New BATF ruling on stabilizing braces today

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  • BR8818

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    I'm certainly not going to claim I'm an NFA expert, but I do have quite a bit of experience with NFA items. I've never seen any info stating that simply removing the short barrel turns a registered/approved SBR lower receiver back to a title 1 firearm. Please share the info on that.

    Certainly it can be un-registered by simply notifying the ATF and then at that point it becomes a regular title1 lower receiver, but that differs from what you are describing.
    Gonna be long one

    The ATF FAQ used to include all of this before it was redesigned:

    Q: May I transfer the receiver of a short-barrel rifle or shotgun to an FFL or to an individual as I would any GCA firearm?
    A: Yes. A weapon that does not meet the definition of a NFA firearm is not subject to the NFA and a possessor or transferor needn't comply with NFA requirements. The firearm is considered a GCA firearm and may be transferred under the provisions of that law.

    Q: Who is responsible for notifying the NFA Branch when I transfer the GCA firearm to a FFL or another individual?
    A: There is no requirement that the transferor or transferee of a GCA firearm notify the NFA branch of a transfer or that either party determine whether the firearm was previously registered under the NFA. There is no also no requirement for the registrant or possessor of a NFA firearm to notify ATF of the removal of features that caused the firearm to be subject to the NFA; however, ATF recommends the owner notify the NFA Branch in writing if a firearm is permanently removed from the NFA.

    Q: What is the registered part of a Short Barreled Rifle (SBR) or Short Barreled Shotgun (SBS)?
    A: While a receiver alone may be classified as a firearm under the Gun Control Act (GCA), SBRs and SBSs are classified in totality under the National Firearms Act (NFA). A firearm that meets the definition of a SBR consists of a rifle that has a barrel less than 16 inches in length. A SBS consists of a shotgun that has a barrel less than 18 inches in length. The serialized receiver is recorded for registration in the National Firearms Registration and Transfer Record (NFRTR).

    Q: I possess a properly registered SBR or SBS. I intend to strip the receiver and remove the barrel prior to selling the receiver. Is the bare receiver still subject to regulation under the NFA as a SBR or SBS?
    A: A stripped receiver without a barrel does not meet the definition of a SBR or SBS under the NFA. Although the previously registered firearm would remain registered unless the possessor notified the NFA Branch of the change, there is no provision in statute or regulation requiring registration of a firearm without a barrel because its physical characteristics would make it only a GCA firearm pursuant to 18 U.S.C. § 921(a)(3)(B). If the subsequent owner buys the receiver as a GCA firearm and installs a barrel less than 16 inches in length (SBR) or 18 inches in length (SBS), the firearm would be subject to a $200 making tax and registration under the NFA by the manufacturer or maker of the SBR or SBS. Because registration depends upon the stated intent of the applicant, there is no provision to allow registration of a NFA firearm by anyone other than the maker or manufacturer.

    Q: If I remove the short barrel from the registered SBR or SBS, is the receiver still subject to NFA transfer and possession regulations?
    A: If the possessor retains control over the barrel or other parts required to assemble the SBR or SBS, the firearm would still be subject to NFA transfer and possession regulations. ATF recommends contacting State law enforcement officials to ensure compliance with state and local law.

    Q: Does the installation of a barrel over 16 inches in length (SBR) or 18 inches in length (SBS) remove the firearm from the purview of the NFA? If so, is this considered a permanent change?
    A: Installation of a barrel greater than 16 inches in length (SBR) or 18 inches in length (SBS) will remove the firearm from the purview of the NFA provided the registrant does not maintain control over the parts necessary to reconfigure the firearm as a SBR or SBS.
     

    yotehunt

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    ^ The SBR is no longer an SBR when 16 inch barrel or longer. But its still a registered NFA item, just not fitting the criteria at the moment.

    You have to notify ATF under certain transportation modes, but you could leave the barrel at home and put carbine on and travel. That is also supposed to not be permanent.

    And the wording I last saw on selling NFA as class 1, atf says highly recommended the seller notify them. Being a retired Gov guy, thats talk for not required but still liable.
     

    BR8818

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    ^ The SBR is no longer an SBR when 16 inch barrel or longer. But its still a registered NFA item, just not fitting the criteria at the moment.

    You have to notify ATF under certain transportation modes, but you could leave the barrel at home and put carbine on and travel. That is also supposed to not be permanent.

    And the wording I last saw on selling NFA as class 1, atf says highly recommended the seller notify them. Being a retired Gov guy, thats talk for not required but still liable.

    So now I'm right all of sudden NOT REQUIRED.
     

    millsusaf

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    Gonna be long one

    The ATF FAQ used to include all of this before it was redesigned:

    Q: May I transfer the receiver of a short-barrel rifle or shotgun to an FFL or to an individual as I would any GCA firearm?
    A: Yes. A weapon that does not meet the definition of a NFA firearm is not subject to the NFA and a possessor or transferor needn't comply with NFA requirements. The firearm is considered a GCA firearm and may be transferred under the provisions of that law.

    Q: Who is responsible for notifying the NFA Branch when I transfer the GCA firearm to a FFL or another individual?
    A: There is no requirement that the transferor or transferee of a GCA firearm notify the NFA branch of a transfer or that either party determine whether the firearm was previously registered under the NFA. There is no also no requirement for the registrant or possessor of a NFA firearm to notify ATF of the removal of features that caused the firearm to be subject to the NFA; however, ATF recommends the owner notify the NFA Branch in writing if a firearm is permanently removed from the NFA.

    Q: What is the registered part of a Short Barreled Rifle (SBR) or Short Barreled Shotgun (SBS)?
    A: While a receiver alone may be classified as a firearm under the Gun Control Act (GCA), SBRs and SBSs are classified in totality under the National Firearms Act (NFA). A firearm that meets the definition of a SBR consists of a rifle that has a barrel less than 16 inches in length. A SBS consists of a shotgun that has a barrel less than 18 inches in length. The serialized receiver is recorded for registration in the National Firearms Registration and Transfer Record (NFRTR).

    Q: I possess a properly registered SBR or SBS. I intend to strip the receiver and remove the barrel prior to selling the receiver. Is the bare receiver still subject to regulation under the NFA as a SBR or SBS?
    A: A stripped receiver without a barrel does not meet the definition of a SBR or SBS under the NFA. Although the previously registered firearm would remain registered unless the possessor notified the NFA Branch of the change, there is no provision in statute or regulation requiring registration of a firearm without a barrel because its physical characteristics would make it only a GCA firearm pursuant to 18 U.S.C. § 921(a)(3)(B). If the subsequent owner buys the receiver as a GCA firearm and installs a barrel less than 16 inches in length (SBR) or 18 inches in length (SBS), the firearm would be subject to a $200 making tax and registration under the NFA by the manufacturer or maker of the SBR or SBS. Because registration depends upon the stated intent of the applicant, there is no provision to allow registration of a NFA firearm by anyone other than the maker or manufacturer.

    Q: If I remove the short barrel from the registered SBR or SBS, is the receiver still subject to NFA transfer and possession regulations?
    A: If the possessor retains control over the barrel or other parts required to assemble the SBR or SBS, the firearm would still be subject to NFA transfer and possession regulations. ATF recommends contacting State law enforcement officials to ensure compliance with state and local law.

    Q: Does the installation of a barrel over 16 inches in length (SBR) or 18 inches in length (SBS) remove the firearm from the purview of the NFA? If so, is this considered a permanent change?
    A: Installation of a barrel greater than 16 inches in length (SBR) or 18 inches in length (SBS) will remove the firearm from the purview of the NFA provided the registrant does not maintain control over the parts necessary to reconfigure the firearm as a SBR or SBS.

    Thank you. I learned something new today.

    It seems messed up. I'd hate to be the buyer of an unknown registered SBR lower and get into some issue. LEO runs the serial number, and it comes back on the registry. It's a useful function if you only have 1 lower and want to travel without getting permission first though, I guess.
     

    Haven

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    This Lawyer seems to say that a lot of what is being discussed in this thread and others is a bit of panic without cause.
     
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    bobzilla

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    Brownswhitanon.

    This Lawyer seems to say that a lot of what is being discussed in this thread and others is a bit of panic without cause.

    So making a different ruling that makes millions of people felons is “without cause”? Huh. I’d hate to see what makes your criteria
     

    Haven

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    So making a different ruling that makes millions of people felons is “without cause”? Huh. I’d hate to see what makes your criteria
    Well the video, if you watched it, talks about two claims.

    Claim 1) That if you have an imported pistol that came with a brace, you have to destroy it. He claims that isn't the case.
    Claim 2) That if it takes more than 88 days for the background check that you will be a felon and have given the ATF proof of your felony. Again claims that isn't the case.
     

    BR8818

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    Thank you. I learned something new today.

    It seems messed up. I'd hate to be the buyer of an unknown registered SBR lower and get into some issue. LEO runs the serial number, and it comes back on the registry. It's a useful function if you only have 1 lower and want to travel without getting permission first though, I guess.
    No problem, if a LEO ran a lower you bought and found it was a SBR registered to the previous owner. It doesn't matter and is perfectly legal as long as you didn't buy it from the previous owner in an SBR configuration without a form 4.

    If the guy you bought it from sold it to you either stripped or as a rifle w/barrel 16" or greater its perfectly legal for the both of you. Now that you own it it is no longer a NFA item its simply a lower with extra engravings. If you wanted to SBR it you would have to file a form 1 and add your engravings to it.

    People get confused between a SBR/SBS vs. Say a machine gun. Once a machine gun always a machine gun it has a third hole you can't change that. The only thing that makes a SBR/SBS is that the barrel is under 16"/18". The receiver you use is just a receiver until it's configured as a SBR/SBS. Clear as mud right?
     

    ditcherman

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    In the country, hopefully.
    I think a lot of people will be saying a lot of things for quite a while, even if it’s actually published.
    Aft’s trying to move the market, and others have interests both ways to do that too.

    If you’re involved in having to make a decision about this, it’s important to keep your wits about you, to make an un-emotional decision.

    Just my 2 cents, no dog in this one except for the general idea that they’re screwing with us and should be abolished.
     

    Tombs

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    Well the video, if you watched it, talks about two claims.

    Claim 1) That if you have an imported pistol that came with a brace, you have to destroy it. He claims that isn't the case.
    Claim 2) That if it takes more than 88 days for the background check that you will be a felon and have given the ATF proof of your felony. Again claims that isn't the case.

    Does he cite the law that protects you in this instance, and is he willing to offer you legal defense for free in the event he is wrong?

    Otherwise, this is like taking stock advice from someone who isn't invested in anything they're advocating.
     

    edwea

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    Is there a cliffs notes on this?
    Basically that only the owner of the nfa item may have any level of possession of the item. So no letting others shoot, even in your presence. Can't even hold it. The kicker is that this didn't even come from some "rule change", but from an updated answer to a FAQ.:scratch:

    they're getting pretty cavalier with these changes...
     

    Tombs

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    Basically that only the owner of the nfa item may have any level of possession of the item. So no letting others shoot, even in your presence. Can't even hold it. The kicker is that this didn't even come from some "rule change", but from an updated answer to a FAQ.:scratch:

    they're getting pretty cavalier with these changes...

    So this will shut down all ranges that allow you to shoot machine guns or try suppressors?

    Yeah, I'm thinking some serious legal challenges are coming down the pipe, as this would put some pretty high profile businesses out of business.
     

    1nderbeard

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    fairly extensive discussion over here:
     
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