Blackpowder Shoot?

[Wabatuckian]

Hello,

Been talking to some traditional blackpowder folks and they wouldn't mind a blackpowder Appleseed.

It's realized the course of fire would have to be changed.

What are the chances of this?

Josh

 

[Bill of Rights]

Interesting thought. The Founders could cook off 3-4 shots a minute, IIRC, which would, as you said, require a re-do of the first three (of four) stages of the AQT, not to mention totally removing any possibility of building a good position and keeping it through more than one shot. (it's tough enough to do it with a bolt-action modern rifle!)

I'll be interested to see what happens with this.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[Wabatuckian]

Hi Bill,

I don't know if you remember, but I scored almost perfectly with my bolt action.

A couple times I didn't get it all the way empty, but I tried!

The 10/22 that I originally made Rifleman with, was bought the day or so before the event started.

The 'scope on the bolt gun was actually a handicap at 25 yards.

Most folks who are hardcore into shooting black powder muzzle stuffers know their rifles very, very well. I asked about targets they shoot at during Rendezvous, and they're lighting matches, nailing rocks thrown at unknown distances, cutting strings, hitting Lifesaver candy tied up by a string without busting the knot, splitting the ball on the edge of an axe, etc etc.

Mostly feats of marksmanship skill that we think of as trick shooting today are practice to them.

I'm so going to take my Long Rifle out and try this stuff!

I would envision stressing the importance of one shot even more, and possibly duplicating battles such as this:

The Saratoga Rifleman

I know I'm going to be trying come springtime when I can get out to the pay-to-shoot range.

Figure on one shot per minute, I'd say.

Also, if folks are into selling things like at the Appleseed I attended with you present, it might be a good way to get real black powder around to folks who want it. It shoots so much better than Pyrodex etc, but is a bit more restricted as it's classified as a low yield explosive (likely due to its use as a blasting agent back in the day).

Can you imagine the smoke after the command to fire was given, and 20 folks touched off their Long Rifles and muskets at once?

Shoot, swab, reload. Probably no blowing down the barrels would be allowed, though it's traditional. Swabbing out the bore would keep fouling down, anyway.

This will take some thought.

Thanks,

Josh

 

[yellowhousejake]

Seated and prone transitions would be a tricky thing to do and follow our safety rules. Having plenty of CO2 handy for stuck ball removal would be a given. Throw a time limit in the mix and "somebody" is going to go powder patch ball, powder patch ball, patch ball powder... I seen it happen more than once, though never me ;^)

the idea is interesting. Not sure we could do a rifleman that way but it might make a fun side match. Shoot a Redcoat with the long rifle on Saturday. Go through the weekend and finish up with another long rifle Redcoat Sunday afternoon.

I'd bet there would be improvement.

YHJ

 

[Wabatuckian]

That's what I'm sayin'

Good idea, the side match thing. You know, if the NMLRAA got involved, it could eventually become more than a side match...

Josh

 

[Bill of Rights]

Hi Josh,

I didn't remember that you'd shot with your bolt, but I did remember how well you did. I wasn't speaking to accuracy at all, only to time. I'd be interested in watching a shoot like this, even doing the Appleseed instruction for it, though others with actual knowledge would have to address the loading of the rifles. I own only one black powder arm but it is not a rifle, nor have I ever fired it.

If this gets together at some point, let me know.

YHJ, I think you'll need new target boards after a day of BPML shooters. Don't they start at .50 cal? I don't think we'll be holding any shell casings up to the targets for scoring that day!

Blessings,
Bill

 

[Wabatuckian]

You know, 50 yards would be about right for engagement, about max for a smooth bore musket, and if we had to use 25 yards, we could go 1/2 scale silhouette...

The Morgan's Rangers (Riflemen) qualified by repeatedly hitting a 7" target at 250 yards, so if that were scaled back, about 1.5" at 50 yards or 0.75" at 25 yards would be the way to go, methinks!

You loaned me the magazines to shoot my bolt with, Bill, the Savage...

Josh

 

[Bill of Rights]

You know, 50 yards would be about right for engagement, about max for a smooth bore musket, and if we had to use 25 yards, we could go 1/2 scale silhouette...

The Morgan's Rangers (Riflemen) qualified by repeatedly hitting a 7" target at 250 yards, so if that were scaled back, about 1.5" at 50 yards or 0.75" at 25 yards would be the way to go, methinks!

You loaned me the magazines to shoot my bolt with, Bill, the Savage...

Josh

I am NOT a savage, Josh! Sheesh, just 'cuz a guy wears a beard....

Like I said, I remembered you shooting well (and still being dissatisfied with it! ) but my friend .... I've worked just a few shoots since then.

And if you recall the Redcoat target, that's just about the size of that little rectangle on the left side of the 300 yd target.

 

[6birds]

YHJ, I think you'll need new target boards after a day of BPML shooters. Don't they start at .50 cal? I don't think we'll be holding any shell casings up to the targets for scoring that day!
l

i have a 32 cal percission and a 36 cal in flint, they are a pleasure to shoot, and squirrel hunting is quite enjoyable with the old smoke poles.

You can get 2 or 3 shots per minute, gets easier with training and practice.

Head down to the National Muzzle Loading Rifle Association (NMLRA) National Shoot September, (friendship Indiana), we slug it out to 500 yards.

 

[Bill of Rights]

i have a 32 cal percission and a 36 cal in flint, they are a pleasure to shoot, and squirrel hunting is quite enjoyable with the old smoke poles.

You can get 2 or 3 shots per minute, gets easier with training and practice.

Head down to the National Muzzle Loading Rifle Association (NMLRA) National Shoot September, (friendship Indiana), we slug it out to 500 yards.

Thanks for the correction!

Bill

 

[DaveD]

Sounds interesting, but I would have to trade in my 45cal in-line ......... which wouldn't be so bad an idea. Hard to clean compared to a PC Plains rifle I once owned and "don't shoot no better" either.

 

[DHolder]

I'm in like flint... get it flint, anyway, I would love to get in on a BP shoot I think a Redcoat, one shot instead of three. Im not against an inline on the line. It would be nice to be able to do a demonstration of how smokey Lexington Green must have been, that morning. Great idea.

 

[The Bubba Effect]

If not a shoot, maybe a volley?

 

[Bill of Rights]

A ragged volley, off in the distance, during First Strike? (that could even be done with powder only, no ball... Hmm....

 

[yellowhousejake]

A ragged volley, off in the distance, during First Strike? (that could even be done with powder only, no ball... Hmm....

I once had the grand idea to do a gun shot, unexpectedly, in the distance. Well, me and a few others did, long story. It did not go over well with a few combat veterans who were there at the time. I have since vowed to not make gun shots a surprise to anyone.

I'm just sayin`...

YHJ

 

[Wabatuckian]

Good point, Jake.

It would be a good idea to have a blackpowder range officer yelling the commands, so that the "whump" of black powder didn't surprise anyone.

By the way, only black powder will explode without being compressed. It ignites at about 300 degrees while the subs start at around 600 degrees and burn more like smokeless powder.

If it's dry, that's something to think about. Otherwise, I would actually prefer to see wads flying out. Adds to the realism.

Another thought would be a volley into redcoat targets at the beginning - make sure everyone knows it's coming.

These folks could be irregular militia, minutemen, whatnot - I do not have the period correct clothing, but could probably fake it from a distance.

A Long Rifle regiment firing into a bunch of wooden, red painted targets would be something else...

Josh