Democrats want to Legalize Marijuana

[BugI02]

I don't think a case can be made that someone is addicted to anything based on one instance of use. I wholeheartedly agree that the left will never stop coming for our RKBA. My point was that if MJ was legalized like alcohol it would be dropped from the controlled substance list altogether. Alcohol is a drug but it isn't one of the scheduled narcotics.

But the text doesn't say that. I copied the actual text from the 4473 and listed it before I speculated on how it might change. It absolutely says:

"Are you an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana or any depressant, stimulant, narcotic drug, or any other controlled substance?"

Alcohol is a depressant, and an OMVI would make you an 'unlawful user' and that is necessary and sufficient - it is either/or as far as the 'addicted to'

Arguably, an OMVI would also make you an 'unlawful user' of marijuana even if it were legalized

Addiction is established by exhibiting tolerance and withdrawal

 

[DoggyDaddy]

But the text doesn't say that. I copied the actual text from the 4473 and listed it before I speculated on how it might change. It absolutely says:

"Are you an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana or any depressant, stimulant, narcotic drug, or any other controlled substance?"

Alcohol is a depressant, and an OMVI would make you an 'unlawful user' and that is necessary and sufficient - it is either/or as far as the 'addicted to'

Arguably, an OMVI would also make you an 'unlawful user' of marijuana even if it were legalized

Addiction is established by exhibiting tolerance and withdrawal

Being an alcoholic would also make one "addicted to" alcohol, would it not? So any alcoholic, whether or not they've ever broken the law, would be lying on the 4473 if they answered in the negative.

 

[The Bubba Effect]

You either support kicking a man's door to dictate his flower garden or you do not.

I do not.

 

[BugI02]

Being an alcoholic would also make one "addicted to" alcohol, would it not? So any alcoholic, whether or not they've ever broken the law, would be lying on the 4473 if they answered in the negative.

If you know any (current, not recovered) alcoholics, how many would you expect would admit they have a problem

I would not expect weedaholics to be any different

 

[DoggyDaddy]

If you know any (current, not recovered) alcoholics, how many would you expect would admit they have a problem

I would not expect weedaholics to be any different

Go to an AA or NA meeting sometime. No such thing as a "recovered" alcoholic or addict. Recovering yes, recovered, no. You can't turn a pickle back into a cucumber. So whether in active addiction (still drinking or using) or not, they're still addicted, and thus lying if they answer in the negative to that question on the 4473.

 

[Leadeye]

Well if they legalize MJ they should legalize home distillation.

 

[Ziggidy]

Go to an AA meeting sometime. No such thing as a "recovered" alcoholic. Recovering yes, recovered, no. You can't turn a pickle back into a cucumber. So whether in active addiction (still drinking) or not, they're still addicted, and thus lying if they answer in the negative to that question on the 4473.

Alcohol is not included in the question on the 4473. They end the question with "and any other controlled substance". Alcohol is not in the same category as a controlled substance. They specifically mention mj and include it with the "controlled" substances.

 

[fullmetaljesus]

Why does freedom and liberty so often seem to come up in the context the desire to get high

And why is the FF's caution that only a moral people are fit to govern themselves so seldom mentioned. If morality is mentioned at all, it is usually to denigrate any moral standards that might be applied as deficient for some reason

In these contexts, it seems more Cartman's "I do what I want!" than any definition of freedom or liberty that the fathers would recognize

Tell me something. No facts, no figures, none of that nerd crap.

Do you think we as humans should have more of fewer freedoms?

No grey, just black and white your personal feelings more or fewer?

 

[DoggyDaddy]

Alcohol is not included in the question on the 4473. They end the question with "and any other controlled substance". Alcohol is not in the same category as a controlled substance. They specifically mention mj and include it with the "controlled" substances.

They include "depressants". Alcohol is a CNS depressant, as Bug already pointed out.

From Bug's quote:
"Are you an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana or any depressant, stimulant, narcotic drug, or any other controlled substance?"

 

[phylodog]

But the text doesn't say that. I copied the actual text from the 4473 and listed it before I speculated on how it might change. It absolutely says:

"Are you an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana or any depressant, stimulant, narcotic drug, or any other controlled substance?"

Alcohol is a depressant, and an OMVI would make you an 'unlawful user' and that is necessary and sufficient - it is either/or as far as the 'addicted to'

Arguably, an OMVI would also make you an 'unlawful user' of marijuana even if it were legalized

Addiction is established by exhibiting tolerance and withdrawal

I don't believe it would be interpreted as you say there. Driving drunk doesn't label you an unlawful user of alcohol, there is no such verbiage in the law. If you want to get that broad with the brush every one of us who drinks coffee every day has lied on their 4473 since caffeine is a stimulant. I'd only expect the words "marijuana or" to be dropped from the question if it were legalized on the federal level.

 

[Ziggidy]

My only concern with the socialists wanting to legalize pot is how they will use it as a trap. The ATF has info on gun purchases now. I cannot imagine what they would give to be able to use that to trap gun owners. All of a sudden a "contact high" can be criminally charged against someone.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

Gotta have your coffee in the morning to stave off headaches? You're a caffeine (stimulant) addict. Lying if you answer in the negative on that question on the 4473.

Go ahead... give me all your "but, but, buts", but it's true.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

I don't believe it would be interpreted as you say there. Driving drunk doesn't label you an unlawful user of alcohol, there is no such verbiage in the law. If you want to get that broad with the brush every one of us who drinks coffee every day has lied on their 4473 since caffeine is a stimulant. I'd only expect the words "marijuana or" to be dropped from the question if it were legalized on the federal level.

Okay, now this is just creepy. BBI is already in my head and now you? There's not that much room in there!! Quit it!

 

[Ingomike]

If you know any (current, not recovered) alcoholics, how many would you expect would admit they have a problem

I would not expect weedaholics to be any different

The 10% exists…

 

[Ziggidy]

They include "depressants". Alcohol is a CNS depressant, as Bug already pointed out.

From Bug's quote:
"Are you an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana or any depressant, stimulant, narcotic drug, or any other controlled substance?"

What isn't a CNS stimulant? Pornography is a CNS stimulant.

We need to be real here.

 

[phylodog]

My only concern with the socialists wanting to legalize pot is how they will use it as a trap. The ATF has info on gun purchases now. I cannot imagine what they would give to be able to use that to trap gun owners. All of a sudden a "contact high" can be criminally charged against someone.

I think you might be surprised to find what a federal prosecutor is and is not willing to file charges on. If the ATF or any federal agency wanted to hunt down gun owners who have smoked a joint they'd have more work than they could ever hope to get done in the 18 states where cannabis is legal.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

What isn't a CNS stimulant? Pornography is a CNS stimulant.

We need to be real here.

I'm trying to be real. If taken to its logical conclusion, there would be a lot of otherwise lawful gun purchasers (via a 4473) that have lied when it comes to that question. And I think you know as well as I do that they're referring to drugs and chemicals when they are talking about depressants and stimulants. Otherwise you wouldn't be able to exercise (dopamine stimulates your CNS), go zip-lining (adrenaline is a CNS stimulant), etc.. Let's not carry this to an even higher level of absurdity than it already has been.

 

[Ziggidy]

I think you might be surprised to find what a federal prosecutor is and is not willing to file charges on. If the ATF or any federal agency wanted to hunt down gun owners who have smoked a joint they'd have more work than they could ever hope to get done in the 18 states where cannabis is legal.

You are correct, but times are changing. Who would have thought we'd have a senile old man for president, a VP who "worked" her way up, anti-americans in congress, a trangender as Health secretary and so much more.

Federal prosecutors will do what they are told. The ATF will do what they're told.
Make examples of those who lied on the form and the process begins; all because of a joint.

 

[fullmetaljesus]

What isn't a CNS stimulant? Pornography is a CNS stimulant.

We need to be real here.

Wait watching porn means we can't fill out the form honestly? Oh **** I might be in trouble here....

 

[Ziggidy]

I'm trying to be real. If taken to its logical conclusion, there would be a lot of otherwise lawful gun purchasers (via a 4473) that have lied when it comes to that question. And I think you know as well as I do that they're referring to drugs and chemicals when they are talking about depressants and stimulants. Otherwise you wouldn't be able to exercise (dopamine stimulates your CNS), go zip-lining (adrenaline is a CNS stimulant), etc.. Let's not carry this to an even higher level of absurdity than it already has been.

Then we need to leave alcohol out of the equation. The absurdity was including items not in the question.