Our Nation’s Teachers Are Hustling to Survive

[thunderchicken]

I can think of several public employees that complain even more.

Examples??

 

[Ziggidy]

Teachers used to be special people when they taught students. Somehwere along the line they began to puff up their chests and stand tall on a pedestal they built for themselves, all supported and encouraged by the teachers union.

Teachers are not special people today and as a majority (collectively) they are the scum of the barrel. Now, before I hear about it, there are many many good - EXCELLENT teachers, but to be honest, majority suck.

More money? Easier workload? Better benefits? Welcome to the world. I have no sympathy for the whiners, crybabies, self righteous teachers who want to indoctrinate our children. They want to teach THIER politicis, viewpoints, agendas and leave the basics reading writing and arithmetic to the parent.

Our children are failing in basic studies because they are being used as opportunities to spread an agenda rather than taught basic education.

They would rather indoctrinate your 5 years old child with thoughts of gender change than teach them their ABC's.

How do teachers today teach basic English? Personal Pronouns?

 

[eldirector]

A series of questionable financial decisions, and I am supposed to "feel" for an entire industry?

None of the teachers that I know personally have a "side hustle". They all make pretty decent wages, and live well.

Sounds like spending good money on a low-wage degree, accepting a low-wage (below poverty level) job, starting a family, all while working a SECOND low-wage job, all over the course of what, 20+ years?.... Might not be the best possible series of decisions. But, to each their own. This may be a dream lifestyle of some.

 

[chipbennett]

I think the degree requirements come from the state dept of education and while I agree that it shouldn't take a 4-year education to teach elementary school what IS the minimum education requirement?

How about a high school diploma and an elementary education certification program?

Also not advocating for a six-figure salary for elementary teachers but again the article even included polling which suggests many teachers would enjoy simple $10k increase which is probably about all they're making from their side gig. This would allow them to maintain their current standard without sacrificing every waking moment just to survive.

Again: blame the local school boards, who hire too many administrators and then overpay them, thereby consuming 2/3 of the state's K-12 funds disbursed to the local school districts. There is plenty of money for teachers in the budget already. If you want to see a change, run for your local school board and make it happen.

 

[chipbennett]

You do have a point that affects more than we would think.

I counsel young married couples in financial distress. Many are bright, at least partially college educated with reasonable jobs. You are right, they are clueless. With all the accredited public schools, how could that happen? A simple 8th grade home ec. class would have given them the tools to manage.

"We cannot afford baby diapers", but you look at their lifestyle, 3 or 4 starbucks drinks is $25 or $30 a day, $600 a month. For coffee. Buy a coffee pot and a bag of sugar. I carry a pint thermos in my brief case. They think $250 for a dinner and a show on a regular basis is a Constitutional right. Add a couple of $400 to $500 car payments and school loans, and they have no margin to absorb double gas prices and higher taxes, or buy diapers. The truly sad cases are the ones with no skills, very little incomes that are already eating Ramen noodles and drinking tap water, that also happen to be pregnant again.

We homeschool. Our girls are in 9th and 7th grade. Our oldest is completing a year of Algebra. After this year, her math will be of the applied variety: budgeting, accounting, taxes, investing, etc. (She loves graphic design, so as she continues to develop that skill set, she'll inherently develop geometry and other forms of math - again, in a practical-application manner.)

 

[chipbennett]

There are a few colleges out there, Hillsdale comes to mind.

And there are many, many career options that are viable without a four-year degree. I have said before: I am pretty much at a point that, if you're not going into a STEM field, a 4-year college degree is very likely not to yield a sufficient ROI.

 

[chipbennett]

I have always had multiple revenue streams and I was a union scale HVAC tech. If you want more, you go out and get it. That means working more.

Until about 8 years ago, I always maintained 1-2 side jobs - and that, as an engineer. It was important for our family that we could live as a single-income-source family (i.e. that my wife would not have to work).

I believe summer break is closer to 2 months now.

Here in Avon, it seems like it's closer to 6 weeks. Year-round school is here, and it's stupid. (Another benefit of homeschooling: our girls get an actual, summer break. Our school year goes from Labor Day to Memorial Day.)

 

[JR50]

For the last twenty years my side job has been teaching at the college level -- strictly for the money so my wife didn't need to work and could take care of our daughter and, later, our grand kids (Long story.) The behavior of some of these college students make me think I'm severely under paid but as a manufacturing manager, I need the cash.

 

[Ingomike]

I have worked a career as a mechanical engineer, and as an elementary school librarian, so I have had a view of working in industrial settings as well as in schools.

The average person in an industrial setting doesn't work even half as hard as a typical school teacher. They literally have no idea what it is like, simply finding time to use the bathroom is a challenge. Those of you who think it is so easy probably wouldn't last a week.

Starting salaries are woefully inadequate both for the prerequisites and for the actual job, it is simply not worth it.

All of that said, the dirty little secret is that it is the teacher's unions that are to blame for the situation.

As I said , starting salaries are horrible, but it increases each year. Once you have 10 years in you are making pretty decent money, 20 years and you are overpaid. Guess who are the officers in the union? Yep, teacher's with 20 years in. Guess which group gets the lion's share of any additional money negotiated with the school district?

It is the teacher's union that negotiates a system where two teachers doing the exact same job have wildly different salaries based on seniority. It allows them to always get the media to report on how woefully inadequate starting salaries are, which is true, but hides the facts about how much the veteran teachers are actually making.

It's certainly not unheard of for companies to pay different people different salaries based on seniority, or whatever reason, but it is out of the ordinary for two people with the exact same job title and the exact same job responsibilities to be in a situation where one of them is making twice as much money as the other. That is not uncommon in schools.

I, personally, have attended union meetings where the leadership outright lied to the membership about salary negotiations where the bulk of the money went to the senior teachers, which was easily verified if you did the math on the salary schedules. It's all a shell game.

The previous comments about the administrations is also right on target. I have witnessed steadily increasing medical insurance costs passed on to teachers, while the admin continued to receive free health care. Layoffs of teachers while admins that served no purpose kept their positions.

It's truly a shame. There are a lot of outstanding young teachers that leave the profession because they are so poorly paid, while older teachers that are just waiting for their pension to kick in are doing quite well. Likewise, a lot of great mid-range teachers get priced out because they moved due to a spouse changing job and they can't compete with the cheap salaries paid to beginning teachers and the union rules don't allow them to work for less than seniority dictates.

It would be great if the administrations and the teacher's union put the needs of the kids first, but that is all too often not the case.

I believe this the best explanation of the situation in the thread. Thanks for posting it.

 

[yeahbaby]

There are lots of degrees that do not lead to high paying jobs. Teachers are not unique in that.

I retired from a University. I saw LOTS of students getting degrees that would not apply to decent paying jobs. And the cost to attend the University was not cheap. I had students who worked for me that graduated with engineering or nursing degrees. They went on to jobs that in some cases paid more than what I was earning.

 

[ditcherman]

Don’t even start. Wife is special Ed. She’s there before everyone else and usually there after. Writing IEP’s on a constantly changing state program on evenings and weekends. Summer comes she’s out, period. Standard elem Ed show up 15 minutes before the kids and are gone right after the last bus leaves. They get a paid prep in the day to get ready. They’re teaching the same stuff at the same time every year so after year 1 it gets pretty simple.

To have a 185 day work year, make 90k a year? Yeah. Sorry. Not dealing sorry for you. I’ve been working 40+ hour weeks since I was 18, never had more than 2 weeks off at any one time ever. Are there **** school districts? Yep. Are there their opposites? Yep. Make your own choices. Live with them and stop expecting me to cover your poor choices.

The threads not about anyone asking you to cover anyones poor choices.

Glad your wife makes 90k a year, I guess.
Like others have said, my wife can barely find time to go to the bathroom, feels lucky if she gets 10 minutes to sit and have lunch, but would never even expect that to be uninterrupted. She's there 1 1/2 hours early and usually at least that late, and she's not the exception in the building. Also constantly dealing with IEP's and trying to get the special ed department and others to get them seen.
New curriculum most every year, and much of it requires more and more work on her end at home. And to be clear, we're talking kindergarten here. She's taught about 10 years and making mid 40's, no way she'll reach close to 6 figures before she retires, and her retirement won't be like some speculate on here.
And here's the thing, she doesn't have to work at all, she wants to do this.

People need to stop putting everyone else in their own tidy little idea of a box.

The exception is the well paid teacher, maybe there should be a little more balance between the well paid ones just doing the minimum to get to retirement and the ones just starting out so we could get more quality people starting out.

I will also add another difference that is huge from one district to another is the culture, CRT, pronouns, religion, all of it is district dependent.

 

[ditcherman]

E learning has been statically proven to be a failure aside from adverse social impact it has on students.

One thing it does prove is who is a dedicated parent and not a drug addled sloth or a parent that expects the school to teach them everything and let them off the hook. That could be more valuable societally than any day missed or not at school, to let parents know they still need to parent.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

Starting salaries are woefully inadequate both for the prerequisites and for the actual job, it is simply not worth it.

See my post above. $47k+ starting salary with 2 months off in the summer and 4 weeks+ off during the work year is woefully inadequate? Don't take off more than one sick/personal day a month add $3k to that. Here is a link to the contract.

https://www.garycsc.k12.in.us/wp-content/uploads/2021/12/20211227094815502.pdf

 

[hoosierdoc]

Curious, what is "retirement" income for a public school teacher? I could not understand the calculators. Are there benefits beyond a simple pension?

 

[churchmouse]

Until about 8 years ago, I always maintained 1-2 side jobs - and that, as an engineer. It was important for our family that we could live as a single-income-source family (i.e. that my wife would not have to work).

Here in Avon, it seems like it's closer to 6 weeks. Year-round school is here, and it's stupid. (Another benefit of homeschooling: our girls get an actual, summer break. Our school year goes from Labor Day to Memorial Day.)

I had steady side work in the HVAC service/install trade. It was my day job and filled some time after hours. I actually did very well with the side work.
Also involved in racing with professional teams as a dedicated weekend warrior which paid well but took me to all corners of the country several weekends through the racing season.
One of my racing friends and next door neighbor and I had a very active shop where we built High performance Harley engines and did complete bikes. We also built and maintained some serious power for a few local bracket racers.
I was a sleep when you die kind of guy as was my racing partners. We even found time to build and race our own USAC midgets and my drag bikes and cars over the years.

If you want more that means unless you are a born rich guy you work harder.

We worked our butts off.

 

[littletommy]

And let’s not forget, there are some people that actually LIKE to work all time.

I think the article in the OP is typical media shrieking about something they think is unfair, and I’ll guarantee you that some of the teachers who are working side gigs are doing so because they plan to retire at a certain age, or maybe they’re doing it to help out a family member or friend that owns a small business.

There are a lot of reasons someone might choose to work a second job besides the “I’ve made **** poor decisions and now I HAVE To work a second job to survive.

 

[ditcherman]

Curious, what is "retirement" income for a public school teacher? I could not understand the calculators. Are there benefits beyond a simple pension?

It is a formula based on years in service and age, I will get some details when my wife gets home. It not unusual for her to spend her Sunday afternoon/evening at school prepping, but this week is spring break so she’s enjoying the grandkids today.

 

[ditcherman]

And let’s not forget, there are some people that actually LIKE to work all time.

I think the article in the OP is typical media shrieking about something they think is unfair, and I’ll guarantee you that some of the teachers who are working side gigs are doing so because they plan to retire at a certain age, or maybe they’re doing it to help out a family member or friend that owns a small business.

There are a lot of reasons someone might choose to work a second job besides the “I’ve made **** poor decisions and now I HAVE To work a second job to survive.

That’s me, I like what I do and live it.

I want to clarify my position some, my only beef is with the assumption of working hours, it’s like driving a truck long haul, it looks good until you divide the hours and then it’s like $8 an hour, literally, that’s what my wife’s first semester usually looks like. Second semester the little heathens are lined around a bit better.
It’s the hours assumed worked vs the actual hours worked.
And that translates to not having the best and brightest as teachers but moving on to something else.

 

[ditcherman]

See my post above. $47k+ starting salary with 2 months off in the summer and 4 weeks+ off during the work year is woefully inadequate? Don't take off more than one sick/personal day a month add $3k to that. Here is a link to the contract.

https://www.garycsc.k12.in.us/wp-content/uploads/2021/12/20211227094815502.pdf

My wife started at 36ish 10 years ago, new hires are coming in this year at low/mid 40’s, same as she’s making.
That’s a great morale booster too. /p

 

[JCSR]

I worked with craftsmen, electricians, millwrights, pipe fitters and others that chose to have farms, cattle and side gigs. Every one of them made plenty to provide for their families. But that didn't stop them from b*tchin' and moanin' about they had to mow hay or plant on the weekends. It's all about choices folks. Figger it out !