RK guns

[SheepDog4Life]

The RK management knee jerks a LOT. A former co worker transferred to ATF as an IOI. I asked him about what was up with RK. He said they are full of s*** on the locks needing to be there (specifically with the Terre Haute store)

As a part timer, I know an inside thing or two. The trigger locks on display guns are corporate policy, it's in the firearms desk handbook. Whether that's due to lawyers or liability insurance requirements, who knows, but it is REQUIRED by corporate policy,

they will not do a Brady Transfer

Correct, they will not. By policy they require a proceed to transfer a firearm.

and if they find a minor thing like a customer didn’t mark a gender block in the 4473 they fire every employee who was involved or did the transaction.

I call BS on this. Total BS.

The 4473 software requires all required fields to be entered or no bueno. No screen for the associate to enter the ID (usually DL) info. No NICS background check. No ability to print 4473

That alone doesn’t really allow one to learn the job very well.

Here was my experience... about 3 hours of standard new employee orientation, I9 stuff, anti-discrimination training, sexual harassment and hostile workplace training, etc.

Then 8 hours of training on firearm sales... 4473, NICS, firearms sale compliance, spotting straw purchases, etc. 8 hours required for all gun barn sales associates. Then, for two weeks, I worked with experienced guys before I was allowed to run the desk solo.

So if your former co-worker says he was fired from RK Gun sales for a 4473 without the gender box filled out... I call BS... on the 4473 gender box part, not the him being fired part.

 

[ECS686]

As a part timer, I know an inside thing or two. The trigger locks on display guns are corporate policy, it's in the firearms desk handbook. Whether that's due to lawyers or liability insurance requirements, who knows, but it is REQUIRED by corporate policy,


Correct, they will not. By policy they require a proceed to transfer a firearm.



I call BS on this. Total BS.

The 4473 software requires all required fields to be entered or no bueno. No screen for the associate to enter the ID (usually DL) info. No NICS background check. No ability to print 4473


Here was my experience... about 3 hours of standard new employee orientation, I9 stuff, anti-discrimination training, sexual harassment and hostile workplace training, etc.

Then 8 hours of training on firearm sales... 4473, NICS, firearms sale compliance, spotting straw purchases, etc. 8 hours required for all gun barn sales associates. Then, for two weeks, I worked with experienced guys before I was allowed to run the desk solo.

So if your former co-worker says he was fired from RK Gun sales for a 4473 without the gender box filled out... I call BS... on the 4473 gender box part, not the him being fired part.

On the locks yeah no doubt it was corporate just the one store particular (haven’t been in a gun section in others) I was in the staff had a couple conversations with how the locks were a legal and ATF thing.

For the “firing” friend stated he has seen a couple 3 get fired in the spot in front of him. Could there have been other straws and that was it maybe just happened more than once so the optics were what they were (which why would you not handle it away from outsiders not cool on RK management)

And as far as everything else I’m just going off what a trusted former co worker that is now in ATF passed along. As well as my own experience in another state where I got a small sample at large corporate gun stuff from Vance and point blank and they can have that BS headache after headache.

I work for a stand alone owns place now as a retired gig and much better!

 

[Destro]

As a part timer, I know an inside thing or two.

My local RK won't allow me to use my UPIN. Claims company policy & federal law doesn't allow to sell to people with UPINs because they are "prohibited".

Real policy or BS?

 

[Farmerjon]

My local RK won't allow me to use my UPIN. Claims company policy & federal law doesn't allow to sell to people with UPINs because they are "prohibited".

Real policy or BS?

If you don't mind, what is a UPIN?

 

[Destro]

If you don't mind, what is a UPIN?

This is a decent explanation

 

[gglass]

My experience so far consists of purchasing a new firearm on 9/26, and calling on 10/4 to see when they expect to ship the gun. I was told that the shipment was scheduled for 10/8 (a Saturday, hmmm) to expect a call from the local store a couple days after they receive it. I really don't expect to hear anything before the middle of October. This is an awfully long time to wait to save just a few bucks on any firearm.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

As a part timer, I know an inside thing or two. The trigger locks on display guns are corporate policy, it's in the firearms desk handbook. Whether that's due to lawyers or liability insurance requirements, who knows, but it is REQUIRED by corporate policy,


Correct, they will not. By policy they require a proceed to transfer a firearm.



I call BS on this. Total BS.

The 4473 software requires all required fields to be entered or no bueno. No screen for the associate to enter the ID (usually DL) info. No NICS background check. No ability to print 4473


Here was my experience... about 3 hours of standard new employee orientation, I9 stuff, anti-discrimination training, sexual harassment and hostile workplace training, etc.

Then 8 hours of training on firearm sales... 4473, NICS, firearms sale compliance, spotting straw purchases, etc. 8 hours required for all gun barn sales associates. Then, for two weeks, I worked with experienced guys before I was allowed to run the desk solo.

So if your former co-worker says he was fired from RK Gun sales for a 4473 without the gender box filled out... I call BS... on the 4473 gender box part, not the him being fired part.

Quick question if you don't mind, is it corporate policy or local store decision to leave a firearm on display/for sale if it's not payed for or on a layaway if there is a delay on the 4473? And what happens if it's sold before the proceed comes in? Can they substitute a different gun of the same make/model/etc when they get the proceed or does the customer have to start the whole process over?

My local RK won't allow me to use my UPIN. Claims company policy & federal law doesn't allow to sell to people with UPINs because they are "prohibited".

Real policy or BS?

Does your local RK use a computer for the 4473 or paper? If computer like my local the question comes up and they have no problem that I know of if someone uses one. Someone asked what it was/where they could find theirs when filling out the form and the answer they got was if you don't know you don't have one, leave it blank.

 

[SheepDog4Life]

I've bought a couple from the local RK, wait seemed to be generally in line with any other place. A few minutes extra for the manager to come by and verify the numbers.

The manager verifies the serial number(s), the DL/ID info and the NICS info and transaction number all match what's on the 4473. My LGSs do the same thing, a second set of eyes to make sure there are no mistakes for the ATF to ding.

My biggest issue is that if they run the 4473 and it comes back delayed, if you haven't purchased or put a down payment on it they will leave it on the floor and someone else can buy it while you're waiting for the proceed. Don't know if that is corporate wide or just my local (Monticello).

Yes, if the NICS comes back delayed, RK will not hold the gun without putting it on layaway. It's RK policy. I've worked there part time fo about a year and a half, and at first I also thought that was crappy. But you would be amazed at the number of people who just plain "ghost". Never come back. Even if they put 10% for the layaway... and just plain never come back. Even after calling them that their background check came back. Even after calling them multiple times that their 60 day layaway period has expired and they need to come in.

And that with some skin in the game, 10% down.

And in the meantime, there are literally shelves of guns that we cannot sell.

My local RK won't allow me to use my UPIN. Claims company policy & federal law doesn't allow to sell to people with UPINs because they are "prohibited".

Real policy or BS?

BS! We are REQUIRED by policy to enter the UPIN into the NICS... there's a reason you have the UPIN, unneeded extended delays or incorrect denials. In fact we had a reminder of this posted at our store recently. UPINs are not common... kinda rare, and someone got into autopilot and didn't enter a customer's UPIN into NICS.

Just calmly ask for the store manager... and if somehow the store manager is also clueless, ask them to call Corp compliance or check the firearms sales handbook.

 

[SheepDog4Life]

Quick question if you don't mind, is it corporate policy or local store decision to leave a firearm on display/for sale if it's not payed for or on a layaway if there is a delay on the 4473? And what happens if it's sold before the proceed comes in? Can they substitute a different gun of the same make/model/etc when they get the proceed or does the customer have to start the whole process over?

Corporate policy. The gun is either for sale or it's on layaway... there is no it's "on hold". Catching up with posts, my other post above has more detail.

If it's on layaway and the proceed comes in and you get to the store within the 30 days that the background check is vaild... that gun is in the back, held for you with the store part of the layaway slip with your name on it... finish paying, we transfer it out of store inventory, print the 4473, manager reviews and your on your way.

If it's not on layaway and THAT S/N gun gets sold before the proceed and you make it back into the store, then the process starts all over... from the beginning. The first part of the process is typing in the S/N or S/N's if purchasing more than one firearm and those cannot be changed. (there are reasons for compliance) That's why after you type your "code" into the terminal, the sales associate should show you the S/N(s) on the box or the firearm(s) and ask you to verify that they match.

Also, in my year and a half, I've had exactly one customer who came back after the proceed without a layaway. The rest just never come back.

 

[SheepDog4Life]

On the locks yeah no doubt it was corporate just the one store particular (haven’t been in a gun section in others) I was in the staff had a couple conversations with how the locks were a legal and ATF thing.

The only law I know of is that a firearms store MUST sell safes or locks for customers to safely store firearms. If they don't, say bye to your license.

Justice Department Announces New Rule to Help Enhance Safe and Secure Storage of Firearms; Publishes Best Practices Guide for Federal Firearms Licensees

The Department of Justice today announced a new rule to help enable the safe and secure storage of firearms and published a Best Practices Guide for federal firearms licensees (FFLs). This new rule implements the existing Gun Control Act requirement that federal firearms licensees that sell...

www.justice.gov

For the “firing” friend stated he has seen a couple 3 get fired in the spot in front of him. Could there have been other straws and that was it maybe just happened more than once so the optics were what they were (which why would you not handle it away from outsiders not cool on RK management)

In front of him, during a 4473 audit is different than in front of the whole store... so that might be the case... or not.

Speculation, but if the same associate and manager (who double checks everything) were responsible for multiple violations during an audit, firing them right now might be the only thing that saves the store's license... maybe.

And as far as everything else I’m just going off what a trusted former co worker that is now in ATF passed along. As well as my own experience in another state where I got a small sample at large corporate gun stuff from Vance and point blank and they can have that BS headache after headache.

For most of my career, my day job has been corporate IT (non-firearm), so I get it. Sometimes, what looks like BS has a reason... other times, it what it looks like, lol!

With 101 ways to get it wrong, and only one way to get it right, there will be a lot of controls, not always well designed and thought out.

I work for a stand alone owns place now as a retired gig and much better!

My dream when I retire... part time at a small LGS for spending (i.e. gun) money.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

The manager verifies the serial number(s), the DL/ID info and the NICS info and transaction number all match what's on the 4473. My LGSs do the same thing, a second set of eyes to make sure there are no mistakes for the ATF to ding.

Yeah I understand that. And had no problem with it, just mentioned it.

Yes, if the NICS comes back delayed, RK will not hold the gun without putting it on layaway. It's RK policy. I've worked there part time fo about a year and a half, and at first I also thought that was crappy. But you would be amazed at the number of people who just plain "ghost". Never come back. Even if they put 10% for the layaway... and just plain never come back. Even after calling them that their background check came back. Even after calling them multiple times that their 60 day layaway period has expired and they need to come in.

And that with some skin in the game, 10% down.

And in the meantime, there are literally shelves of guns that we cannot sell.

Had a delay at a gun store and when I got the call I went in to pick it up and pay, they had it in the back room. But I can understand leaving it out, but it would have been nice to have been informed of it. That was my only real problem with it. They asked if I wanted to put it on layaway and I said no, when I went in the guy asked if it was on layaway when I told him no, he said well hope it hasn't sold. If I would have known I would have put it on layaway.

 

[Ingomike]

Had a delay at a gun store and when I got the call I went in to pick it up and pay, they had it in the back room. But I can understand leaving it out, but it would have been nice to have been informed of it. That was my only real problem with it. They asked if I wanted to put it on layaway and I said no, when I went in the guy asked if it was on layaway when I told him no, he said well hope it hasn't sold. If I would have known I would have put it on layaway.

Is it possible that many LGS have a better clientele than RK? That many here are known to the staff at the LGS and they don’t put them through the hoops a RK corporate policy requires?

 

[Timjoebillybob]

Is it possible that many LGS have a better clientele than RK? That many here are known to the staff at the LGS and they don’t put them through the hoops a RK corporate policy requires?

Could be, but the shop was in NWI and they didn't know me from Adam. I've got no problem with RKs policy and understand why, only problem I have was not being informed of it. And it wasn't really putting me through any hoops, none of the process.

 

[SheepDog4Life]

Could be, but the shop was in NWI and they didn't know me from Adam. I've got no problem with RKs policy and understand why, only problem I have was not being informed of it. And it wasn't really putting me through any hoops, none of the process.

Yes, communication is important... at least my store manager and the senior guys I trained with stressed to let the customer know on delays that if they don't put the gun on layaway, it's still for sale. And if someone else buys it, the process starts all over. Doubly so if it is the display gun, because that means it's the last one of that model/color/configuration in stock... and if it sells (or gets put on layaway), then we're out of stock.

And I've done the layaway before, both as a customer and as an employee, just because the desk was really busy... then stopped by another time when I could just walk right up and start my 4473.

 

[blue2golf]

Bought my first RK gun last Sunday. Ruger LC9s with Williams fiber optic sights. An aside: looks like Ruger discontinued them at some point when I wasn't paying attention, various sites show them on clearance and have dropped the price so it was time to buy.

Local RK had them marked at $369. I literally bought the last one in the store. Very easy process, maybe 30 minutes from start to finish. They handed me the box and said, "thank you." No escort to the door. (West side RK in Evansville)

Finally got a chance to shoot it yesterday. About 50 rounds all brass case, some HP some ball. Not a single jam, mostly hit within a hand span at 10 feet. Bought a couple new mags from shopRuger . com, they performed well.

Hi-viz sight superlative in the sun. My aging eyes really appreciated it.