The SB 101 (Religious Freedom Restoration) Thread

[AA&E]

There has been no boycott as of yet. There have only been death threats.

Hard to boycott something that has closed it's doors.

 

[Doug]

​And how was it determined that these threats came from "militant LGBT?"

What? You think it was the Jehovah Witnesses?

It may NOT have been "militant LGBTQ." It might just have been those who want to attack anything that might have a religious conotation.

 

[PistolBob]

Just because you do not like this type of pressure and it's influence on the market, doesn't mean it isn't a free market result. You provide crappy service, your business suffers. You charge more for a product than what it is worth, your business will suffer. You publicly proclaim an unpopular opinion (to some) your business will suffer.

That said I wouldn't condone the threats, but if you shut your doors because you are being bombarded by calls telling you what a tool you are and how they will not be doing business with your establishment... sounds like reaping what you sow.

Yeah the market is speaking volumes. The folks that support this business have already contributed about $60K in funding to help them get through this attack of the left wing kookoos.

At $14 a pizza, that's 4285 pizzas...I'm guessing that's a hell of a lot of pizza for a family owned joint in a small town of only 2100 people. The free market is supporting them. The wacko lefties are losing again.

Intimidation...bigotry...it's what makes up the LGBT community these days. The decent gay people are afraid to speak out against these so called leaders of the gay community.

 

[Pocketman]

Indiana lawmakers are "clarifying" RFRA, not changing it. Apparently some of the bill's original supporters disagree.

Advance America posted the change is destroying religious freedom protection in Indiana.

 

[AA&E]

Do you think that death threats are a valid part of the free market?



Boycott? What boycott? There has been no boycott; only death threats.



So no to death threats, but yes to tortious interference with a business?

Again, note: there has been no boycott (i.e. people choosing not to do business). There have been death threats, arson threats, fraudulent reviews, hostile squatting of internet domain name, hacking/defacing of search engine results, and other forms of illegal activity.

(And some would question my use of the term "militant" in describing people who would engage in such activities...)

The article I saw stated they were bombarded with calls and closed in part because nothing was getting accomplished. The vast majority of the complaints weren't death threats. Initial reports I saw were of three calls of a threatening nature. There will always be a few ignorant people in every crowd. Tucking your tail and letting them send you off into hiding plays into their hands.

You are kidding yourself if you don't think a certain portion of the population was going to be boycotting and picketing this establishment. To what degree it's hard to say since he went into hiding...

 

[Doug]

While rape is never justified or provoked, do you truly believe a rape victim on some level wouldn't alter their actions after such a tragic event unfolds in their lives? Same concept applies here.

And changing their actions by shutting up would have the effect those making the death threats wanted.
They don't want discussion or debate; they want to silence their opponents.
Knowing their argument is weak, they seek to silence the opposition with threats.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Intimidation...bigotry...it's what makes up the LGBT community these days. The decent gay people are afraid to speak out against these so called leaders of the gay community.

I wouldn't generalize it that far. The intimidation is a leftist feature, not exclusive to LGBT. There are plenty of Conservative LGBT people supporting this pizzeria.

 

[AA&E]

These didn't happen.



This one happened, but your conclusion is an assumption.



That's not what happened. Death threats are not "you're a tool"



Whose rye-eets are being impeded upon here?

Reports I saw were thousands of calls, three of a threatening nature. None substantiated as a legitimate threat. But what the hell, it gives him a convenient reason to panhandle electronically.

 

[chipbennett]

Unfortunately, you are exceptionally misguided if you do not believe the norm on these matters is swaying toward the acceptance toward their type. There are MANY people that would boycott based upon support, not because they themselves are gay. This is being portrayed as a modern day civil rights issue... and they are winning the PR war.

Where is there any evidence of a lack of "acceptance" of LGBT?

(Well, excluding China, and the several middle east nations where LGBT are executed - and which happen to be the same countries in which Apple does business, while its CEO calls out Indiana.)

Where is the call to execute LGBT? Where is the call to prevent LGBT from being in LGBT relationships, or doing whatever consenting adults do in relationships? Where is the call to shun LGBT in public? Where is the call for the right to refuse all service to LGBT?

American society - a society that is about 80% self-described Christian - is absolutely tolerant and accepting of LGBT.

 

[dusty88]

Then why introduce it?

I'm a day behind here but....

My opinion is this was introduced for exactly what you are seeing here, although it is tilting more one way than the Republicans expected.

Republicans passed this law to get support from the religious right. They lost the gay marriage battle and this was a "nod" to them. They were saying "we are going to make extra double sure that you don't have to service a gay wedding and we are going to help you show your outrage about gay marriage".

Likewise, the Democrats didn't really mind because it also puts their constituents more strongly in their corner, and it really doesn't affect gay rights.

The only thing not adequately predicted was just how much the public has changed on gay rights, thus the major political support went to the Democrats. But with or without that left tilt, this was always going to be "Politicians score big, citizens lose"

We citizens are now fighting over a problem that didn't even exist.

 

[AA&E]

Yeah the market is speaking volumes. The folks that support this business have already contributed about $60K in funding to help them get through this attack of the left wing kookoos.

At $14 a pizza, that's 4285 pizzas...I'm guessing that's a hell of a lot of pizza for a family owned joint in a small town of only 2100 people. The free market is supporting them. The wacko lefties are losing again.

Intimidation...bigotry...it's what makes up the LGBT community these days. The decent gay people are afraid to speak out against these so called leaders of the gay community.

A school bus driver ended up getting over 1/2 a million when a student was disrespectful... this doesn't indicate popular support or opinion on the matters. Just that he does have some supporters.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Reports I saw were thousands of calls, three of a threatening nature. None substantiated as a legitimate threat. But what the hell, it gives him a convenient reason to panhandle electronically.

They didn't initiate the fundraising. Supporters did. People against intimidation and, frankly, misguided anger/boycotts.

 

[AA&E]

And changing their actions by shutting up would have the effect those making the death threats wanted.
They don't want discussion or debate; they want to silence their opponents.
Knowing their argument is weak, they seek to silence the opposition with threats.

One side is standing on the national stage changing course.. who had a weak argument in retrospect?

 

[chipbennett]

While rape is never justified or provoked, do you truly believe a rape victim on some level wouldn't alter their actions after such a tragic event unfolds in their lives? Same concept applies here.

No. Kutnupe engaged in victim blaming - which is directly analogous to claiming that what happened to this business has anything at all to do with a "lesson" taught by the "free market." And just as I support the right of women to wear whatever clothes they choose, free of unlawful sexual attacks, I support the right of business owners to exercise their right of free speech, free of unlawful attacks on their business.

However, you may be right, to an extent. Hopefully, the business owners will henceforth tell uninvited reporters to take a long walk off of a short pier in the future.

Hard to boycott something that has closed it's doors.

So, we can agree that a "boycott" has not taken place, and can dispense with calling what is happening a "boycott"?

 

[Doug]

One side is standing on the national stage changing course.. who had a weak argument in retrospect?

Indiana did not "stand on a national stage."
A month ago, most of the national media didn't know Indiana from Iowa.
This is because the Federal law stopped the ACA from forcing Hobby Lobby to pay for abortions. They can't attack the Federal law because President Obama voted for it as a Senator. This isn't about gays and it isn't about Indiana; it's about attacking the idea that some people might have a loyalty to something other than government dictates.

Further, the pizza parlor owners are the ones receiving death threats, not the state of Indiana.
It is individual expression that is being attacked, not the law.

 

[Jomibe]

Looks like that pizzeria learned a hard lesson about the free market.

I found the guy who taught it:

 

[ArcadiaGP]

 

[sdtech58]

Someday, we'll all have to answer to our maker. Read Romans 1:21-27 and draw your own conclusions.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

At $80k now.

Support Memories Pizza by Lawrence Billy Jones III - GoFundMe

 

[chipbennett]

Well, for whatever good it did, I called the office of my representative (Greg Steuerwald) and left a message, indicating my opposition to any changes to the Indiana RFRA as-written and as-passed.