Crew member killed when shot by prop gun on set of Baldwin movie

[Sylvain]

If you point a Nerf gun at someone and it fires a real bullet, how are you the ******* for "violating gun safety"? It's a fake gun that should never shoot bullets.

Unless he brought a pocket full of ammo from home and loaded the gun, Baldwin isn't to blame for this. It's a prop gun. It's FOR pointing at people. The entire point of the existence of a prop gun is to be safe to point at and shoot people with. Just like the point of a rubber knife is to be safe to stab people with.

That's like blaming someone for being killed by an exploding sandwich because "hurr, he should have checked the sandwich first, negligent dummy". No, sandwiches don't explode, and you have no reason to ever anticipate your sandwich exploding.

In a century of movie making you can count incidents like this on one hand. It should simply never be a possibility. No live ammunition should ever be on the set, let alone loaded, let alone given to an actor whose job it is NOT to fiddle unnecessarily with props.

The failure here is totally upstream and Baldwin doesn't assume blame because he said some dumb crap on Twitter.

Accidents can happen without live ammo present.
It's what happened in the case of Brandon Lee.
A blank round was used when he was killed, and a round with a live primer, no powder, and a bullet was used prior to that.

From Bandon Lee's wiki page ...

In the film shoot preceding the fatal scene, the prop gun, which was a real revolver, was loaded with improperly-made dummy rounds, cartridges from which the special-effects crew had removed the powder charges so in close-ups the revolver would show normal-looking ammunition. However, the crew neglected to remove the primers from the cartridges. At some point before the fatal event, one of the rounds had been fired; although there was no powder charges, the energy from the ignited primer was enough to separate the bullet from the casing and push it part-way into the gun barrel, where it got stuck (a condition known as a squib load). For the fatal scene, which called for the revolver to be fired at Lee from a distance of 3.6–4.5 meters (12–15 ft), the dummy cartridges were replaced with blank rounds, which contained a powder charge and the primer, but no solid bullet, allowing the gun to be fired with sound and flash effects without the risk of an actual projectile. However, the gun was not properly checked and cleared before the blank round was fired, and the dummy bullet previously lodged in the barrel was then propelled forward by the blank and shot out the muzzle with almost the same force as if the round were live, striking Lee in the abdomen

 

[bwframe]

Baldwin and a lot of others produced this movie. Responsibility for this negligence goes beyond one person screwing up. There were producers, bosses, union crews and others who wouldn't dare work in an unsafe environment.

Why would weapons be treated with such nonchalance? Where are the double checks? Why would any one individual be responsible when so many are susceptible to the danger?

Its the same as the Four Rules Of Firearm Safety that were not practiced. You can often escape injury by practicing three out of four. A mistake can be made and the other three rules being followed will still save you from catastrophe.

It appears as though there were NO safety rules for this movie making crew at all?

What do you bet the dips were required to wear masks on set when not acting?

 

[Tombs]

It appears as though there were NO safety rules for this movie making crew at all?

I highly doubt that.

Knowing what a nutcase baldwin is, I'd be near completely certain he did something he wasn't supposed to.

In the movie biz almost all the firearms used are usually the real deal. Specialized blanks and sometimes bore obstructions are used depending on the shot needed.

 

[manifest destiny]

Lots of people have died while filming t.v. and movies. Not always the actors or directors. But lots of the minions that do the parts not seen on screen are severely injured or die. I've read that the cost to insure productions has skyrocketed. Usually the details of the mishap come forth quickly. But in this case, not a single account yet of the details. Alec is in the fold, he'll face no repercussions (rightly or wrongly) and will likely twist it into a reason for gun control. It will be hard not to assign culpability to someone given our litigious society.

 

[Trapper Jim]

Baldwin and a lot of others produced this movie. Responsibility for this negligence goes beyond one person screwing up.

Its the same as the Four Rules Of Firearm Safety that were not practiced. You can often escape injury by practicing three out of four. A mistake can be made and the other three rules being followed will still save you from catastrophe.

It appears as though there were NO safety rules for this movie making crew at all?

The Actors Union should have rules in place however many Sets are ran loosey goosey and others hire Gun advisors and technical support. However of the ones I have met, they could not even pass an eval on their own let alone advising for money.

 

[printcraft]

Lots of people have died while filming t.v. and movies. Not always the actors or directors. But lots of the minions that do the parts not seen on screen are severely injured or die. I've read that the cost to insure productions has skyrocketed. Usually the details of the mishap come forth quickly. But in this case, not a single account yet of the details. Alec is in the fold, he'll face no repercussions (rightly or wrongly) and will likely twist it into a reason for gun control. It will be hard not to assign culpability to someone given our litigious society.

I had the same thought, guns bad. They made him do it, it went off by itself. All the more reason to ban them etc etc etc.

 

[hoosierdoc]

I take no joy in seeing bad things happen to asses when it involves innocent others

 

[JCSR]

The Actors Union should have rules in place however many Sets are ran loosey goosey and others hire Gun advisors and technical support. However of the ones I have met, they could not even pass an eval on their own let alone advising for money.

 

[Mgderf]

It's possible, regardless of how probable, that it was NOT a live round.
How many here have heard about, or even experienced, a double-charged factory round?
Why would it not be possible for a over-charged blank to slip through quality control at the factory.
An over-charged round might easily be able to make a "prop-gun" come apart.

Just speculation, like everyone else.
As for Baldwin...
I like it here, so I'm going to bite my tongue.

 

[Tombs]

This sounds like a well planned murder.

 

[churchmouse]

Were there any cameras running for this....?????

 

[bwframe]

The Actors Union should have rules in place however many Sets are ran loosey goosey and others hire Gun advisors and technical support. However of the ones I have met, they could not even pass an eval on their own let alone advising for money.

Not unlike our country or my grandkids, as discussed with their mother today. If you let them get away with not behaving, then that is the rule.

Accountability is just that. Hold no one accountable and the word means nothing.

 

[Hatin Since 87]

I don't like his politics..having said that, he should be given the benefit of the doubt, for right now.......It has been reported that he was seen crying, and being upset, as we all would be from an accident, or stupidity. Lets not be "them" and see what comes out of all this......I did like him in "Hunt for the Red October" of course he was an unknown at the time.....

He didn’t give the officers any benefit of the doubt when there was an LEO involved shooting and he spouted his big mouth opinion about it on Twitter. He didn’t give gun owners the benefit of the doubt when he advocated for more gun control. Why would I give him the benefit of the doubt ? To quote bigred... **** him.

 

[Hatin Since 87]

It's a movie set. He wasn't holding a weapon, he was holding a prop.

A prop that imitates a weapon, and is capable of firing and killing a person.


Am I saying it’s 100% his fault? Depends. It was said he was the producer of the film and fired the person in charge of props, and continued using the props without one. If that’s the case, yes, it’s 100% his fault.


We shall see, although I’m skeptical investigators will admit it’s his negligence if it is. Hollywood has their own set of laws, as we know.

 

[Sylvain]

Were there any cameras running for this....?????

Yes, according to this article.

Alec Baldwin ripped over deadly set shooting and assistant director is slammed

THE armorer who handled the gun before the accidental fatal shooting has shut down her social media accounts, and sources say she did so based on legal advice. Director of photography Halyna Hutchi…

www.thesun.co.uk

ACCIDENTAL SHOOTING WAS CAUGHT ON CAMERA

Alec Baldwin’s accidental shooting on the set of the film Rust was “captured on camera” as a “hot prop gun” killed the film’s cinematographer and injured its director, a source exclusively told The Sun.

An eyewitness on the scene told The Sun that the tragedy was recorded on camera as the cast and crew did a take rehearsing their scene.

"The camera was facing Alec who was shooting in the cameras general direction during a rehearsal scene that was being recorded," the source claimed.

"The cameras captured Alec shooting but Halyna and Joel were behind the camera so I don’t think the cameras captured them being shot.”

However, “cameras, lights and props were damaged” from the gunfire with “broken glass was everywhere,” so it is not clear if that footage is salvageable.

The actor’s weapon fired off on the set of his new movie, Rust, yesterday which resulted in the death of Halyna Hutchins, 42, and sent filmmaker Joel Souza to the hospital.

 

[Hatin Since 87]

His Twitter.

https://mobile.twitter.com/AlecBaldwin?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

All AOC retweets and anti police rhetoric. **** that guy.

 

[manifest destiny]

Wow. The first details finally come out. And it's from a source across the pond. And what kind of gun shoots two people, the set and leaves glass everywhere (unless shot more than once)?

 

[Drewski]

Sure...it's pretty clear he is not being given any benefit of the doubt based primarily upon what people think of him personally. Do you really expect people to come out and say: "he's at fault because he's anti-gun".? ...yet we get pretty close.

I stand on my observation.

And again....why do we want to be like "them"? Let "them" make leaps of logic in the absence of fact. I'll try to be as objective as I can.

Benefit of the doubt of what? That he didn't pull the trigger? That he didn't have it pointed in the direction of a human being?
Since that is what is being reported - that he was handling a firearm at the time said firearm shot 2 other people, exactly what does he get the benefit of the doubt for?

Do you really expect people to come out and say: "he's at fault because he's anti-gun".? ...yet we get pretty close.

horseshoes and hand grenades

And "we?" No one is entitled to speak for anyone else, much less everyone else.

I get it....we don't like his position, so he must be fully at fault.

Again with the royal "we." Speak for yourself. Anything else is accusation and assumption.

Regardless, no one said that. No one else, that is. Accusing "we" of saying so, only to scold or accuse is textbook strawman, and gets no quarter.

Based on the assertion that speculation is ok but assumptions are not, then if one of us is entitled to speculate, "we" all are. The fact that the person in question has campaigned against Americans' rights, insulted vast swaths of the population for their beliefs, and apparently is an a**hole in general will obviously and understandably subdue sympathy from many, independent of judgement of the situation.

I'll stand *by* that observation.

 

[BugI02]

If you point a Nerf gun at someone and it fires a real bullet, how are you the ******* for "violating gun safety"? It's a fake gun that should never shoot bullets.

Unless he brought a pocket full of ammo from home and loaded the gun, Baldwin isn't to blame for this. It's a prop gun. It's FOR pointing at people. The entire point of the existence of a prop gun is to be safe to point at and shoot people with. Just like the point of a rubber knife is to be safe to stab people with.

That's like blaming someone for being killed by an exploding sandwich because "hurr, he should have checked the sandwich first, negligent dummy". No, sandwiches don't explode, and you have no reason to ever anticipate your sandwich exploding.

In a century of movie making you can count incidents like this on one hand. It should simply never be a possibility. No live ammunition should ever be on the set, let alone loaded, let alone given to an actor whose job it is NOT to fiddle unnecessarily with props.

The failure here is totally upstream and Baldwin doesn't assume blame because he said some dumb crap on Twitter.

I thought we usually believed that the gun was a neutral tool and it is the operator who is responsible for what is done with it

Unless you're a famous lefty, I guess

 

[Jaybird1980]

Were there any cameras running for this....?????

I'm sure it was caught on camera, but I'm sure that will not be released until after an investigation. That's if it ever gets released.