Al-Qaeda forces capture Fallujah, Iraq... declare it an Islamic state

[ArcadiaGP]

Al-Qaeda (that thing we decimated and wasn't really around anymore, so says our Prez), has captured Fallujah, Iraq.



Al-Qaeda force captures Fallujah amid rise in violence in Iraq - The Washington Post

Interesting to see where this goes. I'm sure we'll be negotiating with our Al-Qaeda friends soon.

 

[1775usmarine]

Well my 14 months just got flushed down the toilet. 7 months in Fallujah in 06 and 7 in Ramadi in 07. If only people could of seen the good that was done while we were there things would of been different but instead we have our generations Vietnam.

 

[88GT]

This is not surprising, sadly.

 

[BiscuitNaBasket]

Not surprised. Saw this coming, but didn't expect it this soon.

 

[Jludo]

Remember how there was no Al Qaeda in Iraq before we invaded?

 

[printcraft]

Remember how there was no Al Qaeda in Iraq before we invaded?

Clearly Americas fault for creating a bunch of backwards ass ****sticks.

Maybe we need an despotic dictator in place of al qaeda.

 

[ForceTA308]

Well my 14 months just got flushed down the toilet. 7 months in Fallujah in 06 and 7 in Ramadi in 07. If only people could of seen the good that was done while we were there things would of been different but instead we have our generations Vietnam.

Agreed Brother. Same goes for Afghan. Difficult to maintain what was done there in countries such as those. Even when we were there we saw FOB's and OP's (that we had built) that were turned over to the ANA that they just destroyed.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Remember how there was no Al Qaeda in Iraq before we invaded?

Yep!

 

[Jludo]

Clearly Americas fault for creating a bunch of backwards ass ****sticks.

Maybe we need an despotic dictator in place of al qaeda.

It's just pretty clear we accomplished nothing and if anything made it worse. The people there aren't better off, we aren't better off. Kind of makes everyone realize what a colossal mistake invading was.

 

[88GT]

It's just pretty clear we accomplished nothing and if anything made it worse. The people there aren't better off, we aren't better off. Kind of makes everyone realize what a colossal mistake invading was.

Was the mistake in responding to violations of the unconditional surrender (because if we want to deal with all the facts on the table, that was also part of the rationale for taking action; and unlike the WMD claims, there was zero ambiguity about those violations) or in the execution of the military action that transpired?

I would also argue that while nation-building after one has just trampled its infrastructure is a noble goal, it is not an obligation. We should not be on the hook for the nation's inability to maintain what we helped implement. Hell, we can't even keep our own original governance model in place, and we're starting from a far better position. To lay this at the hands of the U.S. is wrong. Besides, IIRC, didn't the Iraqis tell us to get out?

EDIT: http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052970204685004576045700275218580

BAGHDAD—Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki ruled out the presence of any U.S. troops in Iraq after the end of 2011, saying his new government and the country's security forces were capable of confronting any remaining threats to Iraq's security, sovereignty and unity.

They got what they wanted. And they were unable to maintain the status quo. Not sure how that's our fault.

 

[jbombelli]

I said years ago that this would happen.

 

[Leadeye]

You're better off if you were a government contractor.

 

[Jludo]

Was the mistake in responding to violations of the unconditional surrender (because if we want to deal with all the facts on the table, that was also part of the rationale for taking action; and unlike the WMD claims, there was zero ambiguity about those violations) or in the execution of the military action that transpired?

I would also argue that while nation-building after one has just trampled its infrastructure is a noble goal, it is not an obligation. We should not be on the hook for the nation's inability to maintain what we helped implement. Hell, we can't even keep our own original governance model in place, and we're starting from a far better position. To lay this at the hands of the U.S. is wrong. Besides, IIRC, didn't the Iraqis tell us to get out?

EDIT: Iraqi Prime Minister Says U.S. Forces Must Leave On Time - WSJ.com



They got what they wanted. And they were unable to maintain the status quo. Not sure how that's our fault.

It was absolutely a mistake to invade, plain and simple.

 

[Kutnupe14]

It's just pretty clear we accomplished nothing and if anything made it worse. The people there aren't better off, we aren't better off. Kind of makes everyone realize what a colossal mistake invading was.

Wasteful? Yes. Unjustified? Yes. However, we did dismantle one of the largest militaries on the planet, and have set back their capacity of wage war for decades. I guess that's the silver lining.

 

[SaintsNSinners]

It was absolutely a mistake to invade, plain and simple.

No it wasnt... I was 4 years old but somehow I remember this and is one of the reason I enlisted...


Halabja chemical attack - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[BogWalker]

The mistake wasn't invading. The mistake was staying afterwards.

 

[jbombelli]

It was absolutely a mistake to invade, plain and simple.

If Hussein didn't want to have his country invadex he should have acted approlriately. You know, like maybe NOT send a hit team after GHW Bush when there was a BUSH sitting in the Oval Office.

If I was President and some foreign dictator sent a team to kill my dad you can bet your soul, if you have one, that I would do everything in my power to take him out along with anyone who sides with him.

 

[hornadylnl]

Wasteful? Yes. Unjustified? Yes. However, we did dismantle one of the largest militaries on the planet, and have set back their capacity of wage war for decades. I guess that's the silver lining.

One question is this. Does the average goat farmer in Iraq have a better or worse quality of life for us invading? He isn't concerned with what Saddam did or didn't do or if we were justified in invading. If his life is worse, he'll blame America. Did we create more terrorists than we eliminated?

 

[Kutnupe14]

If Hussein didn't want to have his country invadex he should have acted approlriately. You know, like maybe NOT send a hit team after GHW Bush when there was a BUSH sitting in the Oval Office.

If I was President and some foreign dictator sent a team to kill my dad you can bet your soul, if you have one, that I would do everything in my power to take him out along with anyone who sides with him.

While the anger is understandable, the US Military isn't supposed to be in the vendetta business. If Dubya did Invade Iraq because of that (and I disagree that he did), he should at least be willing to fight himself rather than put other people in harm's way. "Everything" in your "power," is easy, when it isn't your blood being spilt.

 

[Kutnupe14]

One question is this. Does the average goat farmer in Iraq have a better or worse quality of life for us invading? He isn't concerned with what Saddam did or didn't do or if we were justified in invading. If his life is worse, he'll blame America. Did we create more terrorists than we eliminated?

I honestly have no idea. I can see it going both ways.