Where are the Force on Force classes at?

[kingnereli]

Yeah, I hear you, but I think there is a lot more information to get across in a weekend class.

A Force on Force training group would be free besides for the equipment costs. Granted it is more of the blind leading the blind without an instructor but I think you would still learn a lot.

The idea of these fof groups has been floating around here for a little while. I hope they get organized. I think it would beneficial for groups of us to get together in less formal situation as long as at least one person new what they were doing. My force on force experience is a bit limited so I haven't tried to spearhead a group in my area. I'm close enough to central Indiana I wouldn't mind the drive.

 

[mercop]

We don't have any courses that don't include lots of force on force. Anything else and you are just shadow boxing. Killing cardboard gets old- George

 

[MattCFII]

We don't have any courses that don't include lots of force on force. Anything else and you are just shadow boxing. Killing cardboard gets old- George

Exactly, you wouldn't be a good boxer if you just punched the bag all day and didn't spar with somebody.

Good to know about your classes! Your on the list of classes I want to take and I've got a lot of good info from your website!

 

[2ADMNLOVER]

It seems (at least for me) that the cost plays a BIG role in the ability to get this type of training .

It would also seem like a "niche" market for someone qualified to conduct this kind of training if they could offer it at maybe half what the others want .

Like with TR , they want $450 for two days of FOF . I wonder how many more folks could afford $225-300 ?

I don't know all the costs involved , just tossing it out there .

 

[mercop]

Exactly, you wouldn't be a good boxer if you just punched the bag all day and didn't spar with somebody.

Good to know about your classes! Your on the list of classes I want to take and I've got a lot of good info from your website!

Glad you like it. I will be adding some of the pics from a Non Ballistic Combative Pistol Course tonight. Check the blog.- George

 

[henktermaat]

It seems (at least for me) that the cost plays a BIG role in the ability to get this type of training .

It would also seem like a "niche" market for someone qualified to conduct this kind of training if they could offer it at maybe half what the others want .

Like with TR , they want $450 for two days of FOF . I wonder how many more folks could afford $225-300 ?

I don't know all the costs involved , just tossing it out there .

I agree. There is a "magic line" at $100 and again at $200. Each "magic line" a service provider or company crosses leaves out a new group of people from being potential customers.

I bet a qualified trainer would get a lot more business teaching a shorter $100 class than a 2-3 day $400 class.

Split the big multi-day class into a logical 101, 102, 103 division and you'd have more people able to do them because they're in smaller chunks.

 

[Shay]

Like with TR , they want $450 for two days of FOF . I wonder how many more folks could afford $225-300 ?

I don't know all the costs involved , just tossing it out there .

It could be $50 per day and it would still be "too expensive". If you make training a priority, the price becomes equal to say, buying another pistol. Most gun owners own more than one gun, but most will never take a single class.

 

[Steve MI]

Amen Shay,

most people have no idea the cost that goes into teaching others
they would cry if they really knew what it takes or cost.

 

[Shay]

Amen Shay,

most people have no idea the cost that goes into teaching others
they would cry if they really knew what it takes or cost.

Whatever, dude. I know you are getting rich off all those training dollars you exploit from the working class. Have fun sailing your yacht this weekend!

 

[Steve MI]

LOL, your first mate hat is ready Little buddy......(in best skipper voice)

 

[mercop]

I prefer to teach two day courses since I travel to teach most of the time. No matter what the subject the students don't always realize the time and money it takes to put a class on. Good comments Shay, can we shorten it and get it on a t-shirt or something.

Having Tang in your kitchen does not make you an astronaut.- George

 

[kingnereli]

I agree. There is a "magic line" at $100 and again at $200. Each "magic line" a service provider or company crosses leaves out a new group of people from being potential customers.

I bet a qualified trainer would get a lot more business teaching a shorter $100 class than a 2-3 day $400 class.

Split the big multi-day class into a logical 101, 102, 103 division and you'd have more people able to do them because they're in smaller chunks.

How dare you be concerned with how much money you spend. And the nerve it takes to just throw alternative ideas out there.

Seriously, I agree. Good training can be prohibitively expensive for a lot of people. The cost of the class is only the beginning. You've got to consider ammo costs, gas for the trip to wherever and sometimes a hotel if it is a multi day course. The costs can really add up depending on the circumstances. Some lower cost "economy" courses would be great.

 

[mettle]

I prefer to teach two day courses since I travel to teach most of the time. No matter what the subject the students don't always realize the time and money it takes to put a class on. Good comments Shay, can we shorten it and get it on a t-shirt or something.

Having Tang in your kitchen does not make you an astronaut.- George

Do you have a real 'force on force' firearm introductory class coming up?

I want to be introduced, correctly, to the correct rules and foremost thought on this topic. Plus I want to be 'put under stress' to learn it right.

It's not a 'cool factor' for me, but an actual 'need to know'.

 

[2ADMNLOVER]

It could be $50 per day and it would still be "too expensive". If you make training a priority, the price becomes equal to say, buying another pistol. Most gun owners own more than one gun, but most will never take a single class.

Sure , some folks don't realize they need it . For folks like me , in this unstable economy trying to pay your bills and live is priority # 1 .

I'd love to take all the classes available but at a few hundred a day , they're more of a luxury item . Offer me a class at $50 a day , close to Indy and see how much training I get then .

 

[Vigilant]

How dare you be concerned with how much money you spend. And the nerve it takes to just throw alternative ideas out there.

Seriously, I agree. Good training can be prohibitively expensive for a lot of people. The cost of the class is only the beginning. You've got to consider ammo costs, gas for the trip to wherever and sometimes a hotel if it is a multi day course. The costs can really add up depending on the circumstances. Some lower cost "economy" courses would be great.

Cannot the same be said for the instructor? Travel, meals, hotels, training material/handouts, all cost money, then there is actually getting paid for your time, what is the dollar figure per hour you place on being away from your family for a couple of days and imparting your professional knowledge to others. Most of these guys ain't gettin' rich teaching others.? Not singling you out, but some will not pay to train no matter what the cost? If you figure a small class at say, 10 guys @ $100 each that's 1K MINUS say $150 for hotels, $60 for meals, say he drives to your area from nearby, so $50 in gas, another $50-100 for instructional materials, two day range rental ??(probably not cheap, maybe free, maybe not a factor), Insurance costs??? again not cheap! That doesn't leave much incentive for an instructor to offer "economy classes".

 

[bwframe]

Cannot the same be said for the instructor? Travel, meals, hotels, training material/handouts, all cost money, then there is actually getting paid for your time, what is the dollar figure per hour you place on being away from your family for a couple of days and imparting your professional knowledge to others. Most of these guys ain't gettin' rich teaching others.? Not singling you out, but some will not pay to train no matter what the cost? If you figure a small class at say, 10 guys @ $100 each that's 1K MINUS say $150 for hotels, $60 for meals, say he drives to your area from nearby, so $50 in gas, another $50-100 for instructional materials, two day range rental ??(probably not cheap, maybe free, maybe not a factor), Insurance costs??? again not cheap! That doesn't leave much incentive for an instructor to offer "economy classes".

You are correct sir!
Just don't ignore the fact that, until your classes are standing room only, you are building your reputation. Your class members are also investing a $ figure that represents not just the entry fee, but time away from home, family, and in some cases work.

 

[Vigilant]

As another thought, most of the well-known schools do offer "economy" classes of sorts, DVD's, while not the same as actual instruction, they will do until you can save for attendance and whatnot. I personally think $400-500 is a bargain, my first class was $650 or so plus travel out west(jeez I wish I'd heard of Boone County back then) and all the various expenses. At that time, that was my entire gun, movie, beer, etc. budget for the year. I make more money now than then, and will still skip most gun purchases in favor of training.