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Asking Real Questions for Real Answers! Is there a Path Forward?
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The Peter Principle and the Iron Law of Oligarchy are in effect in D.C.
The Congress is like a Bureaucracy in that it's primary purpose is it's own continuation and growth in power. The most efficient way to do this is to keep the same members who all know their first loyalty is to the continuation of the institution.
The Law of Oligarchy is why Trump was so hated.
The Congress is like a Bureaucracy in that it's primary purpose is it's own continuation and growth in power. The most efficient way to do this is to keep the same members who all know their first loyalty is to the continuation of the institution.
The Law of Oligarchy is why Trump was so hated.
This seems an excellent place relay what Dabney said:
“[Conservatism] never conserves anything.
“Its history has been that it demurs to each aggression of the progressive party, and aims to save its credit by a respectable amount of growling, but always acquiesces at last in the innovation.
“What was the resisted novelty of yesterday is today one of the accepted principles of conservatism; it is now conservative only in affecting to resist the next innovation, which will tomorrow be forced upon its timidity and will be succeeded by some third revolution; to be denounced and then adopted in its turn.
“American conservatism is merely the shadow that follows Radicalism as it moves forward towards perdition. It remains behind it, but never retards it, and always advances near its leader. This pretended salt hath utterly lost its savor: wherewith shall it be salted? Its impotency is not hard, indeed, to explain. It is worthless because it is the conservatism of expediency only, and not of sturdy principle. It intends to risk nothing serious for the sake of the truth, and has no idea of being guilty of the folly of martyrdom. It always when about to enter a protest very blandly informs the wild beast whose path it essays to stop, that its ‘bark is worse than its bite,’ and that it only means to save its manners by enacting its decent role of resistance: The only practical purpose which it now subserves in American politics is to give enough exercise to Radicalism to keep it “in wind,” and to prevent its becoming pursy and lazy, from having nothing to whip.”
Robert Lewis Dabney - 1897
“[Conservatism] never conserves anything.
“Its history has been that it demurs to each aggression of the progressive party, and aims to save its credit by a respectable amount of growling, but always acquiesces at last in the innovation.
“What was the resisted novelty of yesterday is today one of the accepted principles of conservatism; it is now conservative only in affecting to resist the next innovation, which will tomorrow be forced upon its timidity and will be succeeded by some third revolution; to be denounced and then adopted in its turn.
“American conservatism is merely the shadow that follows Radicalism as it moves forward towards perdition. It remains behind it, but never retards it, and always advances near its leader. This pretended salt hath utterly lost its savor: wherewith shall it be salted? Its impotency is not hard, indeed, to explain. It is worthless because it is the conservatism of expediency only, and not of sturdy principle. It intends to risk nothing serious for the sake of the truth, and has no idea of being guilty of the folly of martyrdom. It always when about to enter a protest very blandly informs the wild beast whose path it essays to stop, that its ‘bark is worse than its bite,’ and that it only means to save its manners by enacting its decent role of resistance: The only practical purpose which it now subserves in American politics is to give enough exercise to Radicalism to keep it “in wind,” and to prevent its becoming pursy and lazy, from having nothing to whip.”
Robert Lewis Dabney - 1897
Here is a recent article that illustrates Dabney's points in action today:
www.lewrockwell.com
Conserving Nothing - LewRockwell
“[Conservatism] never conserves anything. “Its history has been that it demurs to each aggression of the progressive party, and aims to save its credit by a respectable amount of growling, but always acquiesces at last in the innovation. “What was the resisted novelty of yesterday is today one...
www.lewrockwell.com
1897 and dead on target even after 125 years.1897
Kirk Freeman
Grandmaster
Really, not even Mike Lee or Nikki Haley?
Could be a big market for those mittens once Comrade Joe kills fracking .
I will admit that I don't follow politics or politicians closely. Maybe they are great but my confidence in our government doing the right thing is gone. I do believe many have gone to DC with good intentions but it seems like they throw in the towel and accept the "if you can't beat em, join em" and they become another cog in the wheel.
This is the Peter Principle and the Iron Law of Oligarchy.
We could fix most if the problems in this country with a single constitutional amendment: those that receive any government benefit lose their right to vote in the next election.
And any organization that relies on the money from the treasury, should not allow to kick back part of it to the parties or people holding or seeking office. How can planned parenthood received hundreds of millions from the government then kick back tens of millions to Democrats? Or the example I have cited dozens of times of the teacher's and other public employee unions. It is so corrupt.
When and if he does something of substance (trying to cancel Trump with EO's doesnt count) then maybe something other than Bernies mittens will be argued about!
I would propose one more: the entire federal code must sunset after a specified time. No more permanent laws. If they are that important, they can pass them again. It would also help to keep them preoccupied with "important stuff" rather than all the feel good b.s. they seem to get wound around the axles over now.
Find me a politician to support these two things and I would probably get behind them.
Twangbanger
Grandmaster
- Oct 9, 2010
- 7,100
- 113
You asked for real answers, so I will give you real answers.
For my entire life, I've been told we _must_ vote for what I call PBRs, or "Prayer Breakfast Republicans," because they are our only chance to win. (This is my name for moderate Republicans, who use religious virtue signaling - Republicans do it too - and social issues to advance economic policies which are injurious to average people).
I suspect (and hope) this thread was motivated, because the PBRs (which I identify as people like Fozo and Expat - but am willing to let you try to persuade me otherwise), don't like living under leaders like Biden. And they have now reached a terrifying realization in the wake of the Georgia Senate races (which I devoted an entire thread to, for this very reason). And that is: the GOP cannot win without the support of Trumpers.
So this means the PBRs must now either accept living under perpetual Democrat rule, or undertake the task of reaching out to people like "us," and accept that our policy views have value and need to be incorporated in the GOP platform going forward. If it was just to start wheedling us and tugging our sleeves and pleading with us, in hopes of getting us ready to come back "into the fold" and start voting for "Prayer Breakfast Republicans" like John McCain again, then I see this as pointless.
The answer is that I am not prepared at this point to name which Republicans I might "pledge support" to. It is too early. We are not even finished impeaching the last Republican President, and not all the Republicans who may be requesting our vote in 2022 and 2024 have even announced their position on that yet.
I believe the statement has been attributed to Malcolm X that a "ballot is a bullet." You only get to use it once. If you don't see anyone worth using it on...you keep in in your pocket.
That is how I feel at this point. Bullets are, literally and figuratively, quite valuable right now. I am going to be very sparing in how I use my bullets going forward. I don't want to bend in the direction of the PBRs. I want _them_ to bend in our direction.
The principles which I feel are so important, that Republicans must unite around them or risk "losing the country," are as follows.
1. Obviously, the Second Amendment.
2. An emphasis on reducing corporate welfare, whether it be in the form of favorable tax breaks, trade deals with countries which enable profits but don't share our ideals, or the innumerable other forms of rent-seeking policy.
3. We must re-gain traction for the idea that all civilized nations must exercise control over the quantity and type of humans crossing their borders and obtaining citizenship. The good of the current citizens, not compassion for the rest of the world, must be the value at the core of government policy. At the time the Statue of Liberty was erected, the population of America from sea-to-sea, was comparable to what California has right now. We've increased population 5x since then. We are full. We cannot provide for what we have. America accepts more refugees than other nations combined. America is not and cannot be a Bottomless Cat Shelter for Needy Humans.
4. Fiscal responsibility also must also involve government policy toward individuals - because I don't see any hope of scaling back the fiscal excesses of government, if the people won't vote for it, and they won't vote for it, if they are dependent on it themselves. Therefore, I believe that simultaneously with ending corporate welfare, we need to minimize the use of generationally-sustained handout programs that sap the initiative and ambition of individuals, and decrease their collective interest in fiscal responsibility as a general concept.
5. Government should not have its ability to spy on its citizens increased, in the name of law enforcement, domestic security, or anything else. If this means some attacks go unstopped, that's part of the risk-mitigation equation I'm prepared to accept. Freedom is supposed to be dangerous. Total safety is never free.
6 Defense is a core function of government, but our current Intelligence apparatus works to maintain itself via constant obsession with unnecessary foreign entanglements. Our Intelligence establishment has become a threat to the individual freedom of American citizens. It should have its power reduced by cutting its funding. I am a supporter of a strong national defense, but it needs to be right-sized. I am willing to negotiate on this point, but the present situation cannot be allowed to expand. National Defense is supposed to provide for security from external enemies, but in reality has just become a perpetual "jobs program."
If I believe a given Republican candidate is not sufficiently aligned with the above points, I will not vote for them. Even if it allows the Democrat to win. Even if it allows Democrats to run the country into the ground. Because as I see it, electing Republicans who compromise with these points is slow-motion death to these principles by other means.
I think if people like Fozo and Expat get sick enough of living under Democrat policies, they will either be forced to admit "our" positions have merit and need to be adopted, or they will go down the drain with us and live under Democrat rule.
I am prepared for either case.
I gave a thoughtful, non-single-sentence potshot answer, so I trust those who engage me (if any), will invest the courtesy of following suit.
(Foszoe iPhone version: More guns, less handouts to corporations/individuals, downsizing immigration, right-sizing defense/intelligence/foreign entanglement).
For my entire life, I've been told we _must_ vote for what I call PBRs, or "Prayer Breakfast Republicans," because they are our only chance to win. (This is my name for moderate Republicans, who use religious virtue signaling - Republicans do it too - and social issues to advance economic policies which are injurious to average people).
I suspect (and hope) this thread was motivated, because the PBRs (which I identify as people like Fozo and Expat - but am willing to let you try to persuade me otherwise), don't like living under leaders like Biden. And they have now reached a terrifying realization in the wake of the Georgia Senate races (which I devoted an entire thread to, for this very reason). And that is: the GOP cannot win without the support of Trumpers.
So this means the PBRs must now either accept living under perpetual Democrat rule, or undertake the task of reaching out to people like "us," and accept that our policy views have value and need to be incorporated in the GOP platform going forward. If it was just to start wheedling us and tugging our sleeves and pleading with us, in hopes of getting us ready to come back "into the fold" and start voting for "Prayer Breakfast Republicans" like John McCain again, then I see this as pointless.
The answer is that I am not prepared at this point to name which Republicans I might "pledge support" to. It is too early. We are not even finished impeaching the last Republican President, and not all the Republicans who may be requesting our vote in 2022 and 2024 have even announced their position on that yet.
I believe the statement has been attributed to Malcolm X that a "ballot is a bullet." You only get to use it once. If you don't see anyone worth using it on...you keep in in your pocket.
That is how I feel at this point. Bullets are, literally and figuratively, quite valuable right now. I am going to be very sparing in how I use my bullets going forward. I don't want to bend in the direction of the PBRs. I want _them_ to bend in our direction.
The principles which I feel are so important, that Republicans must unite around them or risk "losing the country," are as follows.
1. Obviously, the Second Amendment.
2. An emphasis on reducing corporate welfare, whether it be in the form of favorable tax breaks, trade deals with countries which enable profits but don't share our ideals, or the innumerable other forms of rent-seeking policy.
3. We must re-gain traction for the idea that all civilized nations must exercise control over the quantity and type of humans crossing their borders and obtaining citizenship. The good of the current citizens, not compassion for the rest of the world, must be the value at the core of government policy. At the time the Statue of Liberty was erected, the population of America from sea-to-sea, was comparable to what California has right now. We've increased population 5x since then. We are full. We cannot provide for what we have. America accepts more refugees than other nations combined. America is not and cannot be a Bottomless Cat Shelter for Needy Humans.
4. Fiscal responsibility also must also involve government policy toward individuals - because I don't see any hope of scaling back the fiscal excesses of government, if the people won't vote for it, and they won't vote for it, if they are dependent on it themselves. Therefore, I believe that simultaneously with ending corporate welfare, we need to minimize the use of generationally-sustained handout programs that sap the initiative and ambition of individuals, and decrease their collective interest in fiscal responsibility as a general concept.
5. Government should not have its ability to spy on its citizens increased, in the name of law enforcement, domestic security, or anything else. If this means some attacks go unstopped, that's part of the risk-mitigation equation I'm prepared to accept. Freedom is supposed to be dangerous. Total safety is never free.
6 Defense is a core function of government, but our current Intelligence apparatus works to maintain itself via constant obsession with unnecessary foreign entanglements. Our Intelligence establishment has become a threat to the individual freedom of American citizens. It should have its power reduced by cutting its funding. I am a supporter of a strong national defense, but it needs to be right-sized. I am willing to negotiate on this point, but the present situation cannot be allowed to expand. National Defense is supposed to provide for security from external enemies, but in reality has just become a perpetual "jobs program."
If I believe a given Republican candidate is not sufficiently aligned with the above points, I will not vote for them. Even if it allows the Democrat to win. Even if it allows Democrats to run the country into the ground. Because as I see it, electing Republicans who compromise with these points is slow-motion death to these principles by other means.
I think if people like Fozo and Expat get sick enough of living under Democrat policies, they will either be forced to admit "our" positions have merit and need to be adopted, or they will go down the drain with us and live under Democrat rule.
I am prepared for either case.
I gave a thoughtful, non-single-sentence potshot answer, so I trust those who engage me (if any), will invest the courtesy of following suit.
(Foszoe iPhone version: More guns, less handouts to corporations/individuals, downsizing immigration, right-sizing defense/intelligence/foreign entanglement).
Last edited:
I don't know how I got thrown in there. I voted for Trump both times. I just didn't like the willingness of the party to spend like drunken sailors under him just like they did under Bush. I didn't like McCain or Romney. But, yes, I did vote for them in the general because, no, I am not willing to just the Dems win because I am throwing a temper tantrum.
JeepHammer
SHOOTER
RINO: Republican In Name Only.
It was used as an insult by the completely bought & paid for, career political party members and politicians.
The problem with 'Extremists' is when there is a line *YOU* won't cross, there are dozens willing to run across it,
Then *YOU* are 'The Enemy', not extreme enough, therefore not a 'True Believer'.
Big business will always move to run government, BELIEVEING they can do it better.
It's greed motivated, workers die, workers don't need money/a life, they need to do more WORK to make them richer, more powerful.
Religious extremists are the same way,
Always wanting to exert more control, gain more power over the population.
Strictly a wealth & power ego trip.
This was the reason the US government was built & designed to limit the power of big business, religion, ect.
With checks & balances to limit power.
Right 'Wing', Left 'Wing' congress members, all bought & paid for politicians that spend an average of 32 years in seats of power, that keep voting THEMSELVES more money, more powers, more immunity.
It's entirely up to you if you study the Constitution, read an actual education in the Constitution by the framers of that Constitution, these documents still exist.
It's also up to you if you participate in the extremists PROPAGANDA campaigns,
These will always wrap themselves in the flag (claiming 'Patriotism', carrying a Bible, spouting 2nd amendment rights, and trying to sway you under false flags),
The end result is always more power & wealth secured at the top with the financers of this propaganda.
(Follow the money, find the motive)
The absolute genius of the Constitution is "We The People" can change it with a 2/3 majority, grass roots movement.
By dividing "We The People" there will never be a 2/3 majority for things like Term Limits for congress, for example...
Power & wealth retained for decades with the same people continuing to make decisions that damage the working class/middle America.
Divisionism works quite well, particularly when there is a well financed, well organized opposition stepping in to fill any power vacuum between divisions.
This democratic republic can only commit suicide, which we are seeing big steps towards right now...
It was used as an insult by the completely bought & paid for, career political party members and politicians.
The problem with 'Extremists' is when there is a line *YOU* won't cross, there are dozens willing to run across it,
Then *YOU* are 'The Enemy', not extreme enough, therefore not a 'True Believer'.
Big business will always move to run government, BELIEVEING they can do it better.
It's greed motivated, workers die, workers don't need money/a life, they need to do more WORK to make them richer, more powerful.
Religious extremists are the same way,
Always wanting to exert more control, gain more power over the population.
Strictly a wealth & power ego trip.
This was the reason the US government was built & designed to limit the power of big business, religion, ect.
With checks & balances to limit power.
Right 'Wing', Left 'Wing' congress members, all bought & paid for politicians that spend an average of 32 years in seats of power, that keep voting THEMSELVES more money, more powers, more immunity.
It's entirely up to you if you study the Constitution, read an actual education in the Constitution by the framers of that Constitution, these documents still exist.
It's also up to you if you participate in the extremists PROPAGANDA campaigns,
These will always wrap themselves in the flag (claiming 'Patriotism', carrying a Bible, spouting 2nd amendment rights, and trying to sway you under false flags),
The end result is always more power & wealth secured at the top with the financers of this propaganda.
(Follow the money, find the motive)
The absolute genius of the Constitution is "We The People" can change it with a 2/3 majority, grass roots movement.
By dividing "We The People" there will never be a 2/3 majority for things like Term Limits for congress, for example...
Power & wealth retained for decades with the same people continuing to make decisions that damage the working class/middle America.
Divisionism works quite well, particularly when there is a well financed, well organized opposition stepping in to fill any power vacuum between divisions.
This democratic republic can only commit suicide, which we are seeing big steps towards right now...
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