Live Feed, Patriots at the Capitol

[nonobaddog]

Some cops did seem to be holding the doors at at least one point of entry. That's not the case everywhere. They broke the **** in. People found ways in and other people followed. They're all culpable for at least that part.

There are a lot of things that seem out of sorts with the whole event. I'm not sure we'll ever know the whole story. But here is a fact. It was illegal to enter that building the way they did. Period. Full stop. If she didn't know she was in the wrong for doing what she did, then that's just another vector of responsibility that falls on her for a total lack of awareness. Would you have just walked in there? And remember. She was in the leading group getting into the building. So it's not like some cop said, "hey, pssst, this way, c'mon in."

If you can't see that she's at least a little responsible for breaking the law and putting herself into that position, you have to ask yourself if you're seeing everything as it is. There is no justification for her being there in that place at that time. We can talk about the officer's part in that as well.

We could say that about Antifa/BLM. Sometimes people get carried away with comments about what should happen to these Antifa and BLM rioters/looters, and I'm about as inclined as anyone to spout off about that because it pisses me off. If someone shoots one of them while in the act, is that any less summary execution? Personally, as I've said, I think that cop was hasty. Was it a justifiable shoot? I dunno. It's pretty close either way. I can see why no charges were brought though. It doesn't make it any more "murder" just because it happened to someone on your team.

I don't like it either. I'd much rather side with the side I tend to agree with more. That's the cost of constancy. I mean. You can just say **** it, like some others seem to have. And just say, fine. It's okay for mine to break the law fighting for what they think is injustice, but it's not okay for yours. You can say, you're on the right side. Well. They say the same thing.

She eagerly entered the building illegally. And then she went with the crowd to the chamber doors, and when they breached, her face was the first through the door. You can't possibly think that was all passive. It was as intentionally accomplished as one could get. It sucks when someone on your team is in the wrong. It is what it is. Admit it for what it is and move on.

Just who is saying she didn't break any laws? It shows it in the video.
You seem to be strongly arguing for something that is a given.

It is the shooting part that is concerning.

 

[jamil]

Just who is saying she didn't break any laws? It shows it in the video.
You seem to be strongly arguing for something that is a given.

It is the shooting part that is concerning.

If that's the case then it shouldn't be difficult to admit that she was at least a little responsible for what happened to her.

 

[nonobaddog]

If that's the case then it shouldn't be difficult to admit that she was at least a little responsible for what happened to her.

I would say she would be responsible if what happened to her was appropriate for the law she broke.
I am having serious problems thinking she was responsible for her getting shot and killed.

Was she armed? Did she resist arrest? Did the officer fear for his life? Did she pose a credible threat to anyone? Did she do some other capital offense I am not aware of?

 

[jamil]

I would say she would be responsible if what happened to her was appropriate for the law she broke.
I am having serious problems thinking she was responsible for her getting shot and killed.

Okay. Did Breonna Taylor deserve to get shot? I don't think so. I'm not aware of her committing any capital crimes. But she was responsible at least a little. She was obviously involved a lot more than the press let on in the drug business, and that put her in the position of having a dangerous interaction with cops. A lot of factors led to that death that weren't all here doing, though some of those factors were.

My whole point in this is that if people are gonna say that because the woman at the Capitol did not deserve to get shot (obviously trespassing is not a capital crime) that she bore no responsibility in her own death at all, then I think the those people should not selectively apply that standard. I know. I know. "but, but, jamil, this and that." Well, no, not this and that.

Babbitt was responsible at least a little because she put herself into an encounter with armed officers as she was breaking into a place she is not supposed to be. It's a shame that thieves get shot for B&E. That's not a capital offense either. But you don't know their intentions when you catch them breaking in. So you're justified in shooting. Whose responsible for that? Why should we carve out an exception for Babbitt? Because she's on our team? No.

 

[Tombs]

Why should we carve out an exception for Babbitt? Because she's on our team? No.

What do you gain by not doing so? Letting your neighbors know you'll pick apart their actions as well and won't have their back if their actions aren't absolutely perfect?

The other side acts with impunity because they all have each other's back. There's a lesson to be learned here.

 

[jamil]

What do you gain by not doing so? Letting your neighbors know you'll pick apart their actions as well and won't have their back if their actions aren't absolutely perfect?

The other side acts with impunity because they all have each other's back. There's a lesson to be learned here.

Those are the words of someone who's gone over the edge. I mean. Is this what we're down to? Sides, right or wrong? Clearly you've been blackpilled.

 

[IndyDave1776]

We could say that about Antifa/BLM. Sometimes people get carried away with comments about what should happen to these Antifa and BLM rioters/looters, and I'm about as inclined as anyone to spout off about that because it pisses me off. If someone shoots one of them while in the act, is that any less summary execution? Personally, as I've said, I think that cop was hasty. Was it a justifiable shoot? I dunno. It's pretty close either way. I can see why no charges were brought though. It doesn't make it any more "murder" just because it happened to someone on your team.

I don't like it either. I'd much rather side with the side I tend to agree with more. That's the cost of constancy. I mean. You can just say **** it, like some others seem to have. And just say, fine. It's okay for mine to break the law fighting for what they think is injustice, but it's not okay for yours. You can say, you're on the right side. Well. They say the same thing.

With a scant few exceptions the 1/6 people were at most rowdy. No massive property damage, no arson, no "autonomous zone". While this rather time for what is was event is being addressed unmercifully, far worse is acceptable.

I would be more sympathetic with your sensibilities on the matter had the 2/6 incident been met with official indifference similar with thst given BLM and its year of rioting.

You are right. I am just about to the point that I don't give a **** about playing fair and am about ready to go full partisan about it. After all, it isn't like the other side didn't make that choice a long time ago.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Those are the words of someone who's gone over the edge. I mean. Is this what we're down to? Sides, right or wrong? Clearly you've been blackpilled.

If you go by marquis of Queensbury rules while the other side doesn't recognize rules, you are guaranteed to get your ass handed to you.

 

[jamil]

This is the logical extreme of teams. I want no part of that. You guys can go on with your imaginary war games if you want. I'll just stand back and watch two delusional sides duke it out.

 

[Tombs]

Those are the words of someone who's gone over the edge. I mean. Is this what we're down to? Sides, right or wrong? Clearly you've been blackpilled.

You're in the trenches with mortar fire raining down around you and bullets cracking over your head.

Do you stand up and say "I don't want any part of this, you're all being ridiculous" and walk over to the enemy to shake their hand and agree to disagree?

I think your reasoning needs calibration.

I'd also like to add, we didn't start this war. We were not the aggressors of this war. We didn't make the terms or rules of this war. But we are in a war that we do not want to be in, under circumstances we don't want to be in, and the choice is to win or die. I'm not falling on my own sword because of some childish ego stroking belief in being the bigger man.

 

[IndyDave1776]

This is the logical extreme of teams. I want no part of that. You guys can go on with your imaginary war games if you want. I'll just stand back and watch two delusional sides duke it out.

Not that long ago I would have been with you. We are near if not arrived at the point where you will have to choose to set aside the unequal standards you accept or just get in the rail car because that's what civilized people do.

 

[nonobaddog]

Okay. Did Breonna Taylor deserve to get shot?

I didn't say anything about Breonna Taylor or anybody else. Two wrongs still don't make anything but two wrongs. Bringing up anybody other than the victim here is irrelevant to anything I said.

 

[jamil]

With a scant few exceptions the 1/6 people were at most rowdy. No massive property damage, no arson, no "autonomous zone". While this rather time for what is was event is being addressed unmercifully, far worse is acceptable.

I would be more sympathetic with your sensibilities on the matter had the 2/6 incident been met with official indifference similar with thst given BLM and its year of rioting.

You are right. I am just about to the point that I don't give a **** about playing fair and am about ready to go full partisan about it. After all, it isn't like the other side didn't make that choice a long time ago.

I thought this was the crux of it. People on the right are being blackpilled. And I get it. But I also think some of it is not as real as you think it is. And I'm not talking about sticking my head in the sand next to Kut. The ******** Antifa/BLM gets away with is real. The **** democrats are doing to eliminate the dissenting voice in American politics is real. America is torn apart right now and that's too real. You guys remind me of that saying someone posted that if you're the only one showing up with your rifle, go home. It isn't time yet.

My sensibilities are just simple reason. Those people showed up to the capital foolishly. They had no plan. Just thought they'd show up and things would magically change. That they'd occupy the Capitol for a bit and somehow that would reverse the election. You're seeing the Left act the way they are because the right enabled them. Now they can claim "Insurrection!" and justify whatever. That's what happens when you show up with a rifle before it's time. You get marginalized for being kooks. I mean. Hell, some people on INGO still think that was a win!

 

[jamil]

I didn't say anything about Breonna Taylor or anybody else. Two wrongs still don't make anything but two wrongs. Bringing up anybody other than the victim here is irrelevant to anything I said.

That's not true. It's relevent to bring up similar broader examples to make the point. If Babbitt had no responsibility at all in what happened to her, then there are a lot of threads on INGO where people need to take back some pretty strong language. But I think it's right to admit responsibility where it's due.

 

[nonobaddog]

This is the logical extreme of teams. I want no part of that. You guys can go on with your imaginary war games if you want. I'll just stand back and watch two delusional sides duke it out.

Not to worry. If you just stand there - the edge will come to you.

 

[Tombs]

I thought this was the crux of it. People on the right are being blackpilled. And I get it. But I also think some of it is not as real as you think it is. And I'm not talking about sticking my head in the sand next to Kut. The ******** Antifa/BLM gets away with is real. The **** democrats are doing to eliminate the dissenting voice in American politics is real. America is torn apart right now and that's too real. You guys remind me of that saying someone posted that if you're the only one showing up with your rifle, go home. It isn't time yet.

My sensibilities are just simple reason. Those people showed up to the capital foolishly. They had no plan. Just thought they'd show up and things would magically change. That they'd occupy the Capitol for a bit and somehow that would reverse the election. You're seeing the Left act the way they are because the right enabled them. Now they can claim "Insurrection!" and justify whatever. That's what happens when you show up with a rifle before it's time. You get marginalized for being kooks. I mean. Hell, some people on INGO still think that was a win!

BLM burned down large swaths of the country, turning most cities into no-go zones, killing countless people. There was no plan beyond to show up and act like an idiot.

What did they get? Memorials, policy changes, and basically their entire charter nearly solidified into law.

Tell me again how exactly you think this is ineffective.

 

[jamil]

Not that long ago I would have been with you. We are near if not arrived at the point where you will have to choose to set aside the unequal standards you accept or just get in the rail car because that's what civilized people do.

I don't accept that there are unequal standards. I disagree that relinquishing all standards is the way to not accept it.

 

[nonobaddog]

That's not true. It's relevent to bring up similar broader examples to make the point. If Babbitt had no responsibility at all in what happened to her, then there are a lot of threads on INGO where people need to take back some pretty strong language. But I think it's right to admit responsibility where it's due.

OK, I'm convinced, Ashli Babbitt was responsible for getting shot and killed.

 

[jamil]

Not to worry. If you just stand there - the edge will come to you.

Well, then I'll know it's time to fetch the rifle.

 

[jamil]

OK, I'm convinced, Ashli Babbitt was responsible for getting shot and killed.

There's some astonishing reasoning.