Big box lie

[femurphy77]

True dat. But the point is, he said it was the law..........never mind.

That was just his "Get out and save what little face I have left" statement. Dude knew he was outgunned in the subject matter knowledge department and rather than "Lose" the "argument" with you his last remark translated to "oh yeah?" as he turned to walk away from you. Corporate automaton spewing drivel, you shouldn't go into a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.

Of course, it is kind of fun sometimes, isn't it??

 

[Titanium Man]

I agree. I went to the "peckers" in Bloomington. They had a killer deal on 10/22's with a coupon. I have my FFL and they refused to do a dealer to dealer transaction. The guy looked at me like I had a third eye. He insisted on my filling out a 4473. I refused and they lost a sale.

This Big Box store is limited in what it can do by store policy, and the problem with selling firearms in multiple states. I'm sure one of the things they could care less in doing, is taking care of another dealer. In fact, I'm positive. Just as I'm sure they will charge you sales tax even though you are probably exempt. PLUS, I'm sure they are not going to let you use your spifs you've built up to buy something obviously below cost with a transfer via dealer to dealer. The bottom line is, if it's in their comfort zone of doing things via their loss prevention people, it'll get sold. Otherwise, nadda. Their not in the business to make you money, just them. That's why you have to work them the best you can, with the system they have in place, via ads, specials, close-outs and scorecard bonuses.

In regards to the people behind the counter. What can you expect for $8.50/hour.

 

[Libertarian01]

To All,

What I am about to post I believe is legally accurate. I presume a lawyer or someone w/ a law degree will correct me if I am wrong.

As I understand it after taking a business law class I think that IF push came to shove in an Indiana court this policy would fail.

Anytime you enter into the purchase or sale OF ANYTHING contract law kicks in. There are four (4) basic requirements to a contract being enforceable:

#1) Mutual Assent - this is usually manifested by an offer and an acceptance. This means that anytime something is put out in a retail store for sale they are OFFERING to sell it to you. You then ACCEPT the offer.

#2) Consideration - Each party must exchange a legal benefit. Basically, this means that one (1) party is normally selling an item and/or service and the other party is paying with money. Something of value must be exchanged.

#3) Capacity - This generally means mental competence by both parties. Someone who is drunk beyond the pale cannot be held to a contract they entered into while drunk. Someone who is mentally ill may be shown to be incompetent and thus not be bound to a contract.

#4) Legality of Object - Basically, all parts of the exchange must be LEGAL. The item/service sold must be legal along with the payment method.

If those four (4) requirements are met then you have a legally binding contract that could be enforced in a court of law.

The seller does not have the legal ability to demand how the buyer is legal. The seller only has the power and responsibility to demand that the buyer IS legal. So, the seller cannot require you to jump through more hoops than are legally required to make the transaction legal. Also, the seller cannot legally deny a sale unless he/she can prove that one (1) of the four (4) requirements has not been met.

In this particular situation a person with no criminal background residing in the state of Ohio could come into this retail store, see a firearm they want to buy, be denied sale due to their state of residence, go to an Indiana court, sue the store forcing them to honor their offer, and get a judge to compel the store to sell to him/her...

And therein lies the problem: almost never will anyone jump through those hoops just to buy something. Even if they did a judge may find against them, but the judge could also find for them. So, without a guarantee of victory how many people do you know would want to spend several monthes of time, spend thousands of $$$ in legal fees, just to wind up w/ a maybe victory for something they could just drive back to their home-state to purchase??? Almost no one, including me!

The only reason I make the post is to drive home the point that the store cannot legally do what it is doing! I am more than willing to concede that we will certainly never find a citizen w/ deep enough pockets and burr up their butt large enough to push the issue, and so the store will continue to get away w/ its policy until Mr. Wealthyburr decides to push the issue in a court of law. Until then, the store wins.

On a side note this is often why I find myself cheering for the guy suing over a little thing! Because without some of these noisy, loudmouthed "troublemakers" screaming about some seemingly petty detail we could all be worn down just because our pockets aren't deep enough to fight most fights and it can be good for all of us when some little guy somewhere stands up and says, "Enough" to some insignificant (as I perceive it) thing.

Regards,

Doug

 

[Bigum1969]

As a general rule, I avoid Cock's.

 

[IDCC]

I have seen the sign saying no out of state sales for the R-15 and R-25 in the store in bloomington. Bunch of BS!

 

[CarmelHP]

Remember, Dick's is based in Pennsylvania. Often the chain will use the laws of its home state in other states.*

*See Kirk's First Law of the Internet

Don't think so, I hold a PA attorney license and know of no such provision.

 

[308jake]

It's store policy on any long guns, not just R-25s. If you don't like the policy, then don't shop there. Remember the employee doesn't give a rats ass if you shop there or not. They probably prefer you don't.

 

[Redemption]

It's store policy on any long guns, not just R-25s. If you don't like the policy, then don't shop there. Remember the employee doesn't give a rats ass if you shop there or not. They probably prefer you don't.

Not this^^^^

Employees or shareholders need not reply.

 

[ThrottleJockey]

I agree with the OP about standing up against ignorance and stupidity posing as "it's the law". That peon probably couldn't even get the move over or slow down for emergency vehicles thing right. When an individual or corporation infringes upon my rights maliciously or falsely claiming it's the law, I too will stand up and correct them. Sometimes when you complain/educate the right person (this usually takes a lot of phone time) you do make a difference and sometimes you even get rewarded for it.

 

[a.bentonab]

We will call it Cock's sporting goods.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

but seriously I love their rewards program.

What about those elements that make the R-15 and similar guns illegal in certain states? I'm assuming the R-15 comes with a 30 round magazine, so it would be illegal in CA right? Or at least there are certain states where it would be illegal. Would Cock's not catch flack for selling a gun to a person who lives where it is illegal? Don't quote me on just the magazine capacity but I'm sure there are states where pistol grip, etc are illegal.

Would there not be legal ramifications? And even if not, I guess Cock's doesn't want to be the next gun dealer that MSNBC looks at in the next "Where do illegal guns come from" expose.

 

[SemperFiUSMC]

To All,

What I am about to post I believe is legally accurate. I presume a lawyer or someone w/ a law degree will correct me if I am wrong.

As I understand it after taking a business law class I think that IF push came to shove in an Indiana court this policy would fail.

Anytime you enter into the purchase or sale OF ANYTHING contract law kicks in. There are four (4) basic requirements to a contract being enforceable:

#1) Mutual Assent - this is usually manifested by an offer and an acceptance. This means that anytime something is put out in a retail store for sale they are OFFERING to sell it to you. You then ACCEPT the offer.

#2) Consideration - Each party must exchange a legal benefit. Basically, this means that one (1) party is normally selling an item and/or service and the other party is paying with money. Something of value must be exchanged.

#3) Capacity - This generally means mental competence by both parties. Someone who is drunk beyond the pale cannot be held to a contract they entered into while drunk. Someone who is mentally ill may be shown to be incompetent and thus not be bound to a contract.

#4) Legality of Object - Basically, all parts of the exchange must be LEGAL. The item/service sold must be legal along with the payment method.

If those four (4) requirements are met then you have a legally binding contract that could be enforced in a court of law.

The seller does not have the legal ability to demand how the buyer is legal. The seller only has the power and responsibility to demand that the buyer IS legal. So, the seller cannot require you to jump through more hoops than are legally required to make the transaction legal. Also, the seller cannot legally deny a sale unless he/she can prove that one (1) of the four (4) requirements has not been met.

In this particular situation a person with no criminal background residing in the state of Ohio could come into this retail store, see a firearm they want to buy, be denied sale due to their state of residence, go to an Indiana court, sue the store forcing them to honor their offer, and get a judge to compel the store to sell to him/her...

And therein lies the problem: almost never will anyone jump through those hoops just to buy something. Even if they did a judge may find against them, but the judge could also find for them. So, without a guarantee of victory how many people do you know would want to spend several monthes of time, spend thousands of $$$ in legal fees, just to wind up w/ a maybe victory for something they could just drive back to their home-state to purchase??? Almost no one, including me!

The only reason I make the post is to drive home the point that the store cannot legally do what it is doing! I am more than willing to concede that we will certainly never find a citizen w/ deep enough pockets and burr up their butt large enough to push the issue, and so the store will continue to get away w/ its policy until Mr. Wealthyburr decides to push the issue in a court of law. Until then, the store wins.

On a side note this is often why I find myself cheering for the guy suing over a little thing! Because without some of these noisy, loudmouthed "troublemakers" screaming about some seemingly petty detail we could all be worn down just because our pockets aren't deep enough to fight most fights and it can be good for all of us when some little guy somewhere stands up and says, "Enough" to some insignificant (as I perceive it) thing.

Regards,

Doug

Wrong. You are not compelled by any law to do business with anyone. You are forbidden from refusing to do business with certain protected classes of people for specific categories of goods. If you refuse service to a protected class, the burden is on the buyer to prove illegal discrimination.

The store has an absolute right to refuse to engage in business with anyone they choose. You may in fact refuse to sell a firearm to anyone for any reason. I can decide you look like a suicide bomb toting hajji and refuse to sell to you on those or any other grounds. There is absolutely nothing you can do about it other than walk down the street and hope you have better luck at the next store.

I like when the little guy sues over something stupid too. Especially when his case was frivilous. The company just eats the legal fees, right? Wrong. They raise prices and I get to pay for the lunacy of the gadfly.

 

[femurphy77]

Wrong. You are not compelled by any law to do business with anyone. You are forbidden from refusing to do business with certain protected classes of people for specific categories of goods. If you refuse service to a protected class, the burden is on the buyer to prove illegal discrimination.

The store has an absolute right to refuse to engage in business with anyone they choose. You may in fact refuse to sell a firearm to anyone for any reason. I can decide you look like a suicide bomb toting hajji and refuse to sell to you on those or any other grounds. There is absolutely nothing you can do about it other than walk down the street and hope you have better luck at the next store.

I like when the little guy sues over something stupid too. Especially when his case was frivilous. The company just eats the legal fees, right? Wrong. They raise prices and I get to pay for the lunacy of the gadfly.

As exemplified by #1-Mutual assent- I'm not going to buy it from you because you are a __________. Or, I'm not going to sell it to you because you are a __________.

Thanks for 'splainin' it further semperfi

 

[CarmelHP]

#1) Mutual Assent - this is usually manifested by an offer and an acceptance. This means that anytime something is put out in a retail store for sale they are OFFERING to sell it to you. You then ACCEPT the offer.

No, not actually in retail situations, placing items up for sale is an invitation to an offer, which the seller then accepts or rejects depending on whether you have met the conditions of the seller's acceptance.

 

[MerKWorK]

Doesn't ruffle my feathers...I can't find myself shopping at an outdoorsy walmart anyhow, they put themselves outta business at least in that department and a great gun shop will open up in the wake!

 

[dross]

I think I have heard more misinformation from the other side of gun sales counters than anywhere else - except of course, from my father-in-law.

 

[cosermann]

Just to pile on Dick's: My daughter was heading to the mall on Black Friday, so I had her take a Dick's coupon for that day, "buy one box of ammo, get a second 50% off." Told my daughter what I wanted and that it should be $18-19 per box. She called later, "dad, they want $30 a box." I said forget it. Strolled through the same store over lunch the following Monday - the price was back to $18.99 per box. Rip off artists.

 

[slars1327]

As long as there is a corporation involved , many rules and policies will not match law. The corp leagal beagles will make rules ( policy) based on what they THINK is law and or LAW from the state the corp is registered. They really don't want dealer to dealer or any bad publicity for the evil guns etc. They want simple , quick , popular choices put in front of its customers and want them to pay and leave. The idea that a clerk in a local store will know the difference between policy , law and political corectness is an expectation we should all realize is alnost non existant in today's market place. Hell how many of us have been in a local shop and have a clerk or even the owner give an answer to a question that is neither law nor even remotely correct.