Indiana Woman Arrested For Exercising Caution

[level.eleven]

Requirements for LEO are too low.

A C average in remedial high school and a C average at Vincennes for two years gets you a badge and gun.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Requirements for LEO are too low.

A C average in remedial high school and a C average at Vincennes for two years gets you a badge and gun.

Heck, you can get on with quals lower than that

 

[HoughMade]

Based on the whole innocent till proven guilty concept. I know it's a strange concept these days, but it still means something to some of us. That and the fact that we see instances of some cops lying on an almost daily basis.

Talk about mixing concepts.

I hate to break it to you, nurses lie too.

To me, her story doesn't make complete sense, but I'm not choosing up sides.

 

[level.eleven]

Heck, you can get on with quals lower than that

I don't like that at all. And this isn't coming from an anti-cop/ingotarian style of position.

I recognize the importance of quality police work. I put it on par with what I expect from my surgeons.

 

[Kutnupe14]

I don't like that at all. And this isn't coming from an anti-cop/ingotarian style of position.

I recognize the importance of quality police work. I put it on par with what I expect from my surgeons.

"I" don't like it.... but to have a coast to coast, more professional police force, cities are going to need to pay better. Honestly, it IS trending that way. In my experience, in the last 10 years, officers are getting paid better, and attracting smarter people.

 

[Fargo]

That trooper is either a rookie or an idiot. Guys who have been doing the job for a while know that you activate your lights when you feel like you're in the most advantageous location. When my lights go on, I want the person to stop immediately, as I have already weighed the risks.

He is not the only cop I have seen in court who was displeased with an immediate pullover into an unsafe area. I spend several hundred hours a year in court and cops from a variety of departments testify to that fact pattern on a not infrequent basis. "I ordered him to pull into the parking lot as the shoulder of the road was not safe..." As I say, there is no consistency and no the Trooper is most definitely not a rookie.

I don't know what they train you guys, but apparently a significant number of cops disagree with you. Then again, I've never seen 5-6 cops together who can agree on much of anything, much less the law. If I had a dollar for every time a cop asked me a legal question to try to prove another cop wrong, I'd own a lot more guns than I do now!

 

[Kutnupe14]

He is not the only cop I have seen in court who was displeased with an immediate pullover into an unsafe area. I spend several hundred hours a year in court and cops from a variety of departments testify to that fact pattern on a not infrequent basis. "I ordered him to pull into the parking lot as the shoulder of the road was not safe..." As I say, there is no consistency and no the Trooper is most definitely not a rookie.

I don't know what they train you guys, but apparently a significant number of cops disagree with you. Then again, I've never seen 5-6 cops together who can agree on much of anything, much less the law. If I had a dollar for every time a cop asked me a legal question to try to prove another cop wrong, I'd own a lot more guns than I do now!

Cops aren't lawyers. They should know better. But then again, for every lawyer, you can find another one that will disagree with them too.

 

[Fargo]

Cops aren't lawyers. They should know better. But then again, for every lawyer, you can find another one that will disagree with them too.

That is for damn certain! That Freeman fellow is serially full of it...

 

[BehindBlueI's]

He is not the only cop I have seen in court who was displeased with an immediate pullover into an unsafe area. I spend several hundred hours a year in court and cops from a variety of departments testify to that fact pattern on a not infrequent basis. "I ordered him to pull into the parking lot as the shoulder of the road was not safe..." As I say, there is no consistency and no the Trooper is most definitely not a rookie.

I don't know what they train you guys, but apparently a significant number of cops disagree with you. Then again, I've never seen 5-6 cops together who can agree on much of anything, much less the law. If I had a dollar for every time a cop asked me a legal question to try to prove another cop wrong, I'd own a lot more guns than I do now!

Notice the difference between "I ordered them to pull into a parking lot" vs. deciding to do so on your own. Same thing I said early on. If I don't like where the stop ends up I'll use the PA to let you know.

 

[jsharmon7]

The only issue I've had with violator vehicles on traffic stops is when they don't pull to the right. So many seem to think that lights behind them mean freeze in place.

 

[Prometheus]

I believe that 700N there (and 500W) have been 35mph for a long, long time. I lived in the area right around there from 1999-2014 and it was always that speed limit...and everyone sped, but that's neither here, nor there in this case.

I agree, I wasn't saying because everyone drives 50-60 on it that is justification, just pointing that out so people would realize it's not like it was the crime of the century.

...and yes, that is a dark road out there and there is not a car-wide shoulder, but pulling off 500W, one wheel off the road is easy.

I haven't been on that stretch of road much since I moved out of Portage but in November I wouldn't have pulled a tire off the road in that stretch. It's a nasty shoulder and I'm not blowing out a tire because a cop couldn't wait 1/2 a mile to flip on the lights where the road widens next to Kohls.

Speaking of which, I've seen several people pulled over on that stretch and everytime the cop stopped them 1/4-1/2 mile short of where the road widened/slipt by kohls. Total PIA because the cop would block over half the road and if you were in the opposite lane you'd almost have to drive in the ditch to get around. Wonder if it was the same boy wonder this time around?

*And for full transparency, even after living in Porter county for 5 years, I have never been stopped by Porter County SO or Portage PD. I also haven't had a speeding ticket in over 15 years.

I just don't like idiots and I never understood why the rush... and now it hits me. That is RIGHT AT the city limits of Portage. Could it be the SO is always making stops there (in the worst possible area) rather than waiting for a half mile later where there is a full lane wide shoulder because they'd be in Portage city limits and have to cut Portage in on the proceeds from the ticket?

I'm just postulating because it makes no sense to pull someone over 1/2 mile before a very safe (for everyone) area vs a tiny 2 lane road with no shoulder and no where to pull off the road.

Area in question (kohls is the parking lot on the left. Everything south of there is corn fields and the city limit.

 

[level.eleven]

"I" don't like it.... but to have a coast to coast, more professional police force, cities are going to need to pay better. Honestly, it IS trending that way. In my experience, in the last 10 years, officers are getting paid better, and attracting smarter people.

That is good to hear.

 

[oldpink]

Based on the whole innocent till proven guilty concept. I know it's a strange concept these days, but it still means something to some of us. That and the fact that we see instances of some cops lying on an almost daily basis.

You apply your "innocent until proven guilty" concept selectively.
Will you retract your presumptions if the dashcam footage (if it exists) refutes the woman's claims?
I doubt it.

 

[sig-guy]

Not long ago, I remember reading where a scumbag was following people from the hospital. Stopping them in a car looking like a police car. Seems it was in the Fort Wayne area. So... do I blame her? Not one bit. I'd be shocked if she hadn't read the article/e-mail, since she's a nurse.

At night, how many of you could identify the vehicle (make, model, color, signage, etc.) behind you with the strobes on?

Might be more to the story, might not. Most cops are good people, but there's good and bad people in every profession.

 

[10mmMarc]

I remember a female back in the late 80's asking for police ID from a deputy sheriff in full uniform, in a fully marked car and refused to roll her window down more than a inch , and when explained to her, full uniform and fully marked car, broad daylight, in a busy traffic area she still asked for a supervisor, she got what she requested, along with a long lecture. The next ride along I did , it was a male who refused to roll his window down, only enough to produce his license and registration, and said he wasn't going to answer any questions, it didn't end as easily for him as it did for the female, I've never seen a guy exit a vehicle that fast, pepper spray is just rotten but it works.

 

[Roland of Gilead]

According to her the deputy started the interaction "What in the hell are you doing? I could arrest you for this." if this is true it would appear he didn't intend to charge her for a felony from the initial stop. She ran her mouth and then he being an ahole and upon further investigation decided to give a felony arrest.

Light them up where you want them to control the when and were, does not seemed to be taught at the academy. I discussed this where to pull over with my cousin who was in his first year as a cop. I gave him the BBI how to get pulled over (explained in another thread) and this why run down. It was new to him and he liked it.

Hope the charges are dropped for this lady, she was obviously not fleeing.

 

[Fargo]

Notice the difference between "I ordered them to pull into a parking lot" vs. deciding to do so on your own. Same thing I said early on. If I don't like where the stop ends up I'll use the PA to let you know.

I understand what you are saying, but it is still inherently contradictory to the average citizen. On one stop, they get ordered to pull into a parking lot and told that the shoulder where they had pulled was unsafe.

Next traffic stop, they think "I'd better pull into a parking lot" and next think you know they have a UTT for failure to yield or apparently much much worse.

As I said above, I don't know the answer. I don't believe the issue is addressed in driver's ed with any consistency but it probably should be.

 

[cobber]

Based on the whole innocent till proven guilty concept. I know it's a strange concept these days, but it still means something to some of us. That and the fact that we see instances of some cops lying on an almost daily basis.

It's a presumption that applies in a court of law, not in the 'court' of public opinion. I would expect a no-file or a pre-trial diversion after the prosecutor's office gets the case.


Given the number of impersonators out there, on its face her actions don't seem unreasonable. But for all we know the officer was very reasonable and the nurse flew off the handle. Wouldn't be the first time.


A good case for in-car/body cams...

 

[actaeon277]

The only issue I've had with violator vehicles on traffic stops is when they don't pull to the right. So many seem to think that lights behind them mean freeze in place.

I see that every time an emergency vehicle goes by.
I'm pretty sure, everyone's supposed to pull to the right, to allow the emergency vehicle to pass
Instead, I see the road blocked, because everyone stops in place.
Drives me crazy.

 

[spec4]

Indiana Drivers Manual, page 69: "Slow down, pull to the right of the road, and stop until the emergency vehicle passes."