USPSA clubs are revolting!

[shootersix]

Looks like USPSA might be having a few “problems”…I think if idpa added a “open class” (no vest, no box, no magazine limit) their membership might increase by a few members!

 

[Gunmetalgray]

Following out of curiosity. Searching for the back story...

 

[JCSR]

Employee and BOD corruption will do that.

 

[Gunmetalgray]

So the board is kicking out anyone who speaks out against the board. Hmm, never seen THAT done before...
From Ben S;

 

[shootersix]

Who would have thought Foley would have been the lesser of two evils????

 

[Bosshoss]

USPSA has some real issues right now but getting your info from Ben S. and Practical. Shooting. Insights is like getting your news from CNN.

 

[cedartop]

USPSA has some real issues right now but getting your info from Ben S. and Practical. Shooting. Insights is like getting your news from CNN.

I have to agree. Ben puts out great training info, but clearly he has an agenda on this type of stuff. Not saying he doesn't have good reason, just that there is a definite agenda. Is the board crooked as heck? It is looking like it, but the reports of revolt are probably way overblown.

 

[Gunmetalgray]

USPSA has some real issues right now but getting your info from Ben S. and Practical. Shooting. Insights is like getting your news from CNN.

Curious. What are the issues? Doesn't seem like shuffling out some popular board members who speak out would cause clubs nationwide to withdraw from the organization. Maybe so. I can see regional clubs dropping out if their local rep is a yahoo, seen that in IDPA.

 

[Gunmetalgray]

I have to agree. Ben puts out great training info, but clearly he has an agenda on this type of stuff. Not saying he doesn't have good reason, just that there is a definite agenda. Is the board crooked as heck? It is looking like it, but the reports of revolt are probably way overblown.

What's the agenda? Personal grudge from a few years back or a new sport/league being formed that will draw away members? (PCSL??) Just curious and not finding much, which to your point, may either indicate overblown.... or it's being suppressed.

 

[cedartop]

What's the agenda? Personal grudge from a few years back or a new sport/league being formed that will draw away members? (PCSL??) Just curious and not finding much, which to your point, may either indicate overblown.... or it's being suppressed.

Revenge

 

[Dean C.]

What do we have to do to get ACC in on this? I enjoy shooting USPSA but would honestly just rather have actually fun outlaw matches.

 

[longbeard]

What do we have to do to get ACC in on this? I enjoy shooting USPSA but would honestly just rather have actually fun outlaw matches.

Sounds like you should step up and run a match.

 

[Bosshoss]

Curious. What are the issues? Doesn't seem like shuffling out some popular board members who speak out would cause clubs nationwide to withdraw from the organization. Maybe so. I can see regional clubs dropping out if their local rep is a yahoo, seen that in IDPA.

The main issue is they are losing money at rate that is not sustainable. They are doing some things to help with that but IMO for a couple of years they need to reduce the number of Nationals they hold. Nationals are mostly a money losing endeavor even while important to some members and sponsors the nationals. A HUGE portion of membership could care less about the nationals and don't even know when or where they are even held or who wins.
I have shot Nationals 8 out of the last 10 years so I hate saying that but we need to reduce losses.
There is also issues with the board some of which are blown way out of proportion by a vocal few.
I believe some of those issues will be gone after the first of the year with some of the board leaving.

Ben stated in his video that the last 2 area 3 directors have been removed by the board. I guess if you squint hard enough and apply the CNN slant that could be true. The first area 3 director involved was Matt H. who I like and think he would have done a decent job. Actually he moved to Florida (area 6) so he couldn't be area 3 director if not living in area 3. The problem came from the fact that he didn't tell USPSA he moved for 6 months while continuing to function as area 3 director. While he was removed by the board for breaking the Bylaws he really did this himself by moving out of the area. He moved for his job which is great for him but he should have resigned asap when he moved.
The last incident was Scott who was just voted in and then removed for "leaking information"
If you read the minutes he admitted to leaking the info which was also supposedly against the bylaws. Since I don't know exactly what all of the info leaked was I can't say if that was a removeable offence per the bylaws.
Ben also says the vote to remove Scott was not legal because 3/4 of ALL the directors was required not just the ones present. The bylaws have a gray area here IMO but INAL.
Bylaw 7.7 says
" To be approved and become effective, a motion for removal of an officer or Director
shall require a three-fourths majority affirmative vote of the Board of Directors."
Bylaw 5.6 says
"Each Area Director and the President shall have voting powers at all Board of Directors meetings. Unless otherwise
provided in these bylaws, the decision of the Board of Directors shall be determined by a majority vote of the
Directors present. A roll call vote will be taken at the request of any Director or President. On any roll call vote, the
votes of all Directors, including the President, shall be recorded."

I also think Scott would have been a good area director and would have been an asset to the financial committee he was on but if you do break the rules and Bylaws then you need to be held accountable.
Same applies to all board members and even members.

There is a lot more going on in USPSA than this but I'm not going to type out everything I think needs fixed and besides I'm just a nobody who hates people trying to destroy the sport I have been a part of for so long especially for a personal vendetta.

BTW all the info I used above was taken from the minutes and not the internet

 

[mongo404]

According to Instagram post it only takes 1 club in the state to get recognized as yellow on his map. So 1 out of 5 clubs in Kentucky from what I could find. Looks and sounds alot like mainstream media BS.

Here's an idea. Do like Bosshoss and do some research.

Fyi. Incase you haven't figured it out most social media information is twisted and used for the benefit of the OP.

Maybe we could all sit down and have a cup of coffee.

Happy New years to you all

 

[crewchief888]

and on top of it all, raising membership dues.. my (sometimes erratic) thought have got me thinking it's to money in USPSA's hands for the potential legal battles that may be coming in the future.
ive been a USPSA member for 28 years

 

[racegunz]

I’m in Texas right now and the nearest uspsa club is calling their next scheduled matches “hitfactor” so it’s not “nothing” apparently.

 

[Gunmetalgray]

The main issue is they are losing money at rate that is not sustainable. They are doing some things to help with that but IMO for a couple of years they need to reduce the number of Nationals they hold. Nationals are mostly a money losing endeavor even while important to some members and sponsors the nationals. A HUGE portion of membership could care less about the nationals and don't even know when or where they are even held or who wins.
I have shot Nationals 8 out of the last 10 years so I hate saying that but we need to reduce losses.
There is also issues with the board some of which are blown way out of proportion by a vocal few.
I believe some of those issues will be gone after the first of the year with some of the board leaving.

Ben stated in his video that the last 2 area 3 directors have been removed by the board. I guess if you squint hard enough and apply the CNN slant that could be true. The first area 3 director involved was Matt H. who I like and think he would have done a decent job. Actually he moved to Florida (area 6) so he couldn't be area 3 director if not living in area 3. The problem came from the fact that he didn't tell USPSA he moved for 6 months while continuing to function as area 3 director. While he was removed by the board for breaking the Bylaws he really did this himself by moving out of the area. He moved for his job which is great for him but he should have resigned asap when he moved.
The last incident was Scott who was just voted in and then removed for "leaking information"
If you read the minutes he admitted to leaking the info which was also supposedly against the bylaws. Since I don't know exactly what all of the info leaked was I can't say if that was a removeable offence per the bylaws.
Ben also says the vote to remove Scott was not legal because 3/4 of ALL the directors was required not just the ones present. The bylaws have a gray area here IMO but INAL.
Bylaw 7.7 says
" To be approved and become effective, a motion for removal of an officer or Director
shall require a three-fourths majority affirmative vote of the Board of Directors."
Bylaw 5.6 says
"Each Area Director and the President shall have voting powers at all Board of Directors meetings. Unless otherwise
provided in these bylaws, the decision of the Board of Directors shall be determined by a majority vote of the
Directors present. A roll call vote will be taken at the request of any Director or President. On any roll call vote, the
votes of all Directors, including the President, shall be recorded."

I also think Scott would have been a good area director and would have been an asset to the financial committee he was on but if you do break the rules and Bylaws then you need to be held accountable.
Same applies to all board members and even members.

There is a lot more going on in USPSA than this but I'm not going to type out everything I think needs fixed and besides I'm just a nobody who hates people trying to destroy the sport I have been a part of for so long especially for a personal vendetta.

BTW all the info I used above was taken from the minutes and not the internet

Thanks Bosshoss, appreciate the facts and extended reply.

Was curious as to how similar USPSA & IDPA organizations are and how much, if any, does one affect the other. Been an IDPA member for years, help run matches, etc, etc, and we recently had some issues with the mothership as well. What the main one came down to was they were trying to force repeat shooters to pay up and become IDPA members. (does USPSA require that?) Not sure why they started pushing it, maybe they need revenue too. Regardless, it puts us folks trying to run good local matches in a difficult spot. As you said, some participants (heck most) just like shooting in the matches and have no interest what-so-ever in joining the sanctioning body and, if we tell um they have to join, they have said they just won't come back. THAT doesn't help the sport, nor the local clubs. So, same here, I don't want to see the sport I've been involved in for years ruined by personal issues, regulations, or poor money management. Hope the issues get worked out soon. 2024 could be dramatic in many way, was hoping the shooting sports would be less so, we'll see.

Sanctioned or outlaw, I'll enjoy the smell of gunpowder in the air. Happy shooting everyone.

 

[04FXSTS]

To part of what "Gunmetalgray" said, I have never shot USPSA been shooting IDPA and a member for around 20 years. From that background I know IDPA requires a shooter to join after three matches. I know ACC sticks to this policy, however some other clubs I shoot at do not enforce it. From the best of my memory there are private/members only ranges that have an IDPA program that do not enforce this rule because of the range policy. Part of the deal to have the IDPA at the range is that range members can shoot without becoming IDPA members.
I recently shot at a club where the fee was discounted by $5.00 for range members or IDPA members. I am not affiliated with that club so can't say for sure but it is myguess that is part of it. Jim.

 

[shootersix]

To part of what "Gunmetalgray" said, I have never shot USPSA been shooting IDPA and a member for around 20 years. From that background I know IDPA requires a shooter to join after three matches. I know ACC sticks to this policy, however some other clubs I shoot at do not enforce it. From the best of my memory there are private/members only ranges that have an IDPA program that do not enforce this rule because of the range policy. Part of the deal to have the IDPA at the range is that range members can shoot without becoming IDPA members.
I recently shot at a club where the fee was discounted by $5.00 for range members or IDPA members. I am not affiliated with that club so can't say for sure but it is myguess that is part of it. Jim.

Our club’s bylaws state that members cannot be forced to join an outside organization to compete at matches held at our club, in fact our idpa chairman brought it to the board about idpas 3 match rule and even he didn’t want to force shooters to join idpa!

So if you’re a member of our club, you don’t have to join idpa/uspsa/scsa to shoot our matches.

 

[2-Alpha]

USPSA doesn’t require membership to shoot at club-level matches.