Why war with Iran would spell disaster

[mrjarrell]

Here's a guy who's actually looking beyond the rhetoric and looking at the reality of what an attack on Iran would entail and do to us. If you think things would be just dandy if we attacked them, maybe a realistic look would change your mind. The entire region would explode and, if you think oil's high now, wait till it's a couple of hundred dollars a barrel. Even our chairman of the Joint Chiefs thinks it's a bad idea, as well as more than a few other military experts. Our economy would crash, given its current fragility and QE3. We need to think long and hard about this and quit listening to the people with no skin in the game.

Why war with Iran would spell disaster

 

[NYFelon]

Already, having gotten through only the first paragraph, there is a weak premise. The author states that we have been engaged in a "long and demoralising[sic - Canadian English is crap] war with two of the most impoverished countries in the world..." This simply isn't true. Does anyone believe, honestly believe that the US military couldn't have utterly steamrolled over either of these countries had we brought the full brunt of our capacity to bear? The issue isn't our war fighting capacity, it is our propensity to use the military as a police/peacekeeping/engineering force rather than for what it is. The military is the destructive arm of US Foreign policy. When diplomacy fails, the military serves the function of smashing the opposition. Hamstringing these forces with ridiculous ROE and forcing them to serve functions outside their area of expertise is the issue, not that they are incapable of completing their goals, provided those goals are consistent with their primary function. To wit: to kill people and break .

Mind you, I'm not one for war with Iran, but I must approach an article with so gaping a hole in it's opening paragraph with great big grains of salt. I'll now return to continue the rest of the article.

 

[NYFelon]

Despite what I see as a gaping hole in the opening paragraph, I find little to disagree with in the rest of the article.

 

[poptab]

Iran hasnt attacked anyone yet so how could war be justified. Even if they did attack the United States we started this **** to begin with by sanctioning them. They arent even close to a nuclear bomb yet and they are even farther from an effective delivery system.

I am sorry to be the bearer of bad news folks but we are the ones in the wrong here.

/flamesuit

 

[cobber]

This is the primary reason why our war with Iraq was so ill-considered. Iraq was a counterweight to Iran, on purely regional concerns with NO western overtones.

Had we not brought down Saddam, he would be the one working to undermine the Iranian nuclear program.

This aspect of W's foreign policy may very well have put us on a course where war with Iran, while a disaster, may be inevitable. (It may not be in our hands at this point.)



All of this being said, it strikes me that we're right back in a Cold War these days, with radical Islam. Including the usual domestic fellow-travellers in the media and university faculty.

Batten down the hatches.

 

[9mmfan]

The first paragraph is utter nonsense. If our military 'took the gloves off', they would make short work of the"8th largest military in the world".

The rest of the article does have some merit, but look at what has happened 'over there' during the last couple days. They all ready hate us. I don't believe that view would change even if we pulled all military presence out of the middle east and stopped supporting Israeli. Given little interference, I have no doubt Iran would develop nuclear weapons and would not be afraid to use them.
I don't claim to know the answer, but we cannot let Iran to continue unfettered.

 

[Denny347]

Sad thing is that the vast majority of Iran citizens actually LIKE the west. The Iran-Iraq war wiped out a huge portion of fighting aged men. More than half of Iran's 100 million population is under 35 years old. University aged kids defy religious leaders more and more. I think a war with Iran would be a bad bad thing. I strongly believe that the Iranian people will eventually fix their own problem.

Hope for Iran

 

[level.eleven]

Sad thing is that the vast majority of Iran citizens actually LIKE the west. The Iran-Iraq war wiped out a huge portion of fighting aged men. More than half of Iran's 100 million population is under 35 years old. University aged kids defy religious leaders more and more. I think a war with Iran would be a bad bad thing. I strongly believe that the Iranian people will eventually fix their own problem.

Hope for Iran

This is true. I believe the problem is self correcting. Hitchens calls it the baby-boomerang effect. The rub lies in the timeline of Hezbollah and the like. The groups who vow to use nuclear weapons as soon as they are acquired. Which comes first?

 

[Denny347]

This is true. I believe the problem is self correcting. Hitchens calls it the baby-boomerang effect. The rub lies in the timeline of Hezbollah and the like. The groups who vow to use nuclear weapons as soon as they are acquired. Which comes first?

I cannot fault the logic behind the effort to keep nukes out of their hands. I just cannot fathom a war as the answer.

 

[VN Vet]

Does anyone really want to live forever? If the crazy muslims will get X number of virgins for dying for their country can you guess what we Americans will get of us dieing for Our Country?

Just kidding. I am not ready to die either.

 

[phylodog]

I'd prefer we simply pull all of our troops home along with all of our equipment and employ the same strategy that Israel uses. Someone chucks a hand grenade over the fence at us, we return the favor with a 10K bomb. Drill for the oil we have under the land we already own. Place tariffs on imported goods coming from countries with human rights issues and slave labor. Let the rest of the world sort out their own problems, we have plenty to deal with here.

 

[2ADMNLOVER]

Drill for the oil we have under the land we already own. Place tariffs on imported goods coming from countries with human rights issues and slave labor. Let the rest of the world sort out their own problems, we have plenty to deal with here.

Are you serious ?

Are you actually suggesting a "common sense" approach to geopolitics that might be good for the average American citizen instead of rushing head long into some form of one world government ?

Do you really mean to say that we shouldn't be so imperialistic and export / force our form of democracy on folks around the world in order to gain control of their natural resources ?

But , but , if folks around the world don't like us through coercion / force
they won't buy our goods , services and exports .

My gawd man , what are you thinking ?

 

[phylodog]

LOL, I'm thinking that I'm fed up. It would be nice to have some leadership in this country which isn't for sale, isn't particularly interested in compromise and who makes decisions based on a simple choice between what is right and what is wrong.

 

[easy]

Iran hasnt attacked anyone yet so how could war be justified. Even if they did attack the United States we started this **** to begin with by sanctioning them.

You might wish to re-examine the starting point as being November 4, 1979. That was the day the US Embassy was stormed and diplomats and Marines taken as hostages.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Iran hasnt attacked anyone yet so how could war be justified. Even if they did attack the United States we started this **** to begin with by sanctioning them. They arent even close to a nuclear bomb yet and they are even farther from an effective delivery system.

I am sorry to be the bearer of bad news folks but we are the ones in the wrong here.

/flamesuit

You might wish to re-examine the starting point as being November 4, 1979. That was the day the US Embassy was stormed and diplomats and Marines taken as hostages.

I will start with a nod to easy's correct observation and move on to the fact that Iran has been a state sponsor of terrorism against us, Israel, non-moslem Lebanese, and certainly plenty of others which do not readily come to mind. The Iranian national mint was the leading producer of counterfeit UC currency until overtaken by their allies the DPRK, and further we have had open declarations made that Israel will be wiped off the map as soon as Iran has the capability (i.e., nuclear weapons). Given that the US and Israel play musical chairs for Iran's designated number one enemy depending on what mood the mullahs are in on any given day, it is no stretch whatsoever to take it as an article of faith that the nuclear threat applied equally to us.

It would appear that we are facing down a war in which we can't afford to engage and can't afford not to engage.

 

[miguel]

Every time someone predicts "it is going to be different" because we will be fighting "the Xth largest military" this time, I laugh. Maybe they will be right eventually and I will stop laughing, but I've been hearing about the "line of death" (Libya), the "mother of all battles" (Iraq I) and ther are "no Americans in Baghdad" (Iraq II) for 30+ years.

We would kick any standing force in that region into the dirt due to out air and intelligence superiority, but would admittedly and invariably blow it when we got to the nation building and trying to fight insurgents with two hands tied behind our backs part of the operation.

That said, I'm not wild about the idea of another conflict at this time unless it is with Mexico.

p.s. Was it wrong to attack Japan in 1941 since our sanctions "goaded" them into attacking Pearl?

 

[Armed-N-Ready]

Iran hasnt attacked anyone yet so how could war be justified. Even if they did attack the United States we started this **** to begin with by sanctioning them. They arent even close to a nuclear bomb yet and they are even farther from an effective delivery system.

I am sorry to be the bearer of bad news folks but we are the ones in the wrong here.

/flamesuit

Please enlighten us as to how you know this. You obviously omitted your CIA credentials from your profile. Iran has been a pimple on the world's ass since the late 70 s. Trust me I am in no hurry to go to war (I know the cost all too well) but if they get a nuke we have a real problem on our hands.

 

[Dead Duck]

Iran hasnt attacked anyone yet so how could war be justified.

You are one FUNNY guy.



It is not a matter of "IF" but more of "WHEN".

Pull out a world map and really look at it. Now check out which countries iran borders. Now where have our U.S. troops been hanging out for years now?

Ask a solider near you what the scuttlebutt has been. Regardless of what our public opinions are or which administration's in-charge, our U.S. military will do what needs to be done.

 

[thebishopp]

Sad thing is that the vast majority of Iran citizens actually LIKE the west. The Iran-Iraq war wiped out a huge portion of fighting aged men. More than half of Iran's 100 million population is under 35 years old. University aged kids defy religious leaders more and more. I think a war with Iran would be a bad bad thing. I strongly believe that the Iranian people will eventually fix their own problem.

Hope for Iran

I agree. Especially if we can refrain from trying to secretly overthrow their government again because the Brits were pissed about the oil.

CNN Transcript - CNN Insight: U.S. Comes Clean About The Coup In Iran - April 19, 2000

 

[thebishopp]

Every time someone predicts "it is going to be different" because we will be fighting "the Xth largest military" this time, I laugh. Maybe they will be right eventually and I will stop laughing, but I've been hearing about the "line of death" (Libya), the "mother of all battles" (Iraq I) and ther are "no Americans in Baghdad" (Iraq II) for 30+ years.

We would kick any standing force in that region into the dirt due to out air and intelligence superiority, but would admittedly and invariably blow it when we got to the nation building and trying to fight insurgents with two hands tied behind our backs part of the operation.

That said, I'm not wild about the idea of another conflict at this time unless it is with Mexico.

p.s. Was it wrong to attack Japan in 1941 since our sanctions "goaded" them into attacking Pearl?

How U.S. Economic Warfare Provoked Japan’s Attack on Pearl Harbor: Newsroom: The Independent Institute

One of many good articles about the "why's" of the attack on Pearl by Japan.

I personally think our economic sanctions and embargo were an act of "war". Definitely of "conflict" - heck we've gotten involved in "conflicts" for much less.

If I stood outside your business and prevented you from doing business with anyone I didn't personally approve of, and then even used force to enforce it (embargo), what would you do?