Russia vs. Ukraine Part 2

[BigMoose]

The Ukranians drug out an old soviet era siege mortar..

 

[BigMoose]

And while its not ATACMs, Ukraine is getting the GLSDB which will extend the reach of their HIMARs systems..

US pledges longer-range ‘small-diameter bomb’ for Ukraine

The U.S. announced Friday it will send Ukraine the Boeing-made ground-launched small-diameter bomb, a weapon that can double its strike range.

www.defensenews.com

 

[1DOWN4UP]

 

[Route 45]

This idiot Putin apologist is saying that there's no way that NATO can take on Russia, if needed? A few months ago, he was saying that Russia is not in a position to threaten NATO.

Putin apologist Doug MacGregor to Charlie Kirk: “The war, with the exception of Kharkiv and Odessa, as far as the Russians are concerned is largely over”

www.mediamatters.org

 

[1DOWN4UP]

The US Command is a dumpster fire.

 

[Libertarian01]

These guys sound like idiots compared to everything else I have heard or read.

First, the gross misquoting by the interviewer of the NATO Admiral. He(the admiral) said nothing of converting the "entire economy" to military production. He DID talk about ramping up, but that's it.

Now to the idiot colonel. He speaks of raw numbers, us having only 50k combat troops in Europe. Our military fights strategically so we never have to fight huge numbers! Our military reaches out behind enemy lines and destroys fuel depots, rail bridges, supply depots, air fields, etc. That way Russia (or any enemy) can raise a million troops but they never get to us.

The colonel also speaks of Russian factories operating 24/7. Right... That's why they're buying drones from Iran and artillery ammo from North Korea, because they have extra rubles burning a hole in their pocket.

The word "moron" comes to mind - for both of them.

Sorry if I sound too caustic, but my sensitivity to BS is lower today.

Regards,

Doug

 

[snapping turtle]

If you start looking at it economically what is the price of a t62/t-72 tank and what is the cost of a javelin missile.

What is the cost of a balloon with "Weather radars" or a few nice cameras and what is the cost of 24/7 signal jammers two escort fighter jets and a 200k air to air missile. Add the retrieval of the cargo in the ocean.

Are we draining Russia dry or are they draining the tank of the USA dry.

 

[actaeon277]

If you start looking at it economically what is the price of a t62/t-72 tank and what is the cost of a javelin missile.

What is the cost of a balloon with "Weather radars" or a few nice cameras and what is the cost of 24/7 signal jammers two escort fighter jets and a 200k air to air missile. Add the retrieval of the cargo in the ocean.

Are we draining Russia dry or are they draining the tank of the USA dry.

So... shoot it down sooner

 

[Route 45]

If you start looking at it economically what is the price of a t62/t-72 tank and what is the cost of a javelin missile.

What is the cost of a balloon with "Weather radars" or a few nice cameras and what is the cost of 24/7 signal jammers two escort fighter jets and a 200k air to air missile. Add the retrieval of the cargo in the ocean.

Are we draining Russia dry or are they draining the tank of the USA dry.

Learn About the Javelin Tank Killers Heading To Ukraine

More precisely known as the FGM-148 Javelin or Advanced Anti-Tank Weapon System-Medium (AAWS-M), Javelin missiles are part of the multi-billion-dollar military aid package being sent to Ukraine.

sofrep.com

"Manufactured in the US by Raytheon and Lockheed Martin, the Javelin costs $178,000, including the launch system and missile, according to the Pentagon’s 2021 budget. Each replacement missile costs around $78,000. With Russian tanks costing up to $4 million each, you literally get a lot of bang for the buck destroyed."

 

[actaeon277]

Maybe, if China wants to play, we should remove them from 'most favored' trading status.
Don't have to tariff, or fine, or whatever.
Just stop giving them special status.

 

[snapping turtle]

Learn About the Javelin Tank Killers Heading To Ukraine

More precisely known as the FGM-148 Javelin or Advanced Anti-Tank Weapon System-Medium (AAWS-M), Javelin missiles are part of the multi-billion-dollar military aid package being sent to Ukraine.

sofrep.com

"Manufactured in the US by Raytheon and Lockheed Martin, the Javelin costs $178,000, including the launch system and missile, according to the Pentagon’s 2021 budget. Each replacement missile costs around $78,000. With Russian tanks costing up to $4 million each, you literally get a lot of bang for the buck destroyed."

I did quote t62 t72 tanks not newer tanks like t 90's

Cost I was told of the t62 was 200k. Cost of javelin I was told was 250k. So 78 k a shot is much less than I expected even allows for a few missed shots to break even. The reason they are keeping the t90's in Russia and using the older mothballed t62's.

 

[Route 45]

I did quote t62 t72 tanks not newer tanks like t 90's

Cost I was told of the t62 was 200k. Cost of javelin I was told was 250k. So 78 k a shot is much less than I expected even allows for a few missed shots to break even. The reason they are keeping the t90's in Russia and using the older mothballed t62's.

Cost of older tanks already bought and paid for (and Javelin missles already bought and paid for) is really not relevant. You have to figure replacement costs. Current cost of a new T-72 is $1-2 million. T-62 and T-64 are no longer in production.

T-90

www.globalsecurity.org

 

[actaeon277]

If there is no difference in the survive ability between new and old tanks, then why use the new ones?

 

[smokingman]

The Internal Security Service of Ukraine (SZBU) calls out the national police(with the focus being the head department in Kiev) and most of the police chiefs for running prostitution rings...from their police stations. A few were arrested.

Exemplary EU candidate Ukraine: Police chiefs running a prostitute ring? - Free West Media | Free West Media

It is worth following the social media pages of the Ukrainian Internal Security Service, because sometimes they reveal quite amazing facts. Embezzlement, bribery, smuggling, forgery, robbery, and since the outbreak of the war, collaboration with the Russians – not a day goes by without some kind...

freewestmedia.com

 

[actaeon277]

 

[oze]

Thanks, Act. That video made me smile.

 

[BigMoose]

Thanks, Act. That video made me smile.

Same old story.

Soviet Era.. there used to be a bunch of them, now there is only one... and its a basketcase.
I think the Chinese finally got the second one of these running.

That said, Soviet/Russian doctrine wasn't that heavy on carriers.

In case of war, the Russian bomber fleet, and their missile armed cruiser fleet. was to strike out at our carriers with an unholy vengeance and take out as many as they could.. it was never going to be carrier on carrier fights.

This is why Reagan reactivated the four Iowas.. they were extra targets. (Hard ones at that) that were to make the Soviets waste missiles trying to find our carriers. As old as they were, the Soviets were worried about the Iowas.. And those battle-wagons could have soaked up a LOT of missiles.

If any of you have time. Look up some of the simulations if the Cold War had gone hot in the 80s, and not immediately gone nuclear. It makes WW2 look like a small brushfire war.

 

[DragonGunner]

The Internal Security Service of Ukraine (SZBU) calls out the national police(with the focus being the head department in Kiev) and most of the police chiefs for running prostitution rings...from their police stations. A few were arrested.

Exemplary EU candidate Ukraine: Police chiefs running a prostitute ring? - Free West Media | Free West Media

It is worth following the social media pages of the Ukrainian Internal Security Service, because sometimes they reveal quite amazing facts. Embezzlement, bribery, smuggling, forgery, robbery, and since the outbreak of the war, collaboration with the Russians – not a day goes by without some kind...

freewestmedia.com

At this point it would have been cheaper for Russia to take over Ukraine and we just buy Ukraine stuff off of them. Ya that benifits Russia and communism but how is that different than China? Still feel sorry for regular Ukraine people stuck in the middle of 2 corrupt governments.

 

[actaeon277]

Same old story.

Soviet Era.. there used to be a bunch of them, now there is only one... and its a basketcase.
I think the Chinese finally got the second one of these running.

That said, Soviet/Russian doctrine wasn't that heavy on carriers.

In case of war, the Russian bomber fleet, and their missile armed cruiser fleet. was to strike out at our carriers with an unholy vengeance and take out as many as they could.. it was never going to be carrier on carrier fights.

This is why Reagan reactivated the four Iowas.. they were extra targets. (Hard ones at that) that were to make the Soviets waste missiles trying to find our carriers. As old as they were, the Soviets were worried about the Iowas.. And those battle-wagons could have soaked up a LOT of missiles.

If any of you have time. Look up some of the simulations if the Cold War had gone hot in the 80s, and not immediately gone nuclear. It makes WW2 look like a small brushfire war.

In case of war, the Russian bomber fleet, and their missile armed cruiser fleet. was to strike out at our carriers with an unholy vengeance and take out as many as they could.. it was never going to be carrier on carrier fights.


But, that doesn't work well for force projection.
It's more of a defensive stance.

They started off with the defensive stance... preventing invasion of the motherland and all that.
Probably a good paranoid reaction, after what happened to them in WWII.
But, after they achieved that, then the carriers came.
The were the desire for force projection.
Not a bad thought actually.
Better to hit the 'enemy' far from home, instead of in the homeland.

But...
Carriers are a 'next step' in military force projection, and the Soviets were fundamentally unable to make that jump.
On SO MANY levels.

 

[rhamersley]

Don't remember if this had it's own thread or not, but kind of goes with the Russia thing anyway...

How America Took Out The Nord Stream Pipeline

The New York Times called it a “mystery,” but the United States executed a covert sea operation that was kept secret—until now

seymourhersh.substack.com