Open carry at Cabela's

[jsgolfman]

The original topic was about open carry at Cabela's and the OP asked for any thoughts on it. He actually got a few then it digressed into those that CC attacking the choice to OC. I was amazed when I made my first comment and am still amazed now that he gets more grief from a bunch of supporters of the second amendment, then he did during his shopping experience. Is it any wonder we are fighting an uphill battle? If you've got personal reasons to CC instead of OC, fine, but don't represent opinion as fact when providing that reason. I OC most of the time, but do CC at times. My reasons are my own, as are yours. He didn't brandish his weapon or create a disturbance to bring attention to himself.

 

[turnandshoot4]

Jack Ryan:

Putting on a show wasn't what I was doing. There is no "same difference" on the issue. If it was I'd be talking about what pistol it was, how much it cost, etc. etc.

Carrying a pistol always has to do with self defense. OC'ing also has the benefits of comfort, better access to the weapon, AS WELL AS being able to talk to people about guns and why they are important in our society.

There was no "preaching" involved. Just some good conversation.

My goal was accomplished. I OC'd. I don't set out to talk to people. I am just receptive to conversation. I never walk up to someone and say "Hey! Do you want to talk about your 2a rights?!" I don't think the people who work the gun counter make $5 per hour. I may have listened to the person at the counter but I have learned from my experience. That alone is good enough for me.

To Waloidian

"its quite clear that even gun owners have such a strong reaction to oc and cc...this should be a sign that the general public is going to have an even stronger reaction..." They might have a strong reaciton. I believe that reaction is due to a media that puts a negative spin on firearm ownership. We (firearms owners) need to stand up for our rights. It's easy to get on here and talk about how great the 2a is. You are preaching to the choir here. If the PUBLIC is more aware of their rights then they will be less likely to take them away. I am not ranting at you at all. Thanks for your input!

To Nate IU:

"He said that in public he has answered a multitude of questions from people. Just because one store clerk doesn't like it he should abandon all hope? Oh, and he also said that the only place he has ever run into so much chastising is HERE. " This is true and has been disregarded. I will be back and now I have the necessary tools in place.

To 4 Sarge

I'd rep you for this but I can't. I need to spread some rep. Anyone want to comment on this?

To Waloidian:

I am prepared for attention, good or bad. Now I am even more prepared, as I know what Cabela's store policy is.

To Michiana:

"If I am CC in a store and a situation arises I have the option of taking action or standing by; if I am OC I have to assume that the bad guy has seen my gun and that immediately drags me into the situation. I would rather have the option be left to me." For me there is no choice here. Pregnant women get shot, IN THE BELLY, during a "peaceful" armed robbery in a bank(they ever find that guy?). I will not stand by and take that chance. That is someone's wife/sister/mother/father/brother/son. I am no cowboy looking for trouble here. Just someone fed up with people that stand by while a WWII vet gets beaten while his car is stolen. Fed up with a country that stands by as people are killed/raped/beaten.
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." (Edmund Burke)

Thanks everyone for your input. It has opened my eyes!!!!
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[Michiana]

There is no right or wrong in how you carry, just when OC is proper.

I understand. You prefer to ignore fact and base your choices on unsubstantiated opinion. You get your facts from where? Please include links to the pages you are referencing. Thanks.

Is that why Michiana uses such big print?I use it because I like it. Are you now the type size expert too?

Yes, and I also stated that the older I get the more I realize that CC is wrong. You simply edited and parsed my words to suit your needs. Obama, if you listen to him carefully, did the same thing. I have no respect for him because of that. Sorry, CC is not WRONG, I am reading that it is not your choice of carry; there is no right or wrong way to carry in this discussion; only when and where is OC a proper thing to do, and when do you press your right to do so, which was the main topic of this thread.

 

[singlestacksig]

Rhino, the problem is the "shot first because of a gun" factor is not recorded in many crimes..
There have been cases of armed guards being targeted , that would be non LEO, and other cases of persons known to have a gun being targeted just for the gun..
but with out a good ay to search the origenal police reports, one is not going to find that data..

Many interviews have been done with criminals in prisons who stated that the presence of a gun or the expectation of a gun cause them to find easier prey.

Find one documented incident of a non-police officer being specifically targeted first because they were openly carrying a gun. Good luck with that.

People being targeted first because they have an exposed gun is based on unsubstantiated fear and myth. Criminals being deterred by the presence of a weapon is documented fact.

 

[Jack Ryan]

Jack, I think you are way off base on this. You are confusing his lack of achieving his goal with his intended purpose. First off, he did fail to achieve his objective, but that is related to his lack of firm knowledge of the store policy. Had he had a better grasp of the store policy he could have used the 1st Amendment to better defend O.C. So we chalk that up to knowledge, and he knows now what he didn't know then. Fine. Next time he can achieve his goal.

First you tell me I AM confused, then spend a whole paragraph telling me what I just said?

So, are you bitching at him because you don't like open carry (object of the mission)?

I'm not bitching, I'm educating him, and I don't CARE one way or the other if you, him, or any one else open carries or what ever. My own opinion is the whole concept of giving NAMES to how a person carries something is ridiculous.

Are you slapping him because he failed his mission and needs to be better prepared before walking into the store next time?

Exactly what is your objection? Because to fail a mission does not related to the object of the mission. Failure relates to the preparation, tactics and training. The object of the mission is simply his motive.

When failure makes the "mission" more difficult or as in this case accomplished the complete opposite by some one arrogant enough to think they seve the role of "educating" the whole rest of the public populace when in fact they are ignorant of the very subject they propose to educate every one else on, I object.

He just happened to be the one to stand up and in my opinion, announce in public once again, "I am ignorant of something I think I am an expert on".

The fact is his buddy knew what he was doing and behaved accordingly. He is the one who desearves the apllause.

 

[melensdad]

Rhino, the problem is the "shot first because of a gun" factor is not recorded in many crimes..

and other cases of persons known to have a gun being targeted just for the gun..

Please cite any source of evidence to prove this.

I'm not bitching, I'm educating him...

No, I don't think so. But if you call that educating then we'll have to agree to disagree.

When failure makes the "mission" more difficult or as in this case accomplished the complete opposite by some one arrogant enough to think they seve the role of "educating" the whole rest of the public populace when in fact they are ignorant of the very subject they propose to educate every one else on, I object.

First, you don't know him, I do. He is not arrogant. In fact he is a soft spoken, good natured guy. Second, he did not accomplish the opposite, as you state, he simply didn't accomplish his goal and did not contest his carry mode he simply complied. Had he created a scene with others watching, and ultimately complied, then he probably would have accomplished the opposite. But there is no evidence to suggest that occurred.

He just happened to be the one to stand up and in my opinion, announce in public once again, "I am ignorant of something I think I am an expert on".

Again, you are making a rash judgment. He may not have known the store policy but he was not out to contest it, he was out to talk to people about OC. He failed only that, nothing more. It was not a public scene, so there was no public announcement of anything. Nice exaggeration on your part.

The fact is his buddy knew what he was doing and behaved accordingly. He is the one who desearves the apllause.

You are making a giant illogical leap. Perhaps his buddy is simply uncomfortable with OC.

 

[KDUBCR250]

Holy crap 9 pages !!! WTF carry however you want in Indiana we are aloud to so do witch ever And to the guy who started this topic next time you are going to the store let me know Ill OC with you !!! IMO from your post you had NO ATTITUDE !!!

 

[Michiana]

debate over

Great debate; final score as follows:

Fringe element OC people -0-


Conservative average gun owners -1-


Happy Holidays to one and all, let’s end this thread and move on, we beat the dead horse enough.

 

[NateIU10]

Great debate; final score as follows:

Fringe element OC people -0-


Conservative average gun owners -1-


Happy Holidays to one and all, let’s end this thread and move on, we beat the dead horse enough.

You obviously have a comprehension problem Nothing like reverting to multiple personal attacks on me, then just ending the thread by calling us all "fringe elements." I don't think you should be able to own a gun at all. Owning one makes you a fringe element to me. They should all be illegal.

Fringe element gun owners- 0
Normal, sane, non-gun owners- 1

You argue nothing of fact sir.

 

[ATM]

0 > -1

FTW!

 

[KDUBCR250]

OC wins we draw faster

 

[NateIU10]

0 > -1

FTW!

 

[Michiana]

It's time to bury this thread

You argue nothing of fact sir.

Fact, people who advocate open carry in family type stores to "prove a point" are a very tiny percentage of the gun owners in this country, therefore a fringe element. I appreciate the opportunities I have living in the State of Indiana to carry a firearm and try not to be obnoxious about it; I am considerate of my fellow citizens, and am respected by my peers which include customers of mine and many people on this forum. Your personal opinion of me means zero.

 

[NateIU10]

Fact, people who advocate open carry in family type stores to "prove a point" are a very tiny percentage of the gun owners in this country, therefore a fringe element. I appreciate the opportunities I have living in the State of Indiana to carry a firearm and try not to be obnoxious about it; I am considerate of my fellow citizens, and am respected by my peers which include customers of mine and many people on this forum. Your personal opinion of me means zero.

Fact, people who don't carry guns outnumber those who do, so everyone that carries a gun is a fringe element.

It's not to "prove a point", it's to exercise our rights and perhaps inform inquisitive people.

Should people who are members of a minority group (ala KKK) be allowed to protest in public? Of course, it's THEIR RIGHT, as it is our to OC

 

[Michiana]

Fact, people who don't carry guns outnumber those who do, so everyone that carries a gun is a fringe element. It's not to "prove a point", it's to exercise our rights and perhaps inform inquisitive people. Should people who are members of a minority group (ala KKK) be allowed to protest in public? Of course, it's THEIR RIGHT, as it is our to OC

One last suggestion for you; why don't you join the US Army or Marines and then you can march around to your hearts content with a gun and get all this silly stuff out of your system. That way you won't be scaring soccer moms and little kids in stores and restaurants and will have to deal with real men.

 

[Scutter01]

It's clear that there is no common ground between the two sides of this argument. Furthermore, both sides have made their point numerous times and there doesn't appear to be any resolution forthcoming. I'm closing this thread as it has drifted horribly off-topic and it seems to be spiraling downward again.