Al-Qaeda forces capture Fallujah, Iraq... declare it an Islamic state

[1775usmarine]

I guess you just had to be there to see with your own eyes the turn around. I had a span of about 4 months between my deployments. The first in Fallujah was marked by SAF, and IEDs most we found before things went south. We did convoy ops and provided our own security from Baghdad to TQ and up to Alasad. We escorted TCN's usually 100 of them pretty much 3 times a week some times more if it was a short run. They carried different types of cargo some for our bases, but most of the trucks were delivering goods to the local people.

The second we were inside Ramadi doing Convoy ops resupplying the local hospital with diesel fuel for their generators, fresh water, and speed bags for the locals in addition to supporting the grunts with mail, hot chow every night, water and fuel as well. We would go out twice a day everyday but were split into a day and night crew. Being an NCO was convoy commander on about 20 missions in charge of usually 15-25 Marines and 6-9 trucks. We would also pass out soccer balls, water, and other toys to the children while stopped waiting to get into a FOB/OP.

In the 7 months of being in Ramadi we went from having no one on the streets and dead as hell to the Iraqis having national pride flying flags across town, painting murals, more foot traffic and POV's out and about. The city was demolishing blown up buildings and repairing streets. Most people never heard these stories as the media wanted to portray what we were doing as bad or the deaths and as a way to get everyone out before we could do even greater good.

 

[hornadylnl]

Does the average corn farmer in Indiana care if he has no rights and his life is forfeit to the whims of a mass murdering tyrant?

You're right. It's not a big deal to have no freedom. I don't know why INGO gets all excited about the loss of rights when people who don't have them so clearly don't miss them at all. Period. End of story.

Will Iraqis have more freedom under al Qaeda or Saddam?

 

[Kutnupe14]

When they violate ceasefire terms we are enforcing, I would say that makes it our business. Would you not enforce the terms of the ceasefire?

Which brings up my second point. Why are "we" enforcing mandates of a global entity, when "global" doesn't apply to those taking the risks and absorbing the costs.
I am of the opinion, that if you wage war, wage war. Destroy their capacity and resolve to fight. Afterwards, you have two choices; absorb the nation and it's resources, or leave after their destruction and let them clean it up themselves. War is waged too often like a NFL game. If you knock then down, don't give them a hand up and a pat on the helmet.

 

[ViperJock]

Will Iraqis have more freedom under al Qaeda or Saddam?

We can't do everything for them. At some point people have to stand up for themselves. We gave them the chance to do that.

by your logic we shouldn't bother with schoolyard bullies because another one will just take its place. We should have kept the Brits, because what replaced them could have been just as bad.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Wasteful? Yes. Unjustified? Yes. However, we did dismantle one of the largest militaries on the planet, and have set back their capacity of wage war for decades. I guess that's the silver lining.

Which arguably is better for Iran than it is for us.

 

[SaintsNSinners]

Lets call a truce and let them establish their own caliphate on Antarctica

 

[Jludo]

Actually, I could.

By all means, try your best to make that impossible case.

 

[IndyDave1776]

I guess some people around here are okay with our government sending of 4486 people to die for our elected leaders or former elected leaders. Luckily they themselves weren't one of the 4486.

Does that about sum it up?

I'm sure you'd willingly sacrifice that many men and women if the assassination attempt were on an Obama family member.

Good point. What I find amazing so far as the political polarization is concerned is that the side of the aisle which screams loudest about the war and casualties have no problem and block any attempt to fix the illegal immigration problem with approximately 10,000 Americans are killed annually by illegals, roughly half in deliberate murder and half under non-deliberate circumstances with drunk driving casualties being the leading non-murder cause. That's twice as many each year than have been killed total in the Iraq/Afghan war effort. Personally, I am in favor of protecting the lives and well-being of US citizens first and foremost regardless of the location or circumstances.

 

[Sainte]

Well my 14 months just got flushed down the toilet. 7 months in Fallujah in 06 and 7 in Ramadi in 07. If only people could of seen the good that was done while we were there things would of been different but instead we have our generations Vietnam.

Well, we did good for a sect of humans about one step above animals. When we left, no one, NO ONE could've expected them to keep up the infrastructure we provided them in American blood. These "people" have been at war with one group or another for over 1000 years, the West isn't going to change that in any way, shape or form.

We, ( the Western countries founded on Christian principles ) stopped fighting The Crusadeds centuries ago, the mulims never have. Unfortunately, we have allowed political correctness and a POS Kenyan closet muslim to hoodwink us into allowing our Christian principals to be subverted while we allow muslims to block off entire city blocks in NYC for prayer or, use CITY loudspeakers to broadcast their filth throughout entires towns five times a day. Can imagine if a catholic, Protestant or Methodist priest wanted to pray over a municipally owned loudspeaker system? We can't even display the 10 commandments on govt property, you know, part of what this country was founded on, but we allow muslims to broadcast prayer and songs over city owned speakers.

need any more examples of how we are losing our country? Identity?

 

[Jludo]

Well, we did good for a sect of humans about one step above animals. When we left, no one, NO ONE could've expected them to keep up the infrastructure we provided them in American blood. These "people" have been at war with one group or another for over 1000 years, the West isn't going to change that in any way, shape or form.

We, ( the Western countries founded on Christian principles ) stopped fighting The Crusadeds centuries ago, the mulims never have. Unfortunately, we have allowed political correctness and a POS Kenyan closet muslim to hoodwink us into allowing our Christian principals to be subverted while we allow muslims to block off entire city blocks in NYC for prayer or, use CITY loudspeakers to broadcast their filth throughout entires towns five times a day. Can imagine if a catholic, Protestant or Methodist priest wanted to pray over a municipally owned loudspeaker system? We can't even display the 10 commandments on govt property, you know, part of what this country was founded on, but we allow muslims to broadcast prayer and songs over city owned speakers.

need any more examples of how we are losing our country? Identity?

Just need a source.

 

[dhnorris]

So, let me get this straight our government are

1. bumbling fools

2. evil greedy bastards

3. vastly overmatched by the strategists of ingo

 

[jbombelli]

I'm betting the party affiliation will weigh heavily on the value.

You're betting wrong. I may not like him; I may wish him out of office as soon as possible, but if some foreign power tried to off him or his family I'd be all for grinding them into hamburger. He's still our President.

If I were to put a bullet through the head of your loved one, what would you do? Send cops to come get me and deal harshly with me and anyone defending me with force and all the collateral damage that comes from that, come to deal with me yourself, or try to talk to me and convince me how wrong I was to do what I did?

 

[IndyDave1776]

Just need a source.

I can't help him with a source from memory, but have seen video, including that of trash, rocks, and bricks being thrown at Christians.

So, let me get this straight our government are

1. bumbling fools

2. evil greedy bastards

3. vastly overmatched by the strategists of ingo

It seems to fit. The strategists of INGO can at minimum see that invading people who have fought for centuries without letting up without having a viable exit strategy other than to cut and run is a fool. Anyone who would have an ill-advised war 95% won, then cut and run leaving the enemy to take over is a fool. One may also surmise that greed enters the picture when Halliburton appears to be the only winner in this hemisphere.

 

[hornadylnl]

You're betting wrong. I may not like him; I may wish him out of office as soon as possible, but if some foreign power tried to off him or his family I'd be all for grinding them into hamburger. He's still our President.

If I were to put a bullet through the head of your loved one, what would you do? Send cops to come get me and deal harshly with me and anyone defending me with force and all the collateral damage that comes from that, come to deal with me yourself, or try to talk to me and convince me how wrong I was to do what I did?

And yet you fault the new enemies we create with our foreign policy when they want revenge when we kill their families.

The US, like the glock fotay dude ate rife only ones professional enough to globetrot the planet enforcing our will on others and they should just accept it.

Good to hear you'll jump on a grenade for Obama, Hillary, Pelosi, Feinstein....

 

[Dead Duck]

Spin Spin Spin

 

[printcraft]

Wait, did we ever get the oil in Iraq?
Because I remember being told that the only reason we went it was for the oil................

 

[jbombelli]

And yet you fault the new enemies we create with our foreign policy when they want revenge when we kill their families.

The US, like the glock fotay dude ate rife only ones professional enough to globetrot the planet enforcing our will on others and they should just accept it.

Good to hear you'll jump on a grenade for Obama, Hillary, Pelosi, Feinstein....

Ahhh yes... everything is always our fault. Nobody else ever does anything wrong or bad... just America.

I like how you just gloss over all of the actual facts of the situation that caused us to go to Iraq. Typical. Maybe we wouldn't be killing their families if certain leaders of theirs weren't hiding behind them.

I support my country against foreign powers. Maybe you don't?

Answer my question. What would you do in the situation I presented?

 

[hornadylnl]

Ahhh yes... everything is always our fault. Nobody else ever does anything wrong or bad... just America.

I like how you just gloss over all of the actual facts of the situation that caused us to go to Iraq. Typical. Maybe we wouldn't be killing their families if certain leaders of theirs weren't hiding behind them.

I support my country against foreign powers. Maybe you don't?

Answer my question. What would you do in the situation I presented?

Same thing you and the new terrorist we create would do. Except you believe you and I have that right but a goat farmer in Iraq or Afghanistan doesn't.

 

[cobber]

What makes Iraq's internal affairs our business?

What makes Colorado's/NYS'/Connecticut's/California's internal affairs the business of folks in Indiana?

Domino theory?

 

[jbombelli]

Same thing you and the new terrorist we create would do. Except you believe you and I have that right but a goat farmer in Iraq or Afghanistan doesn't.

Where did I EVER say they don't have the right? Go find a post of mine that says that. I'll be waiting. They have the right to side with our enemies. But they and theirs just might die for it.


Can't answer my question, huh? Was it too complicated for you?