Front Sight Institute Using Deputy's Death Video For Advertising

[BoilerGuy]

I just took myself off his mailing list (even though I signed up for it less than probably two weeks ago). Unlike some mailing lists, there was no place to "Please take a moment to tell us why you are unsubscribing".

I can't speak for his training because I haven't taken a class of his; however, his emails are very similar to a group of real estate "gurus" that I had signed up for before that send you a lot of emails 'in the final hour, where you will get a great discount if you beat the clock'. They also offered free seminars to anyone on their lifetime list. They are businessmen first and trainers second. This type of advertising shown by the OP just sealed the deal to not request anything from him in the future.

And to be honest, unless something really is the "ultimate" or unavailable anywhere else, I would rather support people locally that offer the same level of training.

 

[TiminMishawaka]

Buckaroo,
Nice try but you didn't post that this court decision was reversed 7 days later based on evidence provided by Piazza's attorney and all administration of Front Sight assets were returned to Front Sight. That was 3 days after the printing of this article. Why don't you rep me down again for posting the whole truth? I bet it would make you feel a lot better.

Tim

 

[Buckaroo]

Well, that does not change the fact that the suit was won by the plaintiffs does it?

I don't need to rep you again as you are making your own bed in which to lie.

Buckaroo

 

[TiminMishawaka]

Well, that does not change the fact that the suit was won by the plaintiffs does it?

It wasn't won by the plaintiffs. It was settled out of court. The plaintiffs came back and tried to reopen the case and got a reversal of their decision. Those are the facts.

BTW - did you send any notification to Youtube for using this video for commercial purposes?

 

[Fargo]

Buckaroo,
Nice try but you didn't post that this court decision was reversed 7 days later based on evidence provided by Piazza's attorney and all administration of Front Sight assets were returned to Front Sight. That was 3 days after the printing of this article. Why don't you rep me down again for posting the whole truth? I bet it would make you feel a lot better.

Tim

Citation please? More importantly, I want the cite showing that the obligations of the settlement were satisfied.

Joe

 

[TiminMishawaka]

Citation please? More importantly, I want the cite showing that the obligations of the settlement were satisfied.

Joe

ORDER DISSOLVING RECEIVERSHIP AND DISCHARGING RECEIVER, NORTHERN DISTRICT OF CALIFORNIA SAN JOSE DIVISION, Case No. C 05-04532 JW

JW stands for Judge James Ware

It won't show what you are asking for though because that is private financial information of an out of court settlement and you don't have permission to view it unless you go to the parties involved in the suit and obtain it.

 

[usmcdjb]

I just took myself off his mailing list (even though I signed up for it less than probably two weeks ago). Unlike some mailing lists, there was no place to "Please take a moment to tell us why you are unsubscribing".

I can't speak for his training because I haven't taken a class of his; however, his emails are very similar to a group of real estate "gurus" that I had signed up for before that send you a lot of emails 'in the final hour, where you will get a great discount if you beat the clock'. They also offered free seminars to anyone on their lifetime list. They are businessmen first and trainers second. This type of advertising shown by the OP just sealed the deal to not request anything from him in the future.

And to be honest, unless something really is the "ultimate" or unavailable anywhere else, I would rather support people locally that offer the same level of training.

I took a defensive pistol course with FrontSight long before they moved on the NV location. They operated off a rented range in Bakersfield, CA. The training was good. I wished I could take more.

However, the incessant 'deals' FS comes up with gets very tiring. I think if they would have stuck to training as their focus instead of growing so much, it would have been better.

 

[Yamaha]

thats one of the worst video's I have ever seen before, and in a classroom environment, i believe it would be beneficial. At the same time, it should not be publicly placed in media outlets for anyone and everyone to see, just in a private setting.


case in point, suspect should have been shot at some point before ever returning to vehicle....


I am also amazed semi auto clip fed "war" rifles weren't banned after this, considering the amount of liberals all over the place.....

 

[kingnereli]

I'm not a huge fan of Frontsight by any means, but it is drastic overreaction to be offended by the use of the video. The blog is quite accurate in its critique and Piazza even added a few points defending why he used the video after there was some backlash. The video is tragic and worth learning from. Hopefully, some people got to see it that hadn't before.

 

[amnate2529]

I watched the video and it was heartbreaking, guy was a straight piece of trash. People should not be allowed to use stuff like that to promote their business, it should be restricted to law enforcement for training. I feel for the family of the fallen policeman. They should get the perp and gut his *** like a deer.

 

[Fargo]

I'm not a huge fan of Frontsight by any means, but it is drastic overreaction to be offended by the use of the video. The blog is quite accurate in its critique and Piazza even added a few points defending why he used the video after there was some backlash. The video is tragic and worth learning from. Hopefully, some people got to see it that hadn't before.

I respectfully disagree. I have no issue with it as a training tool but that is NOT what Piazza is doing here. He is using it to market his training product for monetary gain and that is WRONG.

Also, if you think that Piazza's commentary on the video somehow makes it right, I challenge you to tell me what Piazza said that wasn't already self evident to any competent gunhandler?

From that "four weapon combat master's"* blog:

Please watch this video to see exactly what NOT to do, then see my comments, as well as what I have created to prevent this from ever happening to you.

The arrogance is sickening. "Buy my product or this is what will happen"?

Joe

*If you consider getting that title from someone you are financially linked to and who becomes your employee to be valid. I kinda call it "self-annointing".

 

[kingnereli]

I respectfully disagree. I have no issue with it as a training tool but that is NOT what Piazza is doing here. He is using it to market his training product for monetary gain and that is WRONG.

Also, if you think that Piazza's commentary on the video somehow makes it right, I challenge you to tell me what Piazza said that wasn't already self evident to any competent gunhandler?

From that "four weapon combat master's"* blog:

The arrogance is sickening. "Buy my product or this is what will happen"?

Joe

*If you consider getting that title from someone you are financially linked to and who becomes your employee to be valid. I kinda call it "self-annointing".

Don't get me wrong. I completely understand your point of view. I was commenting on the overreaction such as the poster before you who suggested that a law should be enacted preventing the use of this video in such a manner.

I also think the content of the blog (self evident or not) shows Piazza didn't have ill intentions in using the video. Sure, he wants to make money, but I also think he has a genuine interest in his students. Most everyone's job falls under the category of "I care about what I'm doing but I wouldn't do it for free."

Don't you think you overstated the portion of the blog that you highlighted? Where you see "Buy my product or this will happen." I see "Attend my training and learn how to not make the same mistakes." As to how good training there is I have no idea. I've never trained at Frontsight and don't intend to. I just don't see a very hardy attempt, in this thread, to keep an even keel and avoid emotionalism. Though, I certainly see where you (and others) are coming from.

 

[SPORT]

I AGREE THE VIDEO IS VERY DISTURBING, I HAVE ATTENDED FRONT SIGHT THE TRAINING WAS TOP NOTCH BUT I AGREE THAT VIDEO SHOULD NOT BE USED FOR PROMOTIONAL ADVERTISING, WE HAD A REAL GOOD TIME BUT IM NOT SURE IF I WILL GO BACK JUST BECAUSE OF THAT VIDEO, PLUS THEY ARE A BIT PUSHY TRYING TO GET YOU JOIN WHILE YOUR THERE

I HAVE ATTENDED FRONT SIGHT AND FOUND THE TRAINING TOP NOTCH I AGREE THE VIDEO IS DISTURBING AND SHOULD NOT BE USED FOR PROMOTIONAL USES, BUT CANNOT COMPLAIN ABOUT THE LEVEL OF TRAINING WE GOT, LIKE I SAID TOP NOTCH PLUS THEY ARE VERY ANNOYING WITH ALL THE EMAILS THEY SEND EVREY DAY IT SEEMS

 

[TFin04]

I AGREE THE VIDEO IS VERY DISTURBING, I HAVE ATTENDED FRONT SIGHT THE TRAINING WAS TOP NOTCH BUT I AGREE THAT VIDEO SHOULD NOT BE USED FOR PROMOTIONAL ADVERTISING, WE HAD A REAL GOOD TIME BUT IM NOT SURE IF I WILL GO BACK JUST BECAUSE OF THAT VIDEO, PLUS THEY ARE A BIT PUSHY TRYING TO GET YOU JOIN WHILE YOUR THERE

I HAVE ATTENDED FRONT SIGHT AND FOUND THE TRAINING TOP NOTCH I AGREE THE VIDEO IS DISTURBING AND SHOULD NOT BE USED FOR PROMOTIONAL USES, BUT CANNOT COMPLAIN ABOUT THE LEVEL OF TRAINING WE GOT, LIKE I SAID TOP NOTCH PLUS THEY ARE VERY ANNOYING WITH ALL THE EMAILS THEY SEND EVREY DAY IT SEEMS

What other training do you have to compare FS to?

 

[crazzy]

"I have seen this video, like others here, many times before. It has been used by a good many instructors (some even on this board) as a training tool. I have no issues with that use of this kind of video. Although difficult to watch, and even harder to critique, I think we owe it to the memory of the officers involved in these types of events, and their families to learn all we can to prevent it from happening again. We owe it to those we will train in the future to be ruthlessly critical of everyone’s actions whenever we have a chance to learn from this type of incident."

agreed, completely. and if you read his comments on the page w/ the vid you will see that is EXACTLY the use/purpose to which he has put the vid. to show the viewer an example of some life ending mistakes which even LE's make due to inadequate training. and to suggest that better training is available from his school - which i can attest it IS. this is one of many instructional vids which he sends to highlight the need for more focused training. yes, it is hard to watch. but, yes, it is REAL and many can learn from the mistakes of others. if you carry [concealed or otherwise] you must be prepared to take another's life when the situation warrants; and, know how to be sure that the situation DOES warrant. if you are not well trained and prepared to do so, DO NOT CARRY!

peace, crazzy

 

[crazzy]

From looking at how much money he's been able to donate, it sounds like he doesn't need this to make money.

Why don't we just skip past all this BS rage pointed at Piazza for the sin of making money and look at the core issue here. When you read his blog....he is absolutely right about what should have been done here. Someone trained this officer to keep talking instead of using completely justifiable lethal force sooner and that is wrong. There's more rage being thrown at Piazza than whoever it is who trained this officer wrong and even the murderer himself. That's the problem I have with this thread it takes rage that should be directed at the real problems and refocuses it on Piazza for daring to comment on it. It follows the same pattern liberals use to attack Limbaugh or Beck when they voice their opinions on a tragedy. Focus on the enemy here guys.

i couldnt agree more. well said! peace, crazzy.

 

[SPORT]

VERY WELL SAID

 

[Buckaroo]

Gentlemen you have missed the point.

Using the death of an officer of the law to promote your business is inexcusable. He should be ashamed of himself and you for supporting him.

There is no excuse!

Buckaroo

 

[TiminMishawaka]

Using the death of an officer of the law to promote your business is inexcusable.

For those who are in a position to make a difference, ignoring his death and not making better products and training to prevent it in the future is what is inexcusable. Every safety product in every industry is improved by and marketed for the prevention of deaths that had occurred in the past.

You just have a beef with Frontsight for reasons you have not yet disclosed.

To use an officers death to create a Frontsight bashing thread is inexcusable behavior.

 

[crazzy]

Gentlemen you have missed the point.

Using the death of an officer of the law to promote your business is inexcusable. He should be ashamed of himself and you for supporting him.

There is no excuse!

Buckaroo

it is YOU who have 'missed the point'. the POINT is the officer was poorly trained! frontsight training IS miles ahead of wherever that poor man got his training. as has been previously posted, that same vid is used in multiple other training sessions; so, why not in his too? his page IS a training page.