DeSantis 2024?

[jamil]

WTF is so far fetched about Mexico ”paying for the wall”? Small thinkers can only imagine TellingMexico to send a check. There are a myriad of ways to get the cash from Mexico in so many avenues if congress was focused on their job and not on impeaching the only guy to come along trying to do something in decades…

And how many of those ways actually went into paying for the wall? It’s far fetched. It was just a sound bite at a campaign rally. Trump got cheered for it, which fed his ego, which fed his urge to keep saying it. I don’t think it’s any more complicated than that. It’s okay if Trump promises things he can’t deliver on. All politicians do that.

But, Trump supporters have an irrational need to protect his image of delivering on everything. Or making excuses for why not. Why care? So what? He didn’t make Mexico pay for it. Big deal. No need to contort reality. He did more than any modern president on border stuff. Take the win.

 

[KG1]

Just to make this clear once and for all about my position on DeSantis and illegal immigration. Anything he has ever said or done going all the way back to when he was in Congress has been consistant with his illegal immigration/Border stance. That gives me something tangible to work with.

Sorry Bug, pure speculation isn't going to change my mind on this issue.

Moving on.

 

[jamil]

Complete minimization of just how bloody the battles for FBI/DOJ will be…

None of us have gone into detail about how hard it will be to fix the DoJ. So there is no minimizing anything. What Insaid was that a competent leader should be able to handle both. Also, as I noted, the job to clean up the healthcare regulatory apparatus is mostly a legislative effort. Pen and phone won’t fix that. So presumably we’d hope to have both houses. So whoever is the president should have competent people working with congress to get that done, over the objections of CoC/Neocon Republicans. My only objection was the insistence that the latter would have to wait, presumably because the former would suck the very essence out of the president, leaving him capable of only accomplishing one thing. It doesn’t have to wait. Both.

 

[nonobaddog]

WTF is so far fetched about Mexico ”paying for the wall”? Small thinkers can only imagine TellingMexico to send a check. There are a myriad of ways to get the cash from Mexico in so many avenues if congress was focused on their job and not on impeaching the only guy to come along trying to do something in decades…

It just is far fetched. Both of the major powers that rule the country in Mexico are helping illegal immigration into the USA. They don't want it to stop and they are not going to pay anything to stop it.

On this side, you already mentioned the biggest reason - congress.

 

[KG1]

A recent Pro-Trump MAGA Inc Pac ad misleads about DeSantis's stance on border wall. They claim DeSantis voted against border wall funding while in Congress. The ad is misleading.

Pro-Trump ad misleads about Ron DeSantis border wall stance

Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis officially launched his 2024 presidential campaign, intensifying a feud with another contender

www.politifact.com

While he did vote against this one particular bill along with 89 other Republicans in Mar. of 2018 after he had voted for other bills that contained funding it wasn't because of border wall funding., He withheld his vote on this one for other reasons.

He had issues with the way the bill was hastily introduced and put up for a vote without having sufficient time to read the bill and other things that were in it. (sounds familiar) The bill eventually passed, and Trump reluctantly signed it even though he also had similar misgivings about the bill and considered a veto.

DeSanitis has always been in favor of a border wall and still does to this day. Just more examples of his illegal imigrant/Border constancy going back to his stint in Congress.

In April 2017, DeSantis and 14 other congressional Republicans co-sponsored a bill that would have used the money drug trafficker Joaquin "El Chapo" Guzman forfeited for border security measures. That included using funds to build barriers on the southern border. The bill did not go to the floor for a vote.

In July 2017, DeSantis voted in favor of the "Make America Secure Appropriations Act of 2018". This bill provided nearly $1.6 billion in funding to U.S. Customs and Border Protection for construction and improvements of border barriers along the U.S.-Mexico border. The bill passed the House, 235-192, but did not make it to the Senate.

 

[Ingomike]

And how many of those ways actually went into paying for the wall? It’s far fetched. It was just a sound bite at a campaign rally. Trump got cheered for it, which fed his ego, which fed his urge to keep saying it. I don’t think it’s any more complicated than that. It’s okay if Trump promises things he can’t deliver on. All politicians do that.

But, Trump supporters have an irrational need to protect his image of delivering on everything. Or making excuses for why not. Why care? So what? He didn’t make Mexico pay for it. Big deal. No need to contort reality. He did more than any modern president on border stuff. Take the win.

And you have an irrational need to put him down, then excuse it with “I voted for him”. Some will ever be able to get beyond that to understand the concepts. This is the same disconnect those that cannot understand why crime is up but support little penalty for crime.

Securing the border is way more than just a wall, there was to be a financial wall as well. That financial wall would collect fees on money moving from the US to Mexico. Money moving from the US is the largest source of money in Mexico so I have read…

 

[Ingomike]

None of us have gone into detail about how hard it will be to fix the DoJ. So there is no minimizing anything. What Insaid was that a competent leader should be able to handle both.

Do you read your own posts? “A competent leader should be able to handle both” says that the FBI/DOJ fight is not that big of a deal as someone competent could run the presidency, fight the FBI/DOJ fight that will come from all sides, while simultaneously fighting a similar fight with other alphabet agencies…

 

[Ingomike]

It just is far fetched. Both of the major powers that rule the country in Mexico are helping illegal immigration into the USA. They don't want it to stop and they are not going to pay anything to stop it.

On this side, you already mentioned the biggest reason - congress.

Small thinking…

 

[nonobaddog]

Small thinking…

I disagree.
Real thinking.

 

[Ingomike]

I disagree.
Real thinking.

Is it your position that it is impossible to collect tax on money on cash flowing to Mexico?

 

[nonobaddog]

Is it your position that it is impossible to collect tax on money on cash flowing to Mexico?

Not too sure but I'll go ask some drug dealers here and some cartels in Mexico and see if they are willing to pay taxes.

 

[jamil]

Do you read your own posts? “A competent leader should be able to handle both” says that the FBI/DOJ fight is not that big of a deal as someone competent could run the presidency, fight the FBI/DOJ fight that will come from all sides, while simultaneously fighting a similar fight with other alphabet agencies…

C’mon. If you’re gonna read part of what I said, you might as well read the rest. It might even save you from having to reply. I also said the healthcare regulatory fight is more in the legislature. This is where a good leader would have the people around him to help take on things like that. There’s no reason to do only one thing at a time other than that you lack the leadership skills to surround yourself with good people and know how to delegate.

 

[jamil]

Small thinking…

Trump must be a small thinker then. If he actually worked towards that goal, he fell face first into a pile of **** and gave up. And if he didn’t try, he was just blowing smoke at you and didn’t think it was possible.

 

[nonobaddog]

Not too sure but I'll go ask some drug dealers here and some cartels in Mexico and see if they are willing to pay taxes.

The drug dealers were not familiar with "taxes" but said they be curious and might start charging "taxes" and keep the money. The cartels just said "eat **** Gringo."

I think the tax potential in Mexico is highly overstated. The government is not in charge because of the cartels and the cartels are not in charge because they don't give a squat.

 

[foszoe]

KG1's #1528. Retroactively adjusted to make better sense

Sounds like we have been hearing that DeSantis isn't enough like Trump but then when he shares some of the same policy priorities, he is too much like Trump and we don't like that all of a sudden.

Which is it?


Neither

The question is why settle for the cheap imitation when you can have the real thing, especially when the imitation couldn't find enough backbone to defend its tentative anti-endless war position. He's been near the sharp end, he should know better and have had no qualms about saying what he meant and meaning what he said

Lawsuits

 

[KG1]

More examples of consistancy. DeSantis recently readied sending law enforcement and National Guard personnel along with assets to Texas at the request of Gov Abbott for assistance with the border crisis from Florida and other states. Mind you this readiness to assist happened about two weeks ago to handle the anticipated influx when Title 42 was set to expire.

DeSantis showed that he was ready and willing to answer the call for assistance if need be.

Now before anyone says he did it a few weeks before he announced because he's running for POTUS, he did something similar back in 2021. He didn't initiate it for his own "self-interest" "enlightened" or otherwise He did it at the request for assistance from Gov. Abbott.

DeSantis to send law enforcement to US-Mexico border as he gears up for 2024 run

The governor said hundreds of state troopers, police and National Guard members are ready to head to the border as early as Wednesday.

www.tampabay.com

"DeSantis made the announcement after Texas Gov. Greg Abbott sent a letter to the nation’s governors asking them to help support Texas’ “unprecedented border security efforts.” Abbott made the request under the Emergency Management Assistance Compact, a mutual-aid partnership among all states."

 

[Ingomike]

Not too sure but I'll go ask some drug dealers here and some cartels in Mexico and see if they are willing to pay taxes.

That us not the real potatoes, they are both on and off the books workers sending cash back to where they call home. Western Union etc. But should you get the drug cartels to agree good work…

 

[nonobaddog]

That us not the real potatoes, they are both on and off the books workers sending cash back to where they call home. Western Union etc. But should you get the drug cartels to agree good work…

But if they are on the books workers, they are already paying taxes on the income.
And if they are off the books workers there are thousands of IRS workers that could be catching them.

And it is very debatable what the "real potatoes" are, some estimates are the drug money flowing south is greater than the amount being sent.

 

[BugI02]

I think you're a bit confused. Maybe it's because you changed the subject and the two got conflated, I was talking about DeSantis and the illegal immigrant situation and you tried to change the subject to Trump and Schedule F. I never said anything about it not being something tangible. I'll give Trump credit for that.

You don't want to seem to give credit to DeSantis for doing anything tangible that aligns with his consistant stance on the border issue.

You never presented anything tangible to show that he is or will be soft on that issue. All you presented was speculation. That's what I was talking about.

I'm not sure how I can present anything tangible on what he WILL do, but I know he will let you down

You were presenting DeSantis signing a bill impolementing E-verify as a tangible accomplishment at being anti-illegal immigration. and extrapolating (wildly) that he will be a terror on that in DC if he ever gets there. I pointed out that Trump actually for real began building the wall, getting the funds any legal way he could. One is far more tangible than the other, yet Trump gets short shrift while if DeSantis farts in the direction of the southern border it is presented as a major accomplishment on immigration

Schedule F was referenced because, not only was it a real ass attempt to get the whip hand on the deep state but Trump was criticized for doing too little too late. That is relevant to my criticism of DeSantis waiting 5 years, until he is running for president, to trot out his immigration masterpiece and I pointed out that it should be fair to make the same criticism of DeSantis (too little, too late why did you wait so long) as people made of Trump's Schedule F deployment to belittle the accomplishment

Sometimes a post can be about more than one thing AND not entirely about you and what you want to say

Remember, a post by me will be devoid of nuance

 

[BugI02]

Would it be in DeSantis's best self- interest with voters to flip on his Illegal immigration/Border stance that he's constantly had?

What would actually stop him, other than a desire to have a second term. Just like Biden, once he's in he's free to go back on whatever he's said so long as he pleases his handlers. It's a long time Republican tradition

He has no record at the national level of saying what he will do and then doing it, and making like a camp chair on Ukraine doesn't make me feel all warm and fuzzy about his willingness to suffer the slings and arrows