for him.

Bill just passed the House with 6 democrats defecting.

 

[Phase2]

For what it is worth, Alan Gottlieb (Second Amendment Foundation) says that the Senate can only come up with 58 votes in support of HR38 and it will be filibustered, while the Fix-NICS bill has more than enough votes to pass. Obviously he isn't happy with this, but given the circumstances, Gottlieb is working on four amendments to fix the worst parts of Fix-NICS. That way, reciprocity can get enough Democrat votes to actually pass and the worst Fix-NICS will do is get government agencies submit criminal data to NICS which they were supposed to do all along.

Podcast link (starting about: 43:10): http://media.blubrry.com/armed_american_radio/armedamericanradio.s3.amazonaws.com/12-03-2017_Hour_1.mp3

 

[jedi]

Bill just passed the House with 6 democrats defecting.

Did he vote no??

 

[brotherbill3]

For what it is worth, Alan Gottlieb (Second Amendment Foundation) says that the Senate can only come up with 58 votes in support of HR38 and it will be filibustered, while the Fix-NICS bill has more than enough votes to pass. Obviously he isn't happy with this, but given the circumstances, Gottlieb is working on four amendments to fix the worst parts of Fix-NICS. That way, reciprocity can get enough Democrat votes to actually pass and the worst Fix-NICS will do is get government agencies submit criminal data to NICS which they were supposed to do all along.

Podcast link (starting about: 43:10): http://media.blubrry.com/armed_amer...nradio.s3.amazonaws.com/12-03-2017_Hour_1.mp3

Since work and life has being going SWIMMINGLY (as I say that wearing CONCRETE SHOES) - and keeping me so busy
did the FIX-NICS junk bill get ammended to the house HR 38? I'm too far under to be tracking like I usually do. I barely got a single letter off w/ great generalizations.

Thanks.

 

[Phase2]

Since work and life has being going SWIMMINGLY (as I say that wearing CONCRETE SHOES) - and keeping me so busy
did the FIX-NICS junk bill get ammended to the house HR 38? I'm too far under to be tracking like I usually do. I barely got a single letter off w/ great generalizations.

Thanks.

My understanding is no. Apparently, that version just passed in the House. It is the Senate version where the big wrangling is happening.