Train derailment in Ohio and chemical release

[Sigblitz]

NTSB report

RRD23MR005.aspx

www.ntsb.gov

 

[Cameramonkey]

BLEVEs are cool and scary as hell at the same time.

 

[jamil]

It's really tough to get vinyl chloride down to where it's not going to evaporate very quickly at atmospheric pressure. Once the cars were broken open and started depressurizing it would be about like a propane tank emptying. Boiling point is below the freezing point of water and vapor pressure is very high.

I still think they made the right call to burn it as fast as it was coming out. Waiting and getting a thermobaric ignition after it was allowed to pool probably would have flattened that town and killed a lot of people including the guys trying to stop the discharge.

After the crash there really were no good outcomes, only ones less bad.

So really, I guess, this being the case, the blame may not belong on the people who made that decision. But I think some blame belongs somewhere. I think if it's just a choice between which bad outcome was least bad, what's done is done. From there we look to why it happened, and also the response to it. So, Norfolk Southern deserves criticism. Biden administration deserves criticism.

 

[Leadeye]

Looks like they were worried about the vinyl chloride polymerizing, an exothermic reaction.

 

[Leadeye]

BLEVEs are cool and scary as hell at the same time.

Good pictures.

 

[Cameramonkey]

And the more I think about it, a BLEVE would only be the 2nd worst outcome. Even worse would be the vapors drifting out thousands and thousands of feet, eventually reaching the ideal ratio a spark igniting it.

 

[BugI02]

BLEVEs are cool and scary as hell at the same time.

Yeah, I saw video a few years back of one that threw about 1/3 of a tank car almost a quarter of a mile

 

[Leadeye]

So really, I guess, this being the case, the blame may not belong on the people who made that decision. But I think some blame belongs somewhere. I think if it's just a choice between which bad outcome was least bad, what's done is done. From there we look to why it happened, and also the response to it. So, Norfolk Southern deserves criticism. Biden administration deserves criticism.

I would agree there's blame to go around, mainly on whatever the conditions were that caused the derailment in the first place.

Years ago there was a magnesium fire in a scrap yard in Indianapolis which the fire department tried to put out with water, it's what they do. What they didn't know was that spraying water on burning magnesium causes an explosion. The local news had video of the firemen getting knocked down, getting back up, and putting water on the fire again only to be blown off thier feet again. The fire was finally extinguished by dumping sand on it. Not long after that the Indy fire department set up a Hazmat group and went around to all the chemical places in town to learn what was there and how to deal with it. The guys who visited my place of employment were all good listeners which made me think the program would do well.

 

[Leadeye]

You also have the toxic component to the vinyl chloride, while the products of burning it are bad, they are not as bad as the vinyl chloride itself. Hyrochloric (pool/concrete cleaner) acid causes most of the issues, burning eyes and respiratory passages. It also dramatically drops the PH of water killing aquatic life.

 

[funeralweb]

The press is being 'aggressive and inappropriate'.

What?
Oh, I see. They finally get QUESTIONS, and they're not used to it.

I think it's cool that Mayor Pete wore his Village People costume to East Pal.

 

[rhamersley]

Daggone, wish I knew how to photoshop…I can see Milley on the right, Liawatha next to Buttcheeks…….

 

[Magyars]

 

[R.C.]

I'm curious as to who the owner of the material is. Some corporation purchased this chemical either domestically or it is imported.
Depending upon incoterms, there may be some liability against that entity.

I believe, but could be wrong based on some technicality in the shipping agreement, that The responsible party is the NS Railroad. Not the owner of the materials being shipped. The railroad owns the tracks and is responsible for the crews and for meeting regulations and safety standards and schedules.

 

[COOPADUP]

I believe, but could be wrong based on some technicality in the shipping agreement, that The responsible party is the NS Railroad. Not the owner of the materials being shipped. The railroad owns the tracks and is responsible for the crews and for meeting regulations and safety standards and schedules.

Of course. We do not know the terms of purchase.

 

[jamil]

Are you a Chemist?

Are you?

 

[wagyu52]

 

[Magyars]

"What, me worry " Pete getting ready for his news conference

 

[pitbulld45]

This situation has made my group rethink about plan B more.

Our safe spot is near a railroad track. This incident has brought up a true need for plan B. This has made bug out bags and locations more needed for us than ever.

As for this incident, I think that if you are going to haul something, plane, train, automobile you should have a plan for containment, cleanup and recovery in place along with the resources to execute. If you cant then you shouldnt contract to haul said materials.

 

[Sigblitz]

I heard on the news that the car with the hot bearing was hauling plastic pellets.

 

[actaeon277]

A press secretary doesn't want to be in front of a camera.
What?