21 to purchase?

[HoosierLife]

So with the recent events in Texas, I’ve been thinking.

I think we can all agree that the average moral character of our current day youth is much much lower than what it was 20, 30, 50 years ago right?

Throw broken up homes and who knows what kind of trauma and bullying. No real parents or parenting to teach kids how to deal with conflicts or controlling their emotions.

They go through the worst few years of anyone’s life (teen years) and are depressed, lonely, angry, surrounded by violence and wickedness of every sort.

Then on their 18th birthday, they can buy an AR and let their lack of impulse control guide their actions?

I know it’s anathema to 2A to infringe, but maybe letting these troubled teens get past their 18th, 19th, and 20th year of life is not a horrible idea before we allow them to purchase a gun.

Doesn’t mean if you have a well rounded teen that you can’t personally gift them a weapon, but maybe these emotional basket cases shouldn’t be allowed to buy one at the tail end of their worst years when their brain is still not fully formed.

This ain’t 1950 anymore.

We don’t let folks legally buy alcohol or pot until they’re 21.

Why?

They’re 18 and they can go die for our country, but they can’t buy a beer?

Is it not because we as a society have decided that 18-20 year olds still have poor decision making skill sets and impulse control problems?

The other side is always talking about “common sense gun control.”

Problem is, those on the other side of the aisle want to infringe more and more.

Give them an inch and they’ll take a mile.

We’re trying to solve a problem and not even looking at the core issue.

It’s not guns. It’s kids growing up with absentee parents. Absentee fathers (whether they are there physically or not) is our #1 problem in society.

You can’t destroy the family, the foundation of society, and not see these massacres come to pass.

On that note, you can’t tell people that they have no meaning or purpose, that they just accidentally existed, make it socially acceptable to kill our unborn children, that pleasure and happiness should be our ultimate goal, and then not expect these things to continue.

We got problems. We’re not even looking at the real ones…

So raise your kids. Turn off the TV and spend time with them. Teach them good values. Teach them how to think and defend themselves physically and mentally.

And goodness gracious, can we make all schools only have one entrance with an armed guard at the door, in the meantime?

 

[Doug]

Just remember, Congress doesn't want to solve any problem; they need problems so they can promise to solve them if they're re-elected. When nothing gets done, they blame the other party.
Look at the immigration problem. It will NEVER be solved.

The only way to change this world is one person at a time.

 

[jamil]

So with the recent events in Texas, I’ve been thinking.

I think we can all agree that the average moral character of our current day youth is much much lower than what it was 20, 30, 50 years ago right?

Throw broken up homes and who knows what kind of trauma and bullying. No real parents or parenting to teach kids how to deal with conflicts or controlling their emotions.

They go through the worst few years of anyone’s life (teen years) and are depressed, lonely, angry, surrounded by violence and wickedness of every sort.

Then on their 18th birthday, they can buy an AR and let their lack of impulse control guide their actions?

I know it’s anathema to 2A to infringe, but maybe letting these troubled teens get past their 18th, 19th, and 20th year of life is not a horrible idea before we allow them to purchase a gun.

Doesn’t mean if you have a well rounded teen that you can’t personally gift them a weapon, but maybe these emotional basket cases shouldn’t be allowed to buy one at the tail end of their worst years when their brain is still not fully formed.

This ain’t 1950 anymore.

We don’t let folks legally buy alcohol or pot until they’re 21.

Why?

They’re 18 and they can go die for our country, but they can’t buy a beer?

Is it not because we as a society have decided that 18-20 year olds still have poor decision making skill sets and impulse control problems?

The other side is always talking about “common sense gun control.”

Problem is, those on the other side of the aisle want to infringe more and more.

Give them an inch and they’ll take a mile.

We’re trying to solve a problem and not even looking at the core issue.

It’s not guns. It’s kids growing up with absentee parents. Absentee fathers (whether they are there physically or not) is our #1 problem in society.

You can’t destroy the family, the foundation of society, and not see these massacres come to pass.

On that note, you can’t tell people that they have no meaning or purpose, that they just accidentally existed, make it socially acceptable to kill our unborn children, that pleasure and happiness should be our ultimate goal, and then not expect these things to continue.

We got problems. We’re not even looking at the real ones…

So raise your kids. Turn off the TV and spend time with them. Teach them good values. Teach them how to think and defend themselves physically and mentally.

And goodness gracious, can we make all schools only have one entrance with an armed guard at the door, in the meantime?

It's something I've thought about. With rights come responsibility. So should responsibility be a prerequisite for rights? When I say it that way, it doesn't seem so. At least not across the board.

Just because *some* people under 21 behave untrustworthy with firearms, does it mean that the responsible ones must forfeit their rights for the greater good?

I mean, we could extend that argument to any age. If some people behave untrustworthy with guns, should those who are forfeit their rights for the greater good?

We could extend that argument to any right. Free speech? Right to assemble? To worship or not? That's the problem with a free society. You have to protect the right to live free by accepting that some people will not be trustworthy in the way they choose to live. And the way it looks to me, yeah, young people are pretty ****ed up. And they're gonna get to vote. And when they're in charge, freedom is ****ed.

 

[jamil]

Just remember, Congress doesn't want to solve any problem; they need problems so they can promise to solve them if they're re-elected. When nothing gets done, they blame the other party.
Look at the immigration problem. It will NEVER be solved.

The only way to change this world is one person at a time.

I think we could help that along if the importance of family structure is restored. It's not perfect. There's no perfect family. But obviously we're doing a lot worse without it. The lessons learned growing up in a family help people grow up learning helpful boundaries in human interactions. Even when those families are dysfunctional. People still grow up with at least some boundaries.

 

[jsx1043]

“Shall not be infringed” is pretty clear. I don’t remember seeing anything about age listed in there.

Liberty is liberty, no matter the age. You cannot guarantee another’s safety by infringing upon a natural right.

We need less government, not more.

 

[eldirector]

If 18 is an adult, then 18 is an adult. Vote, enter into contracts, die for your country, and yes... purchase firearms.

If you want to call them a "child", then raise the age of adulthood, and strip away ALL the rights and responsibilities from said children.

However, in all honesty, there are only very few things called out specifically as limits to the government, and this is one. Really should start with the limit as written.

 

[Ingomike]

We don’t let folks legally buy alcohol or pot until they’re 21.

Why?

Because the insurance industry wanted it that way…

 

[Ingomike]

We could extend that argument to any right. Free speech? Right to assemble? To worship or not? That's the problem with a free society.

They are marching toward that goal everyday…

 

[jamil]

If 18 is an adult, then 18 is an adult. Vote, enter into contracts, die for your country, and yes... purchase firearms.

If you want to call them a "child", then raise the age of adulthood, and strip away ALL the rights and responsibilities from said children.

However, in all honesty, there are only very few things called out specifically as limits to the government, and this is one. Really should start with the limit as written.

Oh **** that noise. If they do that, how we gonna kick them out of the house when they graduate high school? I have a house to sell. Empty nest, and all that ****. I ain’t got time to wait until the little ****er is 21. Get the **** out. Go make your own way. Time to move on to a different chapter.

 

[BE Mike]

So with the recent events in Texas, I’ve been thinking.

I think we can all agree that the average moral character of our current day youth is much much lower than what it was 20, 30, 50 years ago right?

Throw broken up homes and who knows what kind of trauma and bullying. No real parents or parenting to teach kids how to deal with conflicts or controlling their emotions.

They go through the worst few years of anyone’s life (teen years) and are depressed, lonely, angry, surrounded by violence and wickedness of every sort.

Then on their 18th birthday, they can buy an AR and let their lack of impulse control guide their actions?

I know it’s anathema to 2A to infringe, but maybe letting these troubled teens get past their 18th, 19th, and 20th year of life is not a horrible idea before we allow them to purchase a gun.

Doesn’t mean if you have a well rounded teen that you can’t personally gift them a weapon, but maybe these emotional basket cases shouldn’t be allowed to buy one at the tail end of their worst years when their brain is still not fully formed.

This ain’t 1950 anymore.

We don’t let folks legally buy alcohol or pot until they’re 21.

Why?

They’re 18 and they can go die for our country, but they can’t buy a beer?

Is it not because we as a society have decided that 18-20 year olds still have poor decision making skill sets and impulse control problems?

The other side is always talking about “common sense gun control.”

Problem is, those on the other side of the aisle want to infringe more and more.

Give them an inch and they’ll take a mile.

We’re trying to solve a problem and not even looking at the core issue.

It’s not guns. It’s kids growing up with absentee parents. Absentee fathers (whether they are there physically or not) is our #1 problem in society.

You can’t destroy the family, the foundation of society, and not see these massacres come to pass.

On that note, you can’t tell people that they have no meaning or purpose, that they just accidentally existed, make it socially acceptable to kill our unborn children, that pleasure and happiness should be our ultimate goal, and then not expect these things to continue.

We got problems. We’re not even looking at the real ones…

So raise your kids. Turn off the TV and spend time with them. Teach them good values. Teach them how to think and defend themselves physically and mentally.

And goodness gracious, can we make all schools only have one entrance with an armed guard at the door, in the meantime?

It's never a good idea to paint any group with a broad brush. It is even worse to judge a group of people on the evil actions of one demented individual. BTW, 18 year olds are restricted from purchasing handguns by federal law. So gun store purchases by this group are prohibited.

 

[phylodog]

I vote we take these school shooters and peel 1/4" strips of skin starting from the top of their heads to their toes. Peel one strip nice and slow each day until they expire. No meds, no bandages, no mercy. Chain them to a pole and broadcast the peel every day on prime time television.

An eye for an eye. If you want to act like a coward and turn your personal misery into unbearable mourning for innocent children you deserve nothing even remotely resembling mercy. Matter of fact, I'll change my earlier suggestion so that once a 1/4" strip of skin has been peeled off, we should shower them with rubbing alcohol, you know to prevent infections.

When you drive out the decent, intelligent and willing to sacrifice for the good of others officers you end up with people wearing badges who will stand outside and listen to kids being murdered rather than risk their lives in an attempt to intervene.

None of this **** is coincidental nor are we seeing unintended consequences.

 

[manifest destiny]

Success breeds success. Unfortunately, the inverse is also true. I agree that we should reconcile the age at which one is legally recognized as an adult. Cosby (yes, mr. roofie) had a joke about taking only 2 minutes to create a baby, nine months to deliver a baby and then we spend the next 18 years trying to get them out of the house!

 

[HoosierLife]

“Shall not be infringed” is pretty clear. I don’t remember seeing anything about age listed in there.

Liberty is liberty, no matter the age. You cannot guarantee another’s safety by infringing upon a natural right.

We need less government, not more.

So shouldn't I be able to send my 6 year old packing to school then? Obviously, we have to do away with the silly gun free zone stuff, but after that?

 

[Hatin Since 87]

So shouldn't I be able to send my 6 year old packing to school then? Obviously, we have to do away with the silly gun free zone stuff, but after that?

I owned a gun at 6? I had a gun rack hanging above my bed with a .22, 20 gauge, and a .410 when I was 13.


I got in fights. I had girls break up with me and cheat on me. You know how many times I thought about shooting someone? 0. Not once. I’ve met 6 year olds I’d trust with a firearm more than some 30 year olds I’ve met.

 

[Rookie]

At 7 years old, every gun my dad owned was stored in an unlocked gun cabinet in my room. At 8 years old, I took my shotgun to school for show and tell.

At 10 years old, my son had his very own ar15 in his room. 10 years later, that gun hasn't shot anyone.

My grandchildren were introduced to the concept of real guns at the age of three. Neither one gives a second glance to a loaded gun.

There's a common theme in all of these examples. It has nothing to do with age. It has everything to do with raising children PROPERLY. There's countless examples of adults well over the age of 18 that kill people. Adding another worthless law won't change a damn thing.

 

[ditcherman]

Oh **** that noise. If they do that, how we gonna kick them out of the house when they graduate high school? I have a house to sell. Empty nest, and all that ****. I ain’t got time to wait until the little ****er is 21. Get the **** out. Go make your own way. Time to move on to a different chapter.

Hard **s.

 

[HoosierLife]

I owned a gun at 6? I had a gun rack hanging above my bed with a .22, 20 gauge, and a .410 when I was 13.


I got in fights. I had girls break up with me and cheat on me. You know how many times I thought about shooting someone? 0. Not once. I’ve met 6 year olds I’d trust with a firearm more than some 30 year olds I’ve met.

Touche. That's why I led off with don't we think the average moral character of our youth has declined?

 

[Hatin Since 87]

Touche. That's why I led off with don't we think the average moral character of our youth has declined?

No.


I think the moral character of our families have declined. I think children are, generally speaking, innocent and a product of their environment. So, inadvertently, you are correct. But, it isn’t the children, children just wanna play, laugh, and have fun. Parents are lazy, so they sit their kid in front of a tv or Xbox, feed them pills to make them calm, and ignore them, then wonder why they grow to be a **** head.

 

[jsx1043]

So shouldn't I be able to send my 6 year old packing to school then? Obviously, we have to do away with the silly gun free zone stuff, but after that?

If he can hack it, sure. My kids knew how to operate every firearm I had when they were about six, knew the safety rules and know right from wrong. Heck, they knew how to clear corners and the difference between cover and concealment at 10. At 13 and 16, they both know how to drive, one knows how to fly a plane, they know how to make fire, disinfect water, build an emergency shelter and have their own load outs, armor included.

The wailing and gnashing of teeth mean nothing to me. Piles of dead kids do not equal the removal of the constitutional rights of mine.

I wholly admit that we’re in a sad state of affairs right now, but none of that is my or my children’s fault.

 

[MCgrease08]

You seem to be arguing both sides here. I chalk that up to try and rationalize your thinking, but some of these statements seem contradictory to me.

So with the recent events in Texas, I’ve been thinking.

I think we can all agree that the average moral character of our current day youth is much much lower than what it was 20, 30, 50 years ago right?

Maybe. Maybe not. Obviously it depends on the individual.

Throw broken up homes and who knows what kind of trauma and bullying. No real parents or parenting to teach kids how to deal with conflicts or controlling their emotions.

They go through the worst few years of anyone’s life (teen years) and are depressed, lonely, angry, surrounded by violence and wickedness of every sort.

This is quite the broad brush you're painting with. I'd say teens "surrounded by violence and wickedness of every sort" would be a tiny fraction of all teens across the country.

Then on their 18th birthday, they can buy an AR and let their lack of impulse control guide their actions?

I know it’s anathema to 2A to infringe, but maybe letting these troubled teens get past their 18th, 19th, and 20th year of life is not a horrible idea before we allow them to purchase a gun.

Again, you are assuming all teens are troubled. Even if that were true (it's not) do all of the issues you list simply disappear when someone hits 21?

Doesn’t mean if you have a well rounded teen that you can’t personally gift them a weapon, but maybe these emotional basket cases shouldn’t be allowed to buy one at the tail end of their worst years when their brain is still not fully formed.

This ain’t 1950 anymore.

What difference does it make if a kid was given a gun or if they bought it themself?
Didn't one of the recent school shooters (Michigan maybe) commit his murders with a handgun his parents had bought for him?

Did teens just start becoming emotional post 1950?

We don’t let folks legally buy alcohol or pot until they’re 21.

Why?

They’re 18 and they can go die for our country, but they can’t buy a beer?

Is it not because we as a society have decided that 18-20 year olds still have poor decision making skill sets and impulse control problems?

The other side is always talking about “common sense gun control.”

Problem is, those on the other side of the aisle want to infringe more and more.

Give them an inch and they’ll take a mile.

You recognize gun grabbers want to infringe and will take any compromise and push for more. Raising the age to buy a gun to 21 is one of those infringements and compromises they will run with.

We’re trying to solve a problem and not even looking at the core issue.

It’s not guns. It’s kids growing up with absentee parents. Absentee fathers (whether they are there physically or not) is our #1 problem in society.

You can’t destroy the family, the foundation of society, and not see these massacres come to pass.

On that note, you can’t tell people that they have no meaning or purpose, that they just accidentally existed, make it socially acceptable to kill our unborn children, that pleasure and happiness should be our ultimate goal, and then not expect these things to continue.

We got problems. We’re not even looking at the real ones…

So raise your kids. Turn off the TV and spend time with them. Teach them good values. Teach them how to think and defend themselves physically and mentally.

And goodness gracious, can we make all schools only have one entrance with an armed guard at the door, in the meantime?

All of this is true and the REAL issue. None of these root causes get addressed by raising the age to purchase to 21.