Quit telling me a vote for a third party is a vote for Obama

[jamil]

The republican party is catering to the independants and moderates and further abandoning libertarian principles. They're still entitled to my vote though, right?

Huh? Further abandoning? You do know the history of the Party of Lincoln, right? Moderates have controlled the Republican party off and on for much of its history. Every now and then some faction gains more numbers and it goes in that direction. Being a fiscally conservative, socially moderate independent, I find myself voting for Republicans more often Democrats. I'm glad to see the neo-cons losing control, and the more libertarian folks gaining, but let's not get too crazy with it.

And, no one's "entitled" to your vote. You vote for who you want. People here are only stating the consequences.

 

[jamil]

Not going to read through all the posts. I've heard it all before. To the OP, when people tell me that a thrid party vote is a wasted vote, I just tell them that their vote for the "chosen" candidate is the wasted vote. I leave it at that. You can't force the blind to see and none are more blind than those who will not open their eyes.

Has it occurred to anyone that a different point of view from yours can be reached while fully sighted? I look at the purist position, I look at the pragmatic position, I choose pragmatic. I've done the purist thing years ago. I'm over it.

 

[churchmouse]

Is carter to blame for the terrible economy of the 70's? I'm pretty sure that has been asserted here. If the wounds were healing by 76 and carter didn't step until January 77, I'm not sure how he was responsible.

I work at a factory that was hit very heavily by this last recession. We've had over 5000 employees in the past and less than 1000 in the first part of 2009. There were several layoff I missed by the skin of my teeth and recently spent 2 years explaining to my young daughter why I was never home during the evenings because I had the choice of nightshift or unemployment. I had sporadic 1-6 week layoffs. there was one point that my employer was literally within 48 hours of closing their doors.

You're right. I have a silver spoon in my mouth and no real world experience to base my opinion on.

Missed a date....my bad....I stand corrected. I am apparently no historian.

Again, I said nothing about silver spoons and the like or your real world experiences. You seem to go off in directions of your own making just like this.
If you want to fix all this then do something positive. The system is broken. That is a given. I have suffered more than I have shared in these threads myself. I work my but off doing any number of things to keep my train on the rails. I should be retiring but that is not going to happen now due to all this mess. Vote as you see fit, I am not directing you in any direction. We are sharing our thoughts and opinions.

Edit...Politics suck. Makes you want to fight.

 

[mydoghasfleas]

Yeah, when I was 26 I thought the sky was falling too. Difference now is, it really is falling.

It was falling then and the mediocre actions that were taken have resulted in an even bigger repeat of history. So a mediocre action now will result in your children dealing with an even bigger problem.

When we simply cut the weeds back they come back stronger and thicker every year.

When are we going to get smart and start to cut them down?

 

[blamecharles]

It was falling then and the mediocre actions that were taken have resulted in an even bigger repeat of history. So a mediocre action now will result in your children dealing with an even bigger problem.

When we simply cut the weeds back they come back stronger and thicker every year.

When are we going to get smart and start to cut them down?

I saw a quote somewhere recently about 99 people chopping at the branches of a tree and 1 chopping at the root.

 

[cqcn88]

I respect your position but I just have a different approach and I have no problem posting my own personal voting strategy. Where I differ is as i've stated before about this lesser of two evils thing.

Sure I could choose the easy way out and vote for the perfect candidate that totally represents my views, that's a no brainer.

What I do have a problem with is reconciling that choice when in the end it still results in the candidate who I feel is the greater of two evils and is the absolute farthest away from my "perfect choice" getting elected.

If I can't get my perfect choice nominated then i'm still gonna do whatever I can to see that the candidate furthest from representing my views does not get elected.

That does not mean I will totally abandon any future efforts and stop trying to get the candidate that best represents my views the nomination.

Saying that voting your mind is the "easy way out" is a little condescending no?

It's not the easy way out, it's not really a question of which is the easy way out. I have a different MO than you. Your one and only purpose in this election is to unseat BO. My goal is to be part of the catalyst that God willing will someday facilitate change. "There is no third party candidate that has the momentum to be a viable option," well yeah, not yet. You're making the wrong comparison in voting strategy. I never made any claims to whether or not you were right or wrong for voting for Romney, I don't really care who you vote for, I just get fed up with people self righteously telling me that my vote for a third party is a waste of time and ultimately nothing more than a vote for Obama.

 

[Fletch]

People who vote for third parties that have "no chance of winning" are simply defining different victory conditions.

 

[netsecurity]

Its not voting for Obama, but it is helping him if you are a conservative and you shoot your wad in the dirt. If you're a liberal then I sure hope you vote third party, but I wouldn't expect it of you. But I do expect conservatives to have more sense than to vote based on emotion instead of practicality. Sorry, I can't forgive you for being so stubborn in making your point, but I do respect your choice.

 

[hornadylnl]

Its not voting for Obama, but it is helping him if you are a conservative and you shoot your wad in the dirt. If you're a liberal then I sure hope you vote third party, but I wouldn't expect it of you. But I do expect conservatives to have more sense than to vote based on feelings instead of practicality. Sorry, I can't forgive you for being stubborn, but I do respect your choice.

By today's definition of "conservative", I'm not conservative.

 

[mrjarrell]

Its not voting for Obama, but it is helping him if you are a conservative and you shoot your wad in the dirt. If you're a liberal then I sure hope you vote third party, but I wouldn't expect it of you. But I do expect conservatives to have more sense than to vote based on feelings instead of practicality. Sorry, I can't forgive you for being stubborn, but I do respect your choice.

So, in netsec world there are only two types of people? "Liberals" and "conservatives"? Reality says something much different than you would have us believe. I'm neither of those choices and know plenty of other people who aren't either of them. I don't vote for "conservatives" or "liberals". Both of them want to run other peoples lives and enslave them to their agenda. I'll have none of that.

 

[netsecurity]

By today's definition of "conservative", I'm not conservative.

Conservative does not mean Republican. Technically, I'd say only Libertarians and Tea Party are real conservatives. I know what you're saying though. Republicans have moved too far to the left.

 

[netsecurity]

So, in netsec world there are only two types of people? "Liberals" and "conservatives"? Reality says something much different than you would have us believe. I'm neither of those choices and know plenty of other people who aren't either of them. I don't vote for "conservatives" or "liberals". Both of them want to run other peoples lives and enslave them to their agenda. I'll have none of that.

I'm not getting into another argument over this junk. I respect your views. Maybe it will turn out that you were right. Only time will tell.

 

[cqcn88]

Its not voting for Obama, but it is helping him if you are a conservative and you shoot your wad in the dirt. If you're a liberal then I sure hope you vote third party, but I wouldn't expect it of you. But I do expect conservatives to have more sense than to vote based on emotion instead of practicality. Sorry, I can't forgive you for being so stubborn in making your point, but I do respect your choice.

I get your point, but it goes back to what hornady has been saying. The R party tries to lump all conservatives into the same basket and that's not the case. The republicans are not entitled my vote merely because I believe in the 2A. You're operating under the assumption my convictions are just like yours therefore it makes no sense for me to vote for anyone but Romney. The evidence, the fact I'm not voting for Romney, dictates otherwise. My priorities are different and it's silly for the republican party to lump my in that basket. Raising false hopes, the truth hurts it seems.

 

[hornadylnl]

Conservative does not mean Republican. Technically, I'd say only Libertarians and Tea Party are real conservatives. I know what you're saying though. Republicans have moved too far to the left.

First, we must determine what the definition of "conservative" is. It has become so bastardized like "liberal" that neither one of them have meaning any more. Today, the republican party is pretty much as diametrically opposed to libertarian principles as the democrat party.

 

[mrjarrell]

Conservative does not mean Republican. Technically, I'd say only Libertarians and Tea Party are real conservatives. I know what you're saying though. Republicans have moved too far to the left.

Libertarians are not "conservatives", by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[jeremy]

Yawn...

 

[Classic Liberal]

Conservative does not mean Republican. Technically, I'd say only Libertarians and Tea Party are real conservatives. I know what you're saying though. Republicans have moved too far to the left.

Tea Party is too broad of a term when you have the likes of Sarah Palin jumping on the band wagon. So, I would disagree that the Tea Party is conservative.

 

[mrjarrell]

Tea Party is too broad of a term when you have the likes of Sarah Palin jumping on the band wagon. So, I would disagree that the Tea Party is conservative.

Its roots certainly weren't. They were pretty solidly libertarian.

 

[Phil502]

Has it occurred to anyone that a different point of view from yours can be reached while fully sighted? I look at the purist position, I look at the pragmatic position, I choose pragmatic. I've done the purist thing years ago. I'm over it.

That sums it up pretty good. Third party voting will need to be continued for a long long time to make any impact, hopefully it will but I don't think it really will, I'll hope I'm wrong.

Hasn't third party voting been going on for a long time already, is there a noticeable impact yet?

People that say on here that it doesn't effect the outcome going third party, really, you would vote for Obama or are you teaching the Republicans a lesson?

 

[jamil]

It was falling then and the mediocre actions that were taken have resulted in an even bigger repeat of history. So a mediocre action now will result in your children dealing with an even bigger problem.

When we simply cut the weeds back they come back stronger and thicker every year.

When are we going to get smart and start to cut them down?

No, when I was 26 the sky wasn't falling...maybe a few cracks though. Nothing some moderate action in the right direction wouldn't have fixed.

Then and now I think a balanced budget amendment would do much to solve some issues.