Self defense in a gun-unfriendly country

[04FXSTS]

I forgot to explicitly point out that a country that protects it's criminals over it's law abiding citizens is not a civilized country. Unfortunately we're on the way to being that way (and already are in most urban areas).

Seems like most urban areas are run by democrats. I wonder if there is a connection. If there is a connection why don't the voters in those areas notice what is happening. Oh, free stuff, that seems to be another factor in those areas. Jim.

 

[Denny347]

While I suppose the argument that something is better than nothing could apply, Sylvain's post shows that assuming assailants are unarmed in "gun free" zones isn't a good idea anywhere. Personally I follow wtburnette's method and just never visit those places.

Indeed. However, being unarmed shouldn't mean you are also helpless and being armed doesn't mean you are protected. A firearm is a tool, that's it. The world is a fascinating place and it'd be a shame to miss it because you can't carry your tool of choice. Go to plan B or C and carry on.

 

[wtburnette]

Seems like most urban areas are run by democrats. I wonder if there is a connection. If there is a connection why don't the voters in those areas notice what is happening. Oh, free stuff, that seems to be another factor in those areas. Jim.

The animals who live in the cities would rather get free stuff and be told they're victims than to elect people who just might help them out for real.

Indeed. However, being unarmed shouldn't mean you are also helpless and being armed doesn't mean you are protected. A firearm is a tool, that's it. The world is a fascinating place and it'd be a shame to miss it because you can't carry your tool of choice. Go to plan B or C and carry on.

Absolutely right, however, I'd rather have more tools in my arsenal than less.

 

[Denny347]

I never go anywhere unarmed and always assume others are armed as well.

My location, and local laws are irrelevant when it comes to my personal safety.

It's all about mindset, tactics and training, and no so much the gear you carry.

A lot of folks who carry guns in the US are actually unarmed, because they have no idea what they're doing (no force on force training, no retention skills, no hand-to-hand combat skills, no physical fitness etc).

It takes more than owning, and carrying, a gun to be armed.

 

[Denny347]

I have a friend that carries a tactical pen when he leaves the country. Use it as a Kubaton, stabby, or take notes with it. Up close and personal, it is just as effective as a gun, if you get your mind right. Stabbing, slicing a person takes a very different mindset that shooting them. It is very personal and messy. Again, YOU are the weapon, not what you have in your hand.

Tactical Pens 101: Stab, smash, write

We can call anything tactical, but what does it mean to be tactical? What makes tactical pens any better than regular pens?

sofrep.com

 

[Sylvain]

I have a friend that carries a tactical pen when he leaves the country. Use it as a Kubaton, stabby, or take notes with it. Up close and personal, it is just as effective as a gun, if you get your mind right. Stabbing, slicing a person takes a very different mindset that shooting them. It is very personal and messy. Again, YOU are the weapon, not what you have in your hand.

Tactical Pens 101: Stab, smash, write

We can call anything tactical, but what does it mean to be tactical? What makes tactical pens any better than regular pens?

sofrep.com

Improvise. Adapt. Overcome.

A few years ago here in France we had a terrorist attacked stopped by someone "unarmed".

A would-be terrorist was trying to attack people in the street next to a bar. I don't remember if he had a machete or a gun.
A security guard/bouncer saw that, he went to get the thing with the most stopping power he could find ... which was his car parked nearby, and he ran over the dude and saved a lot of people.

 

[MrSmitty]

Improvise. Adapt. Overcome.

A few years ago here in France we had a terrorist attacked stopped by someone "unarmed".

A would-be terrorist was trying to attack people in the street next to a bar. I don't remember if he had a machete or a gun.
A security guard/bouncer saw that, he went to get the thing with the most stopping power he could find ... which was his car parked nearby, and he ran over the dude and saved a lot of people.

If that happened in the UK, they would ban cars....I'm surprised they haven't outlawed Narwhal tusks yet, after that guy stopped a terrorist with one......
Sylvain, I was in your beautiful country in the 1980's for the Paris Air Show, we, of course sampled some of your cuisine.....Whopper avec Fromage, and Pommes Frites......

 

[tackdriver]

Interesting thread. I lived on one such country for a while (S. Korea) in the late 80's. Guns were very taboo. Civilian firearms are rare (almost non-existent). Bats, axe handles, kitchen knives, pipes, broken bottles... absolutely. Guns? Not a factor. Even police were not allowed to carry off duty, period. (... after a drunk cop fighting with his wife wound up standing in an intersection shooting until he ran out of ammo.) LE often doesn't even carry on duty, and guns get issued as needed. "Here's your revolver and 5 bullets. Remember to put the blank for a warning shot in the first chamber." Very different world.

Over the years, I've thought about the contrasting environments a lot. When I was a fit, trained, young man, I saw it one way. Now older, out of shape, and thinking about a wife and two daughters - I better appreciate the slogan "Colt Made The Equalizer". Long live the 2nd Amendment!

 

[actaeon277]

In the Navy, you would/could take a roll of nickels (or whatever) and roll them up in your dress tie when you rolled up the tie.


That tie was used on the dress whites and dress blues.
Something of a tradition as those uniforms were "liberty" uniforms.

Course, submariners don't really wear dress uniforms. I think I wore mine once, maybe twice when stationed.
And that was for ceremonies, not "liberty".
Civies were "uniform of the day" for liberty.

 

[AndreusMaximus]

It's actually illegal in most places to sell (or own) baseball bats as weapon.

I know in the UK it's highly illegal.
I've seen in a TV documentary a British automobilist being stopped by a British cop ... the cop searched the car and found a baseball bat in the trunk (or rather the boot there).
The cop asked what was the purposed of the bat and the owner answered "self defense" (instead of the obvious "for sport").
The cop said "wrong answer" as he drew his handcuffs.

I know in Poland you need a sporting licence to buy and own a baseball bat.

I honestly didn't believe that this could possibly be true, until I looked it up just now. My brain hurts so bad at the sheer level of stupidity behind laws like this. I think I'm going to go curl up in my bed and snuggle with my AK47 and cry myself to sleep just thinking of the poor people who live in places like that.

 

[xwing]

Really what is the Big Deal? Seriously you always have at your disposal urine, projectile Vomit, and do not forget your outdoor voice, seriously what more could you need?

That used to be on the Illinois State Police website before Illinois finally passed carry in 2013. There was a page suggesting that rape victims protect themselves by trying to throw up on their attacker.

 

[AndreusMaximus]

That used to be on the Illinois State Police website before Illinois finally passed carry in 2013. There was a page suggesting that rape victims protect themselves by trying to throw up on their attacker.

I'm scared to look this up. Just thinking of this makes me want to actually vomit. If it's really true, I think I might just crack...

 

[xwing]

I'm scared to look this up. Just thinking of this makes me want to actually vomit. If it's really true, I think I might just crack...

The page is long gone, but here are a couple of articles about it:

https://armsandthelaw.com/archives/2007/04/illinois_state.php
https://gundigest.com/article/illinois-women-advised-to-use-combs-and-keys-against-rapists

The gun group I was part of would print up "tactical tongue depressors" with a copy of that advice and the suggestion that we should pass conceal carry instead..." I'm friends with the woman quoted in the above article, and I think it was originally her idea. It embarrassed the Illinois State Police enough they took their "advice" down... (Of course they still opposed carry, because how dare anyone have an actual way to deter attackers.)

 

[wtburnette]

I want to say there was another state that had stated pi$$ing yourself prior to a rape would dissuade your attacker. Along the same line of stupidity. I'd rather a woman shoot her attacker. It's a more permanent solution.

 

[bwframe]

I appreciate the idea of staying out of areas where attackers are favored over self defense minded folks.

That said, it's kind of like flying, there could be times when it's unavoidable.

Everyone should learn to use their bright light(kubaton) and cane to effectively thwart attackers, whatever they might be armed with.

.

 

[spencer rifle]

In the Navy, you would/could take a roll of nickels (or whatever) and roll them up in your dress tie when you rolled up the tie.

I have seen references of this at least as far back as the CW.
But then, crazy sailors would also play "Fox and Geese," so I guess they had practice. One sailor would be blindfolded and given a small anvil in a tie (called a kerchief back then). He would run around the deck trying to hit other sailors. If he made hard contact, that sailor would take over until he hit someone else. Non-involved sailors said "It was quite fun to watch, but a whole 'nother thing to participate in."

 

[wcd]

That used to be on the Illinois State Police website before Illinois finally passed carry in 2013. There was a page suggesting that rape victims protect themselves by trying to throw up on their attacker.

I seem to seeing some of the same such stupidity floated in some training materials.

I really believe some liberals believe it’s better to lose your life versus trying to defend yourself, sick indeed.

 

[Rick Mason]

I appreciate the idea of staying out of areas where attackers are favored over self defense minded folks.

That said, it's kind of like flying, there could be times when it's unavoidable.

Everyone should learn to use their bright light(kubaton) and cane to effectively thwart attackers, whatever they might be armed with.

.

Emergency trip as my mother-in-law had slipped into the last stages of a coma. As we were lifting off the runway to come back home she finally passed away. My wife had to turn around with one day's rest and fly another 20 hours back to Asia. It has been a rough past month for us and the family.

 

[actaeon277]

I seem to seeing some of the same such stupidity floated in some training materials.

I really believe some liberals believe it’s better to lose your life versus trying to defend yourself, sick indeed.

Someone should point out to them, if they die, it's like a vote for Trump.

 

[wtburnette]

Emergency trip as my mother-in-law had slipped into the last stages of a coma. As we were lifting off the runway to come back home she finally passed away. My wife had to turn around with one day's rest and fly another 20 hours back to Asia. It has been a rough past month for us and the family.

My condolences to you and your family.