COVID OMICRON Thread

[Alpo]

Had it and beat it.

Even Fauci is out saying children hospitalized WITH covid are being counted, not just those hospitalized BECAUSE of covid.

Pull those out and your half million per year is likely the normal yearly average of flu deaths....

Thanks to their work on pumping up the numbers, we will never have an accurate count...

But feel free to keep getting jabbed with boosters if it makes you feel better...

Once again, less snark and more data would be more convincing. Your disingenousness is showing.

 

[JCSR]

It prevents death from COVID... not cancer, heart disease, car accidents, etc.


Where does it say that those dying from COVID are almost exclusively non-vacccinated? Well, everywhere!

Not just lefty narrative MSM pushers, left, right and center. WSJ, NR, etc.

Shouldn't it be less? If it was all the same COVID over the past year, yes, the rates should decrease in proportion to the percentage vaccinated in that population. Say half vaccinated, should cut the rate in half.

But, it hasn't been the same COVID... there have been more deadly strains (Delta)... that have killed almost exclusively non-vaccinated, so the rate among non-vaccinated is higher than the rate for the age range as a whole because almost all of the deaths are in that sub-class of the age range... almost the same numerator, a much smaller denominator equals a higher number. It is the way the math works.

The chart clearly says "COVID 19 DEATHS". You are the only one saying cancer, heart disease, car accidents, etc.

 

[JCSR]

Once again, less snark and more data would be more convincing. Your disingenousness is showing.

The data is out there supporting about anything you want to believe. This is .gov's fault not ours.

 

[Alpo]

True. However, not bothering to include data supporting a side of the argument shows an indolent attitude toward the debate.

Why bother to argue at all other than to stir the proverbial pot?

 

[JCSR]

Why bother to argue at all other than to stir the proverbial pot?

Look in the mirror and ask that again.

 

[firecadet613]

Once again, less snark and more data would be more convincing. Your disingenousness is showing.

What data? Fauci is on national TV saying those WITH covid are being counted exactly the same as those who died or hospitalized BECAUSE of covid.

How do you fix that data? You can't. And therein lies the genius in their scheme...

I've had covid and beat it, as have many others in this thread.

Are you just worried your vax doesn't offer you the protection they sold it to you as having?

 

[firecadet613]

If you died of a heart attack at the hospital, give that guy a covid test.

Test comes back positive. It's a covid death....

 

[firecadet613]

It seems totally plausible that big pharma would conspire to make vaccines that would need constant updating or multiple doses to make governments continue to pay billions of dollars to them to make populations think they are safe.

 

[Alpo]

Look in the mirror and ask that again.

I'm more than willing to provide data and have done so on many occasions. It isn't necessary to repeatedly cite the same study. If you are unable to do so on your own, here is a present study. https://www.businessinsider.com/omi...ectiveness-hospitalization-symptomatic-2022-1

Campbell may have addressed this as well, I haven't reviewed his vlog in a few days.

However, to state opinion as fact without data, especially when refuted by data, is not rational.

Have a good day.

 

[Alpo]

What data? Fauci is on national TV saying those WITH covid are being counted exactly the same as those who died or hospitalized BECAUSE of covid.

How do you fix that data? You can't. And therein lies the genius in their scheme...

I've had covid and beat it, as have many others in this thread.

Are you just worried your vax doesn't offer you the protection they sold it to you as having?

So, if we can't believe anyone, why believe your position?

I look at trends and the Law of Large Numbers. With so many countries reporting data and so many individual institutions doing so, errors tend to have less impact. If a country shows up as an outlier (like Japan, for example) it is worth checking into. If its results cannot be reconciled, the trends from all of the other entities in the population still provide knowledge upon which to base a rational decision.

As an aside, I also find it humorous that all of the free-marketeers on INGO yell "Big Pharma fraud and conspiracy. "

 

[mmpsteve]

So, if we can't believe anyone, why believe your position?

I look at trends and the Law of Large Numbers. With so many countries reporting data and so many individual institutions doing so, errors tend to have less impact. If a country shows up as an outlier (like Japan, for example) it is worth checking into. If its results cannot be reconciled, the trends from all of the other entities in the population still provide knowledge upon which to base a rational decision.

As an aside, I also find it humorous that all of the free-marketeers on INGO yell "Big Pharma fraud and conspiracy. "

As a mere interested Observer of this thread, I did have to laugh a little at the words free market and big Pharma used in the same sentence, as applies to this wuflu debacle.

.

 

[wtburnette]

Why is it that anytime direct evidence threatens the narrative people go straight to “they must be lying?” When people were using official numbers to say this virus is 99% survivable, why’d they trust the numbers then? Is the only deciding factor in determining accuracy “does it fit my narrative?” If no, then it’s a cover-up? I think it’s because saying it’s a lie or cover-up requires no proof or critical thinking. There’s no cognitive dissonance when you can default to “clearly it’s a lie.”

All I did is ask questions and gave you my thoughts. You can choose to believe what you want. If you believe what the MSM, our government and big pharma is putting out, be my guest. I'll be a little more skeptical myself.

The numbers have been so far F'd they will never be cleaned up. There were all kinds of news stories talking about the unvaccinated dying with deathbed confessions that turned out to be lies. I work for the largest hospital system in the state and I can tell you 100% that it's a progressive organization. Anything that is progressive I don't trust, so I don't trust the information they're putting out.

Oh and if the "official numbers" say that the virus is 99% survivable and are as inflated as I believe, it's even more survivable than that. Are people dying? Sure. A cold or flu will kill the elderly and health compromised and occasionally people that are otherwise healthy. I believe the WuFlu to be very similar, despite the hysteria surrounding it.

 

[Alpo]

As a mere interested Observer of this thread, I did have to laugh a little at the words free market and big Pharma used in the same sentence, as applies to this wuflu debacle.

.

Well, I still wear the scars from debates with Jamil on the nature of predatory capitalism.

Somehow, Big Pharma has vindicated my argument.

 

[SnoopLoggyDog]

 

[BugI02]

And, as always, it's the anti-vaxers who are insisting that vaccines must prevent any and all cases... beat your strawman all you want, the vaccines have always been about preventing death and serious illness.

Funny, it wasn't so long ago - when the CDC's own numbers were proving that the percentages of cases proceeding to hospitalization and death were comparable for both vaccinated and unvaccinated, you were hung up on 'but there are 12.7x as many unvaccinated cases'

Prior to that, pro-vax people were telling us natural immunity didn't count and everybody had to get vaccinated so we could stop the pandemic

Now you're selling 'prevent death and serious illness' and you can't prove it is even doing that



What is that creaking noise that accompanies so many of your posts

Edit: This quote from the article "However, he stressed that they have been proven to prevent the chances of hospitaliation, serious illness and death."
as well as your use of the same term in the portion of your post I cited really make me wonder if either of you understand what 'prevent' means

 

[BugI02]

183 people hospitalized to some degree with Covid. 166 of them are unvaccinated, leaving 17 vaccinated. A touch over 90% of the hospitalized cases are unvaccinated. 54% of Vanderburgh county is vaccinated. If the vaccines were as useless as you say, why aren’t we seeing about a 50/50 split? Why are the hospitalized cases overwhelmingly unvaccinated when the unvaccinated are a slight minority? It seems to me to suggest the vaccines do at least prevent severe outcomes. Or, there’s some other variable. So I ask you…again…what other variable am I missing? What’s your explanation for the disparity?

How many of those people are hospitalized FOR covid and how many merely hospitalized WITH it? Do you have a breakdown for covid ICU beds occupied versus other reasons?

How many of those 166 unvaccinated patients are hospitalized for heart disease or cancer treatment?

A quick look at my own state's covid dashboard show me that cases are on an upward trend, rising about 20% in the last three weeks, but the ICU and vent numbers remain absolutely flat over the same period

Inpatient beds are 80% occupied, with 3/4 of those being non-covid patients

ICU beds are 82% occupied, with 8/11 of those being non-covid

Looking at completed vaccinations, we are at about 66% of the 18+ population overall, with 5 year cadres from 60 on up being at from 76% to 88%

Cases are rising, Inpatient and ICU population is steady and about 75% of inpatient and ICU patients are covid negative - so what is that telling me about the effectiveness of the vaccines at preventing hospitalization and death? Nothing

Neither you nor I have the right information to draw any conclusions about that. You are hung up on the wrong statistics in the wrong way

Oh, and 85% of those hospitalized are white. What erroneous inference would you like to draw from that?

 

[jsharmon7]

How many of those people are hospitalized FOR covid and how many merely hospitalized WITH it? Do you have a breakdown for covid ICU beds occupied versus other reasons?

How many of those 166 unvaccinated patients are hospitalized for heart disease or cancer treatment?

A quick look at my own state's covid dashboard show me that cases are on an upward trend, rising about 20% in the last three weeks, but the ICU and vent numbers remain absolutely flat over the same period

Inpatient beds are 80% occupied, with 3/4 of those being non-covid patients

ICU beds are 82% occupied, with 8/11 of those being non-covid

Looking at completed vaccinations, we are at about 66% of the 18+ population overall, with 5 year cadres from 60 on up being at from 76% to 88%

Cases are rising, Inpatient and ICU population is steady and about 75% of inpatient and ICU patients are covid negative - so what is that telling me about the effectiveness of the vaccines at preventing hospitalization and death? Nothing

Neither you nor I have the right information to draw any conclusions about that. You are hung up on the wrong statistics in the wrong way

Oh, and 85% of those hospitalized are white. What erroneous inference would you like to draw from that?

Oh my…

Predictably, you defaulted to the with/for argument. With: Why are so many unvaccinated people testing positive compared to vaccinated? For: Why are so many unvaccinated people hospitalized with Covid compared to vaccinated? The unvaccinated are in the minority, why doesn’t the census reflect that? You continue to avoid that question.

Your responses to my posts have gotten ridiculous the past couple days, so I’m just going to leave you to your beliefs. I hope you stay healthy and well.

 

[firecadet613]

Oh my…

Predictably, you defaulted to the with/for argument. With: Why are so many unvaccinated people testing positive compared to vaccinated? For: Why are so many unvaccinated people hospitalized with Covid compared to vaccinated? The unvaccinated are in the minority, why doesn’t the census reflect that? You continue to avoid that question.

Your responses to my posts have gotten ridiculous the past couple days, so I’m just going to leave you to your beliefs. I hope you stay healthy and well.

He provided data. Hard facts and you immediately bow out? That says a lot!

If you're in the hospital for something else and they give you a covid test and your now "positive" for covid - you're counted as a covid hospitalization. You don't see anything wrong with that?!

Look at the major sports leagues. Why are so many vaxxed there testing positive?

 

[jsharmon7]

He provided data. Hard facts and you immediately bow out? That says a lot!

If you're in the hospital for something else and they give you a covid test and your now "positive" for covid - you're counted as a covid hospitalization. You don't see anything wrong with that?!

Look at the major sports leagues. Why are so many vaxxed there testing positive?

Look at my post history for the past 18 months and tell me I’m “immediately bowing out.” And the whole premise of our discussion was whether vaccines reduce severity. Why are you talking about sports teams? Posts like your’s are the exact reason why I’ve lost interest in these threads.

 

[Ingomike]

And, if you think it's only the cold or flu,

No one ever says that. The wuwho flu is here permanently and will be a constant just like we live with the flu and colds. The BS vaccines will have an efficacy similar to the flu shot.

If you cannot see that, you need to get your heads out of the spreadsheets from sources all proven to have lied to the people at some point through this ordeal…