Justified or Something Else

[JCSR]

Probably not the first time the big guy bullied a smaller guy but it was his last.

 

[TheGrumpyGuy]

 

[BigRed]

Tough to say what all is going on, but it seems the fat*** was the aggressor once the swing at the throat was made.

NFG

Reminds me of an old Marty Robbins song though:



Around 1:18

 

[Amishman44]

Bullying...intimidation...got into his personal space...punched him in the face...then tried to pin him inside with the car door.
Big guy like that could really hurt someone physically, especially with the aggressive, angry, and 'bowed-up' attitude that he displayed!
People don't understand the physical damage a fist can cause - broken bones, loss of an eye (or 2), permanent brain damage, etc.
Best defense would have been to recognized the pending situation and, if at all possible, take steps to avoid or not allow it to escalate to that point, but keeping in mind that some people will push their agenda as far as possible, overstepping defensive barriers, and create a worse-case scenario, and in those situations one does have to defend oneself!

 

[jbombelli]

A lot of people would still be alive if they could have just kept their hands to themselves

No sympathy.

 

[MrSmitty]

Outside looking in...Justified.....but, what were the circumstances? Little guy kill his dog? Did Little guy escalate the incident? Looked like he was in a place where he could not run, and get away......I'm not a lawyer.....

 

[littletommy]

Hard to tell. Possibly the fat guy was reacting to something the thug wannabe did? Either way, fat guy chose poorly by trying to be as badass as he was big. You just never know who you’re dealing with, so why even paint yourself into that corner?

 

[Kirk Freeman]

The skipping is a kidney shot? Have seen a lot of people shot, have seen spins and jumps, but this is first skip that I have seen.

 

[Route 45]

 

[Creedmoor]

LOL... What was That Famous Sam Colt saying again?
Oh yea,

God created men equal. Colonel Colt made them equal

 

[Bugzilla]

Nobody waited around for the police to explain what happened!

 

[Bluedragon]

Looks like self defense to me, guy didn't draw until he was struck and after that anything couldve happened to him with the other man's size *e.g strangulation* and the presence of an open car door.

Not to mention the assaulter couldve taken his pistol as the assault ensued. So yes justified to me.

 

[Amishman44]

Outside looking in...Justified.....but, what were the circumstances? Little guy kill his dog? Did Little guy escalate the incident?
Looked like he was in a place where he could not run, and get away......I'm not a lawyer.....

A few of the many 'unknowns' in this situation...and any prior events / interactions or 'escalation' the little guy contributed to the final event, will be sorted out by prosecutors and the courts! If the little guy provoked the situation, or contributed to the escalation of the final event, even though he had the right to protect himself while under attack, it doesn't make him immune from responsibility or prosecution.

 

[JCSR]

A few of the many 'unknowns' in this situation...and any prior events / interactions or 'escalation' the little guy contributed to the final event, will be sorted out by prosecutors and the courts! If the little guy provoked the situation, or contributed to the escalation of the final event, even though he had the right to protect himself while under attack, it doesn't make him immune from responsibility or prosecution.

I kinda disagree. Once big guy lays hands on small guy it becomes self defense. I see no reason for anything else to be brought into it. Unless they are in a "must make effort to retreat" state then all bets are off.

 

[BigRed]

I kinda disagree. Once big guy lays hands on small guy it becomes self defense. I see no reason for anything else to be brought into it. Unless they are in a "must make effort to retreat" state then all bets are off.

Yep.
It is almost impossible to retreat, however, when fat man has him cornered and is beating him into the car.

 

[JCSR]

Yep.
It is almost impossible to retreat, however, when fat man has him cornered and is beating him into the car.

I was thinking prior to that small guy could have left the scene and attempted to.

 

[Ark]

A little hard to say. The first swing is total aggression, not provoked by any reasonable interpretation of the word. I think he only lunges for the short guy and tries to pin him after he sees the draw, though, which is understandable but also turns it immediately into a deadly force fight over a gun. At that point, you pretty much have to shoot just to keep possession of the gun and not get it taken away and killed with it.

Big guy is literally twice his size and that first swing could have put his lights out by itself. Assuming there's no other facts floating around, big guy is the aggressor and everything stemmed from his actions. Maybe one hit isn't quite deadly force, maybe drawing the gun turned it into a deadly force situation when it otherwise wouldn't have been, but I would not vote to convict the little guy here unless there was factual evidence that he went out of his way to start it. Disparity of size and ability is a real factor, and you shouldn't go around hitting other people.

 

[The Bubba Effect]

I dont go around screaming at and touching strangers. That is a key part of my self defense.

The big guy did a really good job of looking real tough, closing the distance, cussing and initiating nondecisive physical violence. Gold star for all of that.

The big guy looked like he was trying to get shot.

 

[Amishman44]

I kinda disagree. Once big guy lays hands on small guy it becomes self defense. I see no reason for anything else to be brought into it. Unless they are in a "must make effort to retreat" state then all bets are off.

in the 'moment' of the big guy laying hands on the little guy...yes, he absolutely had the right to defend him! No question...
But the courts will have to sort out any and all prior interaction(s) between the two individuals and determine provocation, etc.
Everything will have to be weighed against the Five Elements of Self-Defense...and he'll have to pass muster, or be cleared of all five elements, in order to have his actions 'justified' as self-defense by the legal system.
1) Innocence
2) Imminence
3) Proportionality
4) Avoidance
5) Reasonableness
In the video, his actions definitely have the appearance of 'self-defense' for an imminent and aggressive action against him.
Hopefully, he has an objective-minded, and not agenda-driven, DA assessing his situation.

 

[JCSR]

in the 'moment' of the big guy laying hands on the little guy...yes, he absolutely had the right to defend him! No question...
But the courts will have to sort out any and all interaction(s) between the two individuals and determine provocation, etc.
Everything will have to be weighed against the Five Elements of Self-Defense...and he'll have to pass muster, or be cleared of all five elements, to have his actions 'justified' as self-defense by the legal system.
1) Innocence
2) Imminence
3) Proportionality
4) Avoidance
5) Reasonableness
In the video, his actions definitely have the appearance of 'self-defense' for an imminent and aggressive action against him.
Hopefully, he has an objective-minded, and not agenda-driven, DA assessing his situation.

What could the small guy have done to justify a possible life ending beating? Nothing I can think of.