Pistol Optics, or NOT?

[gregkl]

You made me dig them out to check. I got ten of the 17rd ACT mags back in June for $20 apiece. Last week six used S&W 17rd mags came in from EveryGunPart.com. I got lucky on those,.....I had them in my cart from a month ago and they were all still there when EGP threw out a sale a couple of weeks ago. I checked the pics closely and weeded out any mags that looked suspect and watched for the 10rd mags to be sure I didn't get any of those. The work paid off,......all six are what I'd call 98% or better and on average cost me $18.63 each.

I haven't shot any of these mags so all I can give is a visual description and I don't have a full size M&P 9mm, just a couple of M&P Compact 9s with the 15rd grip frame so these 17rd mags extend a finger's worth when seated. Visually, the ACT mags are first rate and almost indistinguishable from the S&W mags. Finish is the same slick, hard blue. I don't know about any 'painted' finish. It's not cerakote or anything like that. Doesn't have any notable thickness to it. It's slick and all mags eject with equal vigor. The mags 'feel' quality, sharp corners, metal thickness and rigidity equal to the Smith mags. Insertion and lockup feels identical although I'm inserting 17rd mags in a 15rd magwell so if there's a problem with latch position I wouldn't be able to tell.

Just judging from 40yrs of handling and owning hundreds of pistols with both OEM and aftermarket mags,.......these things seem to be fine. I *think* they're MecGars and I *think* the OEM mags may be as well. I'd heard that rumor before. Generally I shy away from aftermarket as we all probably should. The cost of ammo necessary to prove reliability of even a 'good' aftermarket mag far overshadows the extra cost of OEM mags, but these will prove themselves on the range eventually. I've got enough OEM 15rd and 17rd mags for carry and they'll see little range use. I'll beat the ACTs and see how they hold up.

If you have the 2.0 Compact vs the 9c, you can get sleeves for the 17 rounders. I picked enough up to outfit all of my 17 rounders and they are really nice.

 

[2AOK]

I haven't shot any of these mags so all I can give is a visual description and I don't have a full size M&P 9mm, just a couple of M&P Compact 9s with the 15rd grip frame so these 17rd mags extend a finger's worth when seated.

Visually, the ACT mags are first rate and almost indistinguishable from the S&W mags. Finish is the same slick, hard blue. I don't know about any 'painted' finish. [...] Insertion and lockup feels identical although I'm inserting 17rd mags in a 15rd magwell so if there's a problem with latch position I wouldn't be able to tell.

Thanks for these details. That MidwayUSA review I quoted does not show a date, and the ACT-MAG product is discontinued, so maybe it's from a while back. Maybe ACT-MAG has changed their finish (and dimensions) since then. I'm glad yours are working well for you. The real test will be to see how they seat and eject from a full-size M9 pistol (17rnd) per the reviewer's complaint.

I *think* they're MecGars and I *think* the OEM mags may be as well. I'd heard that rumor before.

I doubt that the ACT-MAGs are Mec-Gar. Maybe, but ACT is associated with Armscor, and I don't think Mec-Gar would ever be. A guy on the S&W forums said S&W has an exclusive contract with Mec-Gar. He could be wrong, but if he's right, you won't find any Mec-Gar manufactured S&W mags sold under a different name.

 

[2AOK]

If you have the 2.0 Compact vs the 9c, you can get sleeves for the 17 rounders. I picked enough up to outfit all of my 17 rounders and they are really nice.

WHERE can I get those grip extenders for a decent price? They ought to cost about $2 a piece. I've only seen them on Ebay. Only one seller, and he wants $13. RIPOFF.

And Google doesn't understand what I'm looking for...

 

[kaveman]

....... The real test is to see how they seat and eject from a full-size M9 pistol (17rnd) per the reviewer's complaint.......

I don't own a full size 9mm but I do have a pair of M1.0 .40 full size that I just stripped the slides off of yesterday, so,.......

Slapped the OEM S&W 9mm mags into the well,.....smooth and lockup tight. Ejected strongly.

Tried the same with the ACT mags,.....smooth and lockup tight. Ejected strongly.

My M1.0 M&P40C is also sitting here fully assembled so I tried that one too. Same innie/outie and the slide stop operated normally. I'm hopeful.

 

[kaveman]

Yeah, those grip extenders are one of those items I consider to be 'throwaway money' items. I'd rather have another complete magazine than a twelve cent piece of plastic for the same money.

I have no problem getting a full grip on the Compact 15rd frame so the extra 'grip' attached to a 17rd mag would just be floating out in space anyway. Getting something to add to the super-short SubCompact might be worthwhile. I can barely get two fingers on the short grip frame, but frankly, just the extended magazine without the collar on it is just fine.

 

[2AOK]

I don't own a full size 9mm but I do have a pair of M1.0 .40 full size that I just stripped the slides off of yesterday, so,.......

Slapped the OEM S&W 9mm mags into the well,.....smooth and lockup tight. Ejected strongly.

Tried the same with the ACT mags,.....smooth and lockup tight. Ejected strongly.

Sounds like the slide is OFF the frame. You won't know for sure until you return the slide to the frame and then try the ACT mag.
Also, I don't trust a test between a .40 mag well / mag catch and 9mm mags.

 

[2AOK]

I have no problem getting a full grip on the Compact 15rd frame [...] Getting something to add to the super-short SubCompact might be worthwhile. I can barely get two fingers on the short grip frame, but frankly, just the extended magazine without the collar on it is just fine.

Ditto. I used to carry a Glock 26, and the bare extra-length mag body worked just fine. I would like the extenders for a (future) Subcompact with 17rnd backup mags. I'll call S&W and see what they say.

 

[kaveman]

Sounds like the slide is OFF the frame. You won't know for sure until you return the slide to the frame and then try the ACT mag.
Also, I don't trust a test between a .40 mag well / mag catch and 9mm mags.

Yes, that's what I said, it's just a test with the hardware I have available, unlike all your suppositions and imaginings based on your 'feels' in a vacuum. The real 'test' will come when I get a chance to shoot them with ammo, but it may still not be sufficient because I'm unlikely to run 4000rds through each magazine and test to destruction, nor am I likely to go out and purchase a full size 9mm just to disprove that other supposed 'verified' rumor you tracked down on the Midway website.

Armscor is an importer. They don't make anything so the quality of what they sell is dependent solely on the quality of what someone else makes. I don't see any connection there, but then I'm not stuck in the same fevered dream you are. A quick search shows literally hundreds in stock at several different vendors so they're still available. I can get them in quantity for under sixteen bucks a pop delivered and I think I'll go ahead and do that, setting your discomfort aside.

You have proven to be a rather tedious person to help. I'm going to go see if this forum offers a blocking feature I may take advantage of. Enjoy the rest of your day!

 

[gregkl]

WHERE can I get those grip extenders for a decent price? They ought to cost about $2 a piece. I've only seen them on Ebay. Only one seller, and he wants $13. RIPOFF.

And Google doesn't understand what I'm looking for...

I'm usually good at keeping records but I can't find where I purchased them and how much I paid. Weird. Sorry about that. I'm sure I didn't pay $13 though $2 is probably light. Can you buy anything for $2 anymore?

If I find it, I'll report back.

 

[gregkl]

Yeah, those grip extenders are one of those items I consider to be 'throwaway money' items. I'd rather have another complete magazine than a twelve cent piece of plastic for the same money.

I have no problem getting a full grip on the Compact 15rd frame so the extra 'grip' attached to a 17rd mag would just be floating out in space anyway. Getting something to add to the super-short SubCompact might be worthwhile. I can barely get two fingers on the short grip frame, but frankly, just the extended magazine without the collar on it is just fine.

We ,may be talking about the same thing but just in case, I'm not talking about an "extender" in the true sense of the term. I am talking about a piece that fills the gap you have when you insert a 17 round mag into the 2.0 Compact frame. It fills that gap. See pic below.

 

[kaveman]

Yeah, that's what we're talking about. All my Shields came with one of those in the box, along with a flush mag and a +1. I see them on ebay for the double-stack mags but they're usually priced around $17 which is a total non-starter.

For me, the carry gun is a Compact with flush fit mag and the 17rd is a spare if I carry a spare at all. No dire need for the filler in that case.

 

[2AOK]

Yes, that's what I said, it's just a test with the hardware I have available, unlike all your suppositions and imaginings based on your 'feels' in a vacuum. The real 'test' will come when I get a chance to shoot them with ammo, but it may still not be sufficient because I'm unlikely to run 4000rds through each magazine and test to destruction, nor am I likely to go out and purchase a full size 9mm just to disprove that other supposed 'verified' rumor you tracked down on the Midway website.

Armscor is an importer. They don't make anything so the quality of what they sell is dependent solely on the quality of what someone else makes. I don't see any connection there, but then I'm not stuck in the same fevered dream you are. A quick search shows literally hundreds in stock at several different vendors so they're still available. I can get them in quantity for under sixteen bucks a pop delivered and I think I'll go ahead and do that, setting your discomfort aside.

You have proven to be a rather tedious person to help. I'm going to go see if this forum offers a blocking feature I may take advantage of. Enjoy the rest of your day!

Ouch.

Online forums are for discussion.

Guys who are new to a forum did not just arrive on the planet. They may have lots of experience of which you're not aware.

I don't come here for help; I'm here for discussion. I made a couple of valid points regarding your experiments, and that seems to have triggered you. Sorry.

Many people here have unique points of view. I guess some are not comfortable disagreeing with someone else's perspective. I don't feel that way. I have lots of firearms experience and I enjoy kicking these ideas around. I don't expect to agree with everyone, or for anyone to agree with me. Disagreement provides a basis for lots of good ideas, and I'm just engaging in that. If you think the process is tedious, maybe you're in the wrong place...

Whatever Armscor is today, years ago that firm was involved in some half-baked products. I hope they're doing better now and I hope ACT-MAG magazines are the equal of S&W factory mags. Mec-Gar has an excellent reputation worldwide, so I don't see why they would associate their good name with Armscor. And I'm not sure why that offends you.

I'm pretty sure there IS a blocking feature.

 

[2AOK]

i am talking about a piece that fills the gap you have when you insert a 17 round mag into the 2.0 Compact frame. See pic below.
View attachment 220108

Thanks for the picture (worth 1000 words).

ANNOUNCEMENT

I SPOKE WITH S&W CUSTOMER SUPPORT TODAY.

THEY SELL THE "GRIP SLEEVE EXTENDERS" FOR $1.00 EACH.

THEY SHOULD PROBABLY ADVERTISE THAT SOMEWHERE...

ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS CALL THEM AND ORDER WHICHEVER VARIANT(S) YOU WANT.

1-800-331-0852 (3)

 

[gregkl]

Thanks for the picture (worth 1000 words).

ANNOUNCEMENT

I SPOKE WITH S&W CUSTOMER SUPPORT TODAY.

THEY SELL THE "GRIP SLEEVE EXTENDERS" FOR $1.00 EACH.

THEY SHOULD PROBABLY ADVERTISE THAT SOMEWHERE...

ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS CALL THEM UP AND ORDER WHICHEVER VARIANT(S) YOU WANT.

1-800-331-0852 (3)

That's where I got them from! You just reminded me. That's the reason I couldn't find any email confirmations or shipping notices. They didn't send me anything. I also got some springs and a striker assembly of which they didn't charge me anything.

 

[gregkl]

That's where I got them from! You just reminded me. That's the reason I couldn't find any email confirmations or shipping notices. They didn't send me anything. I knew they couldn't have cost that much. I got 10-12 and if they were expensive I wouldn't have bought them.

I also got some springs and a striker assembly of which they didn't charge me anything.

 

[MrNewVegas]

I like optics but I don't use them anymore...I had a trijicon on my sig for a good long time but it started to act up and had to send it in to get fixed...I realized real quick that I had become dependent on it and took me a few hours to gain back my sight picture and techniques with irons...still have not put it back on

 

[ditcherman]

I like optics but I don't use them anymore...I had a trijicon on my sig for a good long time but it started to act up and had to send it in to get fixed...I realized real quick that I had become dependent on it and took me a few hours to gain back my sight picture and techniques with irons...still have not put it back on

That’s an interesting perspective, never heard of someone going back, and the Trijicons are supposed to be the most fail safe, to boot.
I like not being dependent on alcohol, drugs, caffeine, but red dots? Sure, gimme some.

 

[2AOK]

I like optics but I don't use them anymore...I had a trijicon on my sig for a good long time but it started to act up and had to send it in to get fixed...I realized real quick that I had become dependent on it and took me a few hours to gain back my sight picture and techniques with irons...still have not put it back on

Amen:
1) Don't want to be dependent on the dot
2) Electroncs can fail, and will, eventually

I watched a Mrgunsngear video on YT wherein he uttered the following heinous, blasphemous, derogatory slur, "...seems like some folks are trying to buy skills..."

OMG!!! =O

That said, I admit that my Sig Romeo 5 is on its way back to me after near-INSTANTANEOUS servicing(!) by Sig Sauer. So yeah, I see the benefits, but on the other hand, that red dot optic stopped working for no apparent reason...and had to be sent back for servicing.

I'm sure you've all seen THIS VIDEO of the 80-year-old liquor store owner blasting a homeboy with his trusty shotgun (M590 me thinks). Homie be wielding a stolen AR with a red dot sight on it. Being a stolen weapon, he's probably never fired it.

Homie took a long time setting up his shot. Do ya think maybe he was having trouble finding the dot?

FWIW, the shop owner had no optics.

"HE BLEW MY ARM OFF!!!
HE BLEW MY ARM OFF!!!!!
AAAAARHGH!!!!!!"

 

[Gabriel]

I never really cared to have a dot on my handgun, but my employer is talking of replacing some of our duty weapons with some with dots (and then replacing them all if we like the initial 18). I'm the one that is going to have to do the training for the transition. Because of this, I just bought a Glock 19 MOS, which I will pick up tomorrow due to always being delayed. I bought a super cheap PA red dot to mount on it ( I wanted an ACRO P-2, but couldn't find one in stock anywhere ) to see how I like it and to start training with so I have time with one before we get them next year.

I'm still not sold on red dots on handguns, but time will tell if I change my mind. With an astygmatism and older eyes ( have been using readers for the last few years ) I may end up not liking it.

 

[gregkl]

I never really cared to have a dot on my handgun, but my employer is talking of replacing some of our duty weapons with some with dots (and then replacing them all if we like the initial 18). I'm the one that is going to have to do the training for the transition. Because of this, I just bought a Glock 19 MOS, which I will pick up tomorrow due to always being delayed. I bought a super cheap PA red dot to mount on it ( I wanted an ACRO P-2, but couldn't find one in stock anywhere ) to see how I like it and to start training with so I have time with one before we get them next year.

I'm still not sold on red dots on handguns, but time will tell if I change my mind. With an astygmatism and older eyes ( have been using readers for the last few years ) I may end up not liking it.

The astigmatism may be an issue depending on how bad it is, but the need for readers (like me) doesn't negatively affect using a dot.

Actually it helps because it removes having to either wear readers while shooting irons or looking at a fuzzy front sight.

I have switched back to my dot beginning last weekend. What I thought was a dot issue was a crappy factory trigger issue.