We could learn something from the gay groups

[evansvillethompsongunner]

What if we start to jam it down peoples throat that the constution has been trampled on for decades.We get the majority to start thinking about why they should not be the content sheep that they are.

Then get gun laws repealed and cheap class III for everyone.

NO ONE except citizens like you and me want cheap Class III arms.

The government doesn't want it.

Dealers who get paid commissions or percentages or fees on multi-thousand dollar sales/transfers don't want it.

The guys and gals who have Class III/Title II arms don't want to lose the stored value of their pieces and/or lose thousands of dollars upon another amnesty/repeal of the GCA/NFA/FOPA - most people now are buying them to collect them or as an investment, the top-end pieces. Sure, they'll shoot the lower-end stuff, but a mint Thompson? Only a fool or a madman would depreciate it through constant use.

NO ONE wants that to happen except us and our voices don't mean **** to any of the aforementioned.

 

[glockpatriot]

Wanna bet? Come to my house.

Same here, Jay!

 

[Bushido Devil Dog]

What has made the gay groups successful has been their marketing, of course greatly ass...er..helped by the mainstream media. Their success has been in showing that most gay people are just normal...

...ordinary,

...average,

...everday people,

...just like you and me!


The above pics are posted as a bit of a joke/over exaggeration (obviously the above is probably not everyday attire), but the fact is, whether or not you agree with their message/lifestyle, the gay movement has been very effective in seeking the change they desire by being willing to risk scorn, social postion, careers, etc by very publicly confronting the status quo. There is a lesson for Pro 2A folks to learn in not being afraid to risk much to gain much...

 

[bigg cheese]

I don't think anyone has claimed that a gay person "went off on its own" AJB

I thought this bore repeating

 

[techres]

They have a pill now that cures gayness. One pill and your not gay anymore,,,,,CIANIDE

And there is the point. Gays are now the ones being civil and gun owners are wishing them dead.

Guess who ends up looking better in the end and who gains the moral high ground in that transaction.

Personally, I have argued for a long time that the gun movement needed to understand that they are no longer a majority that could assume their "win" among the masses and thus be the sleeping giant that died in bed.

Nope, gotta go out, be it and prove in living that gun rights improve society. That gun rights are not radical or dangerous. That gun rights are a right.

We are in a contest of ideas, ideals and futures. If we cannot convey ours, then it dies with us. Period.

And for the record, I have shot with gay shooters, trained gay shooters and am as happy to have them on my shooting lines as I am to shoot with, train and spend time with evangelicals. Makes no difference to me so long as each is safe, willing to learn, and not interested in taking away the rights of others.

So, yeah, I agree with the OP and have said it before. Find a way to share gun ownership, be it, model it, convey it, and not be ashamed or fearful of it.

And those are PR and personal lessons the Gay community has definitely mastered in the last 2 decades.

Techres

 

[ATM]

...Should we all start open carrying to bring it to the forefront of the media?

OK. Sounds good.

 

[Que]

What if we start to jam it down peoples throat that the constution has been trampled on for decades.We get the majority to start thinking about why they should not be the content sheep that they are.

Then get gun laws repealed and cheap class III for everyone.

Give it a try.

 

[dross]

They have a pill now that cures gayness. One pill and your not gay anymore,,,,,CIANIDE

Good thing you didn't say this about a cop - you'd have been in a lot of trouble on this board.

 

[smoking357]

This is just me thinking off the top of my head and will be hard for some to follow but here goes.

In the 80's the gay lifestyle was very out and in our face. At that time a lot of the non gay people were disgusted and really turned off by it.

But now 20 years later gays are not even given a second look in the larger citys.
TV has an proportionate amount of gay characters on it and no one even notices.

Gays make up 3 to 8% of society and are definitely the minority but what they are and how they live have become a non issue with most of us.

So is SE on to something with his marches? Should we all start open carrying to bring it to the forefront of the media?

Yes, this is the precise idea behind open carry. The problem is how do we handle the regular hassles by LEOs who like being the only ones to carry openly. I'd like to see an alert-based system where one OC'er can tap an alarm, and other OC'ers would immediately come running to lend support.

Further, with all the successful civil rights group, the smallest infringement is made into a massive issue. We should be the same way. if the government encroaches, in the slightest, we should press the point until they squeal and sin no more.

 

[smoking357]

There would be movies making guns the hero,

Just as a gun is incapable of being a villain, so also is that inanimate object capable of being a hero.

 

[Hornett]

Gays are now the ones being civil

Riiiiight.

Almost every TV show or new movie that comes out now has a gay character in it.
They are wise, and kind, and friendly, and insightful.
In short, they are portrayed in the best light possible.

If the TV shows and movies had a gun owner character in them that was portrayed in the same light espousing the value of 2A rights, we would never have to have a march or protest.
The public would quickly become educated and 2A rights would be secured forever.

All we get is Tackleberry form Police Academy.
I love the character, but he is not a common gun owner portrayed in a good light.

We are in an uphill battle.
The gay rights movement doesn't necessarily have good tactics, they have really really good support form powerful friends (the media)

 

[Archaic_Entity]

Riiiiight.

Almost every TV show or new movie that comes out now has a gay character in it.
They are wise, and kind, and friendly, and insightful.
In short, they are portrayed in the best light possible.

If the TV shows and movies had a gun owner character in them that was portrayed in the same light espousing the value of 2A rights, we would never have to have a march or protest.
The public would quickly become educated and 2A rights would be secured forever.

All we get is Tackleberry form Police Academy.
I love the character, but he is not a common gun owner portrayed in a good light.

We are in an uphill battle.
The gay rights movement doesn't necessarily have good tactics, they have really really good support form powerful friends (the media)

I think a lot of people are missing some other clues here.

First off: As techres said, gays are actually fairly civil people. I have never been afronted by a gay person in a way that I could say would have offended me. Nor have I had any issues with any gay person that I've known for an extended amount of time. So assuming they're not 'wise, and kind, and friendly, and insightful' is wrong. Now, does the media potentially portray them as better than they are? Possibly.

Buuut... let's look at that on another end. As soon as a gay person is portrayed in an evil light, what happens? The gay movements rise up and there's a huge stink about it. Maybe they have powerful friends in the media, and maybe they have powerful friends in the government. Maybe they have powerful lobbyists in DC. But all that does is assist them.

We have some pretty good people for us in the government. Not many, but some. We have some of the strongest lobbyists in the world.

There's a reason that they're portrayed in the media the way they are. Because if they aren't then what happens? Why couldn't we pull off the same thing?

Their movement is successful even in spite of many peoples' open hatred of them, as has been expressed on this thread. They have made their 8% of the population one of the most popular groups of people.

We have many more gun owners than there are gay people. We could do the same thing. It was brought up already. People just need to not be afraid to be out there and letting the word spread, regardless what it may do to their personal life. Let people know "we're gun owners, and we're proud." Stand up for the movement without reservation.

Now... obviously we can't go spanking each other with ARs on Pennsylvania Ave, but we can demonstrate exactly what we want people to see. That we're peaceful people and Americans just like everyone else.

 

[Hornett]

The media rises up and there's a huge stink about it.

Fixed that for ya'.

See, while I understand your point, I just don't see it that way.
The gay rights movement is NOT going to get bad press.
It's as simple as that.

What if we did this to a State Rep?
LaBarbera Assails Homosexual Hate and Intimidation Campaign against Oklahoma Lawmaker Sally Kern » Americans for Truth

or what if we called people in their homes who posted their thoughts in the paper.
Homosexual intimidation of pro-marriage citizens

or what if we began a campaign of violence against anybody
Homosexuals begin campaign of terror over Prop 8 loss

or what if we targeted a civic leader for removal from office?
Homosexual activists target 96-year-old civic leader for supporting Prop. 8 :: Catholic News Agency (CNA)

What if we hit people and told them we were going to kill them at a gay rights rally?
Sparks fly as 'gay' activist mob swarms Christians

Now I have not said a single hateful thing about homosexuals in this thread. I disagree with them on a number of issues. But, You cannot tell me that if we did these things as a method of supporting 2A rights, that we would be anything but excoriated in the media and end up looking like wackos.
Sure, one on one, gays are nice people.
They are people after all.
But activists? They are not nice people.
They do mean hateful things to anyone who disagrees with them.
I will not act like that.
I cannot condone their methods.

Edit: I just typed in 'homosexual activists' on Google and got the above threads.
There are hundreds of other examples.

 

[360]

They have a pill now that cures gayness. One pill and your not gay anymore,,,,,CIANIDE

Booooooooo. This comment is no different than a racial slur.

A firearm extremist is no different than a flaming homosexual, yet you likely think someone with a room full of guns is cool. They are both flaunting their ways one way or another.

I resent this comment. I have several gay friends, and none of them go around trying to poke every man they meet, in the rear. They are just as cool as my next friend who isn't gay. Maybe you should explore your friend options a little better. You might be surprised at what you find.

The OP has a point, setting all material issues aside. But, for some reason, the media doesn't like to report when a person contracts A.I.D.S. and dies like they do when someone gets shot and dies.

The media is the (un)equalizer in this whole issue.

 

[dburkhead]

This is just me thinking off the top of my head and will be hard for some to follow but here goes.

In the 80's the gay lifestyle was very out and in our face. At that time a lot of the non gay people were disgusted and really turned off by it.

But now 20 years later gays are not even given a second look in the larger citys.
TV has an proportionate amount of gay characters on it and no one even notices.

Gays make up 3 to 8% of society and are definitely the minority but what they are and how they live have become a non issue with most of us.

So is SE on to something with his marches? Should we all start open carrying to bring it to the forefront of the media?

Where have I heard this argument before?

 

[henktermaat]

Perhaps I could learn to decorate my house...

 

[MadBomber]

And there is the point. Gays are now the ones being civil and gun owners are wishing them dead.

Guess who ends up looking better in the end and who gains the moral high ground in that transaction.

Personally, I have argued for a long time that the gun movement needed to understand that they are no longer a majority that could assume their "win" among the masses and thus be the sleeping giant that died in bed.

Nope, gotta go out, be it and prove in living that gun rights improve society. That gun rights are not radical or dangerous. That gun rights are a right.

We are in a contest of ideas, ideals and futures. If we cannot convey ours, then it dies with us. Period.

And for the record, I have shot with gay shooters, trained gay shooters and am as happy to have them on my shooting lines as I am to shoot with, train and spend time with evangelicals. Makes no difference to me so long as each is safe, willing to learn, and not interested in taking away the rights of others.

So, yeah, I agree with the OP and have said it before. Find a way to share gun ownership, be it, model it, convey it, and not be ashamed or fearful of it.

And those are PR and personal lessons the Gay community has definitely mastered in the last 2 decades.

Techres

and repped.

 

[Bill of Rights]

And there is the point. Gays are now the ones being civil and gun owners are wishing them dead.

Guess who ends up looking better in the end and who gains the moral high ground in that transaction.

Personally, I have argued for a long time that the gun movement needed to understand that they are no longer a majority that could assume their "win" among the masses and thus be the sleeping giant that died in bed.

Nope, gotta go out, be it and prove in living that gun rights improve society. That gun rights are not radical or dangerous. That gun rights are a right.

We are in a contest of ideas, ideals and futures. If we cannot convey ours, then it dies with us. Period.

And for the record, I have shot with gay shooters, trained gay shooters and am as happy to have them on my shooting lines as I am to shoot with, train and spend time with evangelicals. Makes no difference to me so long as each is safe, willing to learn, and not interested in taking away the rights of others.

So, yeah, I agree with the OP and have said it before. Find a way to share gun ownership, be it, model it, convey it, and not be ashamed or fearful of it.

And those are PR and personal lessons the Gay community has definitely mastered in the last 2 decades.

Techres

^^This.

Their techniques, with the aid of the media, have worked well. Some might call their behavior "unnatural" among other, less polite terms, but what none can deny is that we have openly homosexual persons in positions of power, and that could not have happened without some level of acceptance on the part of society.

For my part, I have no problem sharing a firing line with a gay person. Doing so does not mean I will be sharing a bed with them.

They have as much right to self-defense as any of us and many times, a greater risk of needing and greater chance of using that right.

If their goal is personal safety that they ensure for themselves, WTH do we care with whom they choose to sleep?

If their goal is the preservation of this nation in the spirit our Founders intended, I will happily stand by their side in that effort.

"A rifle behind every blade of grass": If you want to go looking for the pink blades of grass, knock yourself out. The rest of us will be busy saving a nation.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[smoking357]

Sure, one on one, gays are nice people.
They are people after all.
But activists? They are not nice people.
They do mean hateful things to anyone who disagrees with them.
I will not act like that.
I cannot condone their methods.

You may not, but many gun owners here are absolutely merciless in their hatred of Obama, Democrats and anyone who impedes their hatred of Obama and Democrats. Then there's Fox News, Boortz, Savage, O'Reilly, Limbaugh, Beck, Hannity, etc. which has taken invective to galaxial heights. It isn't like Republicans don't know how or are unwilling to be mean and inflexible.

If the Republicans stood up for gun owners as well as they do for their rich corporate donors, gun ownership would be mandatory.

 

[Joe Williams]

You may not, but many gun owners here are absolutely merciless in their hatred of Obama, Democrats and anyone who impedes their hatred of Obama and Democrats. Then there's Fox News, Boortz, Savage, O'Reilly, Limbaugh, Beck, Hannity, etc. which has taken invective to galaxial heights. It isn't like Republicans don't know how or are unwilling to be mean and inflexible.

If the Republicans stood up for gun owners as well as they do for their rich corporate donors, gun ownership would be mandatory.

What the heck is "galaxial?"