when do I legally have to show I.D. / LTCH when a cop requests it?

[Fargo]

I disagree with your interpretation of this code. I see nothing in it that gives LE the right to stop you for carrying and demand to see your license.

As I said before, it doesn't explicitly give them that right. Rather it gives them the right to ARREST YOU, INCARCERATE YOU, AND PROSECUTE YOU for illegally carrying a handgun. They can do so right up until you decide to produce your license.

Read the IC Code that Bill posted. The section I posted deals with using your license as an affirmative defense against arrest/prosecution under the section Bill posted.

Best,

Joe

 

[E5RANGER375]

I will pull out my Blackberry, turn on my voice recorder, inform the officer that he/she is being audio recorded, then I will proceed to refuse to show them my I.D. unless they can tell me what crime or infraction I have committed.

please dont tell them they are being recorded because by law you are not required to in Indiana.

Just let it roll. if ANYONE knows they are being recorded then they will DEFFINATLY do and say things differently.

Thats one of the funny things about when i watch the show cops. some get pretty rough on there and they know the camera is running, imagine what they'd do to the suspects if it wasnt in some cases. Get the RAW nitty gritty man!! dont give up your ace in the hole.

 

[E5RANGER375]

Its funny, when i open carry (basicly all the time) i see more grown men staring at me with what looks like fear rather than women. the men always pretend they arent looking and try to be sly about it, but the women point and think its "neat" mostly, lol. I am a 90% of the time an OC'er, and I personaly have only had MAYBE a handfull of negative experiences in all of the years I've OC'd, so if your OC'ing and constantly getting harrassed maybe you need to think of what you may be doing wrong???? I personaly just keep my head on a swivel and act normal, just like i would if i werent carrying (well actualy i dont know what its like to not carry unless i have to be in a government facility, and then i feel naked and probly act a little paranoid, lol.)just thought id throw that out there.

 

[bglaze]

...if your OC'ing and constantly getting harrassed maybe you need to think of what you may be doing wrong????

Oh, I've never been harassed by a cop. In fact, I have OCed directly in front of numerous cops in the year and a half that I've been OCing, and they didn't give me the time of day.

However, as I begin to venture into other cities (Indianapolis, etc...) where they may be a bit more liberal than up here in Madison county, I assume I will eventually get stopped, and I want to be prepared.

Out of the 30+ interactions with people I have had concerning my sidearm over the past year and a half, only 1 of them has been negative in nature, and that one turned positive in the end. So, I'd say I'm 100% so far in positive interactions.

 

[j706]

Ah the world according to e5ranger375!! I guess I can feel comforted. Sheeeezzz I guess I might just start open carrying so men will be afraid of me. Holy cow..some people!! Where do some of these people come from?

And for what it is worth, I could care less if I am being recorded. If an a-- chewing is warranted than a a-- chewing it is. Don't like it and get offended,call the chief and file an complaint. In the event that your complaint is deemed BS like 98% are,guess who gets criminally charged?. Being recorded don't change squat.

 

[E5RANGER375]

Oh, I've never been harassed by a cop. In fact, I have OCed directly in front of numerous cops in the year and a half that I've been OCing, and they didn't give me the time of day.

However, as I begin to venture into other cities (Indianapolis, etc...) where they may be a bit more liberal than up here in Madison county, I assume I will eventually get stopped, and I want to be prepared.

Out of the 30+ interactions with people I have had concerning my sidearm over the past year and a half, only 1 of them has been negative in nature, and that one turned positive in the end. So, I'd say I'm 100% so far in positive interactions.

yeah i didnt mean for that to come across as directed towards you about OC'ing improperly. i was just making a general statement. I live in Indy, and have had very good experiences with all of the IMPD police around here (as far as i can remember) the county boys have been alittle rude before (before the merge), but now they dont exist in that form anymore. While profiling may be frowned upon by some people, i think that its a very smart thing for LEO's and military to do, because 8 times out of 10, the profiling indicators are right, if you apply them ALL, to the profile. thankfully i just happen to not fit them, lol.

 

[E5RANGER375]

Ah the world according to e5ranger375!! I guess I can feel comforted. Sheeeezzz I guess I might just start open carrying so men will be afraid of me. Holy cow..some people!! Where do some of these people come from?

And for what it is worth, I could care less if I am being recorded. If an a-- chewing is warranted than a a-- chewing it is. Don't like it and get offended,call the chief and file an complaint. In the event that your complaint is deemed BS like 98% are,guess who gets criminally charged?. Being recorded don't change squat.

if you think i carry to instill fear, then you totaly missed my point. I actualy try to avoid giving a negative apearance when i OC, i am very concience of what i wear and how i present myself. Also, my "word" is just my opinion, and just like butt holes, everyone has one, so you can ignore it for all i care, its not legal advice, its just the way i feel. j706, if you think i dont like all cops your wrong, but i still believe in protecting myself and my rights. same as you wear a VEST, surely you dont think that ALL citizens will try and shoot you, but you have it just in case. thats the point of a tape recorder, just in case. i dont file frivilous complaints against police, because i know they have a tough job, but if I do file one then you can be sure it was justified and not done as payback. That being said, i hope i dont have to file one. I dont want confrontation, especialy since most of the time i go out in public, i have my family with me.

 

[bglaze]

Being recorded don't change squat.

Actually, the reason I plan on recording any interactions I have with police that confront me for OCing isn't for legal reasons.

The reason I plan on getting a recording is for informational purposes for any and all Indiana OCers who are interested.

I plan on making these recordings public on this forum, youtube, etc... This way OCers know a little better what they are getting themselves into and can be better prepared.

I am not trying to intimidate officers by having the recording device. And I am not planning on using it as a threat. It would obviously be nice to have just in case the cop becomes a total tool-bag and truly does abuse his power. However, this is not at all my primary purpose for recording these interactions.

 

[bglaze]

I guess I might just start open carrying so men will be afraid of me. Holy cow..some people!! Where do some of these people come from?

I could just as easily say, "I guess I'll become a cop so that men can be afraid of me."

Are you telling me that there aren't cops who chose their profession because they have a lust for power and control?

Just like some gun owners may choose to OC because they want to look bad-ass and powerful, so there are people who become cops just to feel bad-ass and powerful. It goes both ways.

Comments like yours are what put people on the defensive concerning police. Cops have a very scary job, and I respect their service deeply. However, they exist to protect and to serve ME, the law abiding, honest, hard-working citizen. They do not exist to deprive me of my rights, harass me, discriminate against me, give me an "a-- chewing" because they don't like that I carry OC, etc...

 

[$mooth]

I guess I'll piggy back my question on this one. (and apologies for the thread jack)

I carry an IWB (oc if my shirt is tucked in) around the 4-5 o'clock position. Right above my wallet. If a LEO asks to see my license, is there a good way to pull out my waller? I'm guessing that turning sideways and slow movements would not get me shot/tackled.

 

[IMPD31323]

"I carry an IWB (oc if my shirt is tucked in) around the 4-5 o'clock position. Right above my wallet. If a LEO asks to see my license, is there a good way to pull out my waller? I'm guessing that turning sideways and slow movements would not get me shot/tackled.

If you are talking to an leo ensure prior to making any movements that you explain to the leo that you are armed and where its located. That will definately help the leo understand that you are a legal lay abiding responsible firearm owner.

By the way, i act the same on camera as off. That being said, you recording our meeting will definately not make me happy and more than likely help me make my decision on wether or not to use descresion on any infractions i may have observed.

Your atitude will definately influence how i handle our interaction.

 

[j706]

I could just as easily say, "I guess I'll become a cop so that men can be afraid of me."

Are you telling me that there aren't cops who chose their profession because they have a lust for power and control?

Just like some gun owners may choose to OC because they want to look bad-ass and powerful, so there are people who become cops just to feel bad-ass and powerful. It goes both ways.

Comments like yours are what put people on the defensive concerning police. Cops have a very scary job, and I respect their service deeply. However, they exist to protect and to serve ME, the law abiding, honest, hard-working citizen. They do not exist to deprive me of my rights, harass me, discriminate against me, give me an "a-- chewing" because they don't like that I carry OC, etc...

Some people join the ranks of the LE profession for all the wrong reasons. The ones that do usually have VERY short careers.

 

[bglaze]

By the way, i act the same on camera as off. That being said, you recording our meeting will definately not make me happy and more than likely help me make my decision on wether or not to use descresion on any infractions i may have observed.

I sense some defensiveness from the cops who have spoken up.

We are on the same side. We OCing citizens and you officers are the ones who respect and obey the law.

You can do our State and Country a tremendous favor and start spreading the word to other officers that OC activists are the good guys. This way they just let us go about our business if we are merely shopping or going about our lives peacefully.

The OC movement is not an anti-cop movement. It is a pro-gun movement. If you share the same appreciation for our God given (not government given) right to self-defense via the bearing of arms, then join our cause by helping us spread the word.

The truth is, the OC movement for a while will make your jobs harder (lots more Man-with-a-gun calls). This is until people just get use to seeing armed citizens. After a while, however, when more people start doing it, it will make your job much easier and much less dangerous, because an armed society is a peaceful society.

It's a long term struggle, and we need every cop on our side that we can get.

 

[bglaze]

I've been reading a lot of posts and comments about Open Carry on a number of forums.

There are a LOT of people that at the thought of seeing Open Carriers say such things as: "We don't need a bunch of wacko gun nuts hanging around in restaurants with their guns hanging off their hips in plain view! It makes for a dangerous environment!"

This just makes no sense to me.

Even if I wasn't OCing, I would be armed nevertheless. My gun would be present whether it is visible or hidden.

Let's say there are 10 people in a store who are carrying guns... If all 10 were Open Carrying, there would be 10 people with guns. If all 10 were Concealed Carrying, there would still be 10 people with guns. I would actually venture to say that the danger level is far less with the Open Carry scenario. What robber in their right mind would rob a store with 10 visibly armed men milling around inside. This is why we need more of you gun owners OCing! It's not a sin folks! Jump in, the water's warm! =)

When I am OCing I am merely choosing to fully disclose the fact that I am armed to anyone who observes me. I see it has an act of honesty and trust between you and me.

And as far as cops are concerned, I would think that a cop would appreciate knowing that I am armed instead of having to guess if I am or not.

I think that all of the fears surrounding OC are truly irrational. I am not trying to demean those who oppose OC. But, whether or not my gun is visible or hidden, I am JUST as armed. So, the increase in danger is merely a perceived increase by the observer.

Nevertheless, I really am still not satisfied that I understand the laws surrounding when I am or am not REQUIRED to show I.D. if a cop asks for it.

I believe I've inferred that I do need to produce my Handgun License on request whether or not a cop has reasonable suspicion that I have committed a crime. I don't agree that this is right, but I can't find any laws that say I don't have to.

However, I have always been under the impression that a cop cannot compel me to show my photo I.D. (driver's license) unless he has a reasonable suspicion that I have committed a crime.

Any more opinions on this?

 

[matrxx]

The only time you have to show you CHL with your DL is when you stopped by a cop for any reason and you have the gun with you or on you.

 

[matrxx]

If you try to show off your gun,guess what :you are the one who got shot first.Being surprise is one of your friend.

 

[Roadie]

The only time you have to show you CHL with your DL is when you stopped by a cop for any reason and you have the gun with you or on you.

First of all, Indiana doesnt have "CHL", 2nd of all, Indiana is a "do not have to Inform" State, so NO, you do not HAVE to tell a cop you have a gun OR an LTCH unless he ASKS you about either.

Might I suggest you read the FAQ?

 

[ATM]

If you try to show off your gun,guess what :you are the one who got shot first.Being surprise is one of your friend.

Please expound on that in this thread:

https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...lf_defense/37307-common_oc_cc_threadjack.html

 

[Jubbie]

There are a LOT of people that at the thought of seeing Open Carriers say such things as: "We don't need a bunch of wacko gun nuts hanging around in restaurants with their guns hanging off their hips in plain view! It makes for a dangerous environment!"

This just makes no sense to me.

They are living in a false sense of security. If they can't see a gun, then no gun is present. These people need to go walk around Chicago for a while, see how safe they feel. Maybe I'm just biased, but if I see people OC'ing their firearms in holsters, I'm going to feel safer.

 

[matrxx]

First of all, Indiana doesnt have "CHL", 2nd of all, Indiana is a "do not have to Inform" State, so NO, you do not HAVE to tell a cop you have a gun OR an LTCH unless he ASKS you about either.

Might I suggest you read the FAQ?

I'm not living in Indiana,and whatever you said above won't happen in my state,brother.I don't try to be smart a or being soft.