Thought experiment poll: 9mm-JHP VS. 45-FMJ

[kaveman]

9mm hasn't won anything. In today's market with today's options it's a good choice. Maybe even the best choice, but when I read the OP I took it to mean that the 9mm Wunderkugel would not be available. Without modern hollow points the 9mm goes back to what it always was,......a really mediocre noise maker. Back to through-n-through, no energy transfer pinpricks. So it's time to go back to what worked before.

And frankly, that's not a FMJ roundnose of any caliber smaller than 12ga. What has been found to work is a large(r) caliber heavy cast bullet with sharp cutting shoulder and a flat point. You get penetration. You get tissue disruption though cutting and you get some shock from the flat front. With that style of bullet would there be a huge difference between 9mm, 10mm and .44/.45? Doubt it, but when working with cast bullets there's an advantage to loading the larger calibers. The lighter bullets in 9mm allow higher velocities which are better avoided. More weight/less speed works better. Also the straight pistol cases like the .45ACP, .40S&W and all of the revolver cartridges are better suited to lead bullets. The tapered 9mm frankly sucks at the loading bench. Take all of that into account and my choice is still the .40S&W for an almost perfect combination of size/weight/velocity, bullet style and loadability. Good combination of capacity and carryability. Doesn't hurt that it's out of favor and cheap on the market. Good guns at half the price of the 9mm model and reloadable .40S&W brass is almost free.

 

[Amishman44]

Bacon. Bacon is always the correct answer. If not it is always 45

Bacon...is for the body! I prefer a .45 acp as a defensive round, but 9mm is most-likely what will be available...

 

[Amishman44]

9mm hasn't won anything. In today's market with today's options it's a good choice. Maybe even the best choice, but when I read the OP I took it to mean that the 9mm Wunderkugel would not be available. Without modern hollow points the 9mm goes back to what it always was,......a really mediocre noise maker. Back to through-n-through, no energy transfer pinpricks. So it's time to go back to what worked before.

And frankly, that's not a FMJ roundnose of any caliber smaller than 12ga. What has been found to work is a large(r) caliber heavy cast bullet with sharp cutting shoulder and a flat point. You get penetration. You get tissue disruption though cutting and you get some shock from the flat front. With that style of bullet would there be a huge difference between 9mm, 10mm and .44/.45? Doubt it, but when working with cast bullets there's an advantage to loading the larger calibers. The lighter bullets in 9mm allow higher velocities which are better avoided. More weight/less speed works better. Also the straight pistol cases like the .45ACP, .40S&W and all of the revolver cartridges are better suited to lead bullets. The tapered 9mm frankly sucks at the loading bench. Take all of that into account and my choice is still the .40S&W for an almost perfect combination of size/weight/velocity, bullet style and loadability. Good combination of capacity and carryability. Doesn't hurt that it's out of favor and cheap on the market. Good guns at half the price of the 9mm model and reloadable .40S&W brass is almost free.

I concur...in self-loads, using cast lead bullets...the larger calibers are much better suited to a larger diameter but slower moving (velocity) bullets for improved performance!
Using that set-up, I prefer .357 magnum or .45 Colt loads...sharp corners and a flat-nose that result in greater penetration!

 

[DadSmith]

10mm 200gr WFNGC bullets 1250 fps 17+1 Glock 20sf. Nuff said.

 

[rootbeer506]

I'm in for 9mm.

I'll take the extra round count and reduced weight. I see the bullets having about the same effectiveness when comparing HP vs FMJ.

 

[nonobaddog]

Imagine there is an economic collapse and ammo was scarce. Imagine awesome factory-made-designer hollow points are too expensive, or too hard to come by. (Isn’t it already expensive to shoot?)

Which would you have to procure and rely on? 9mm hollow points, or 45acp full metal jacket?

• Assume you carry spare magazines and can exchange magazines efficiently, if needed
• Assume you’re not in an offensive situation, but defensive
• Feel free to comment! I’d like to see what people think!

I'm not sure I even understand the question. "Which would you have to procure and rely on?" Kinda funny wording.
Do I "have to procure" it? Or can I use what I already own?

 

[BowhuntnHoosier]

10mm......please and thank you. But if I have to choose. Its gonna be 9mm for me.

 

[johny5]

Anyone thinking differently about this now that 9mm is a half-dollar apiece (when it can be found)?

 

[Tapout4892]

Go big or go home haha I prefer 45.

 

[gregkl]

Anyone thinking differently about this now that 9mm is a half-dollar apiece (when it can be found)?

Nah, I'm too invested in 9 at this point. Reloading components, factory ammunition, pistols, mags, dies, etc.. I am not interested in adding any new calibers. Heck, if I didn't like my Smith revolvers so much, I'd get rid of .38/.357 Mag and be down to one handgun centerfire cartridge.

Hopefully I have enough to ride this out.

 

[VERT]

It’s interesting that not only has 9mm dried up but so have all the components to load it. I could still scrounge around and find .45 lead bullets, older powders and maybe even some large pistolRifle primers. So maybe .45 is the last man standing when the world ends?

 

[sixGuns]

45. I reload it and have plenty. I know the capacity argument and modern bullet design stuff, but I don't go into active peaceful protest war zones. My pistol is a tool to get me to my rifle.

 

[johny5]

It’s interesting that not only has 9mm dried up but so have all the components to load it. I could still scrounge around and find .45 lead bullets, older powders and maybe even some large pistolRifle primers. So maybe .45 is the last man standing when the world ends?

Somewhere, Churchmouse is smiling...

 

[Hohn]

Hole size correlation to incapacitation? About zero. The 9mm if it fails to expand should still give fmj penetration. A round nose FMJ in any caliber is very bad. Worse if it’s soft.

Given the choice between two incapable loads that will require follow up shots, I’ll go with capacity.

 

[Trapper Jim]

if I can’t have my 45 Colt, 44 Mag/special, 41 Magnum or 45 acp, then I will go with the sub caliber Video game stuff

 

[nonobaddog]

9mm and 45Auto - neither is the badass round many people think they are. Capacity is important with pistol rounds like these.

 

[Thor]

If you start with a bullet that has sufficient girth you don't need to make it expand or carry more to feel manly. .45

 

[gregkl]

It’s interesting that not only has 9mm dried up but so have all the components to load it. I could still scrounge around and find .45 lead bullets, older powders and maybe even some large pistolRifle primers. So maybe .45 is the last man standing when the world ends?

I've had some Blue Bullets on order since June 30th and it's looking like I won't see them until the end of September at this point. And that's if they don't get pushed out...again. When I ordered, the lead time was 6 weeks.

I'm going to Evansville this weekend. I might stop in at Ackerman Mfg and see if he has anything I can buy.

 

[Route 45]

if I can’t have my 45 Colt, 44 Mag/special, 41 Magnum or 45 acp, then I will go with the sub caliber Video game stuff

You won't see armed professionals who actually go into harm's way on purpose using any of those, except for 45 ACP. They are fine for casual gun owners, hunting or just plain fun, but I'll stick to what the experts are using for serious defensive purposes.

Gamers, whether they be video or weekend steel smackers, don't figure into the equation.

 

[Chewie]

I'll take the big, old, and slow 45ACP simply because it reminds me of me and I am fully aware of the limitations of both!