Holcomb vetoes house bill 1041 which would have stopped guys who pretend they are girls from playing girls sports in school

[DoggyDaddy]

Ah, I misread the headlines thinking he was trying to let trans get their way. If he's putting a stop to it I'm all for it...

They were very poorly worded. The one from wfyi.com was the one that was closest to what actually happened.

 

[ancjr]

Double negatives are poor choice when explaining events.

Holcomb still needs to go.

 

[BigRed]

Double negatives are poor choice when explaining events.

Holcomb still needs to go.

Derelict Doldrum can GTH.

 

[BJHay]

I just don't think the state government should be micro controlling who a (locally elected) school board decides to allow on a team.

The issue of men on women's team is a self correcting problem. Contrary to a few exceptions that the press points out the bio-male athletes will dominate. In time the bio-females and their parents will realize they're being denied scholarships and recognition that would be theirs otherwise. Pressure will come to the schoolboards to fix the problem.

 

[KLB]

I just don't think the state government should be micro controlling who a (locally elected) school board decides to allow on a team.

IF it affected only that school, maybe.

Their team competes against athletes from other schools state wide though. That means there needs to be uniformity in eligibility for those athletes.

 

[Cameramonkey]

Well if that is the case, Todd doesn't suck.

No, it just means he sucks less.

 

[Expat]

No, it just means he sucks less.

I will acquiesce to that.

 

[Destro]

There are 2 biological females who are on my son's varsity soccer team.

The school is not big enough for a girls team.

They get along just fine on the boys team so I'm not sure why someone who is transgender can't play on the boys team too.

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[DoggyDaddy]

There are 2 biological females who are on my son's varsity soccer team.

The school is not big enough for a girls team.

They get along just fine on the boys team so I'm not sure why someone who is transgender can't play on the boys team too.

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I think it's more of an issue going the other way. When a trans "girl" (biological male) is playing on the girls' teams.

 

[Destro]

I think it's more of an issue going the other way. When a trans "girl" (biological male) is playing on the girls' teams.

Right, I get that... But if biological girls can successfully complete on mens teams, so can non-biological females.

Change the catagories to Open and Girls and let whoever wants to, and can make the cut, play on the "open" team.


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[Timjoebillybob]

Right, I get that... But if biological girls can successfully complete on mens teams, so can non-biological females.

Change the catagories to Open and Girls and let whoever wants to, and can make the cut, play on the "open" team.


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IIRC this bill doesn't prohibit that. Biological males can't play in women's sports. Females, biological or not can play in the men's sports.

 

[Cameramonkey]

There are 2 biological females who are on my son's varsity soccer team.

The school is not big enough for a girls team.

They get along just fine on the boys team so I'm not sure why someone who is transgender can't play on the boys team too.

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You're kidding, right?

Apples and oranges.

Personal story. In HS I was a mid distance runner specializing in 800m. I was damn good for my age. I was faster than most freshmen when the HS coach scouted me during 8th grade Field Day. (a scored track and field event to let us try HS sports to see if we liked an event.)

So I was a smaller guy (5'6 100lbs soaking wet) who placed first EASILY in the 800m event by at least several seconds. And I could run faster than many of the HS team a couple years older than me. Cool, right? Just like your girls. I have no problem with that. Its when it swings the other way that's the problem.

As an example, during the last season Lia Thomas competed as a member of the Penn men’s swim team, which was 2018-19, she ranked 554th in the 200 freestyle, 65th in the 500 freestyle and 32nd in the 1650 freestyle. As her career at Penn wrapped, she moved to fifth, first and eighth in those respective events on the women’s deck.* You cant look at those stats and tell me with a straight face that isnt an unfair advantage.


So back to the field day, what if I were at the starting blocks and looked and notice an unfamiliar face Ive never seen before in class? Turns out its the 11th grader consistently places last in the event. But he decides he now identifies as a 7th grader. He races with us and spanks us all because we are smaller, have less muscle mass, etc. because we haven't had the time to train or develop naturally. Is that fair?


Its not a two way street. And it is intellectually dishonest to claim it is. One will always have an advantage over the other in strength competitions. Hence why you see girls soccer stars playing kicker for the football team, but not as a linebacker. Put most girls on the line and they'll get squashed and steamrolled. THAT is the difference.

*Ive also seen the stat of 240th overall as a male. Even that potentially bogus/averaged/nerfed stat is still stunning.

 

[Twangbanger]

I just don't think the state government should be micro controlling who a (locally elected) school board decides to allow on a team.

The issue of men on women's team is a self correcting problem. Contrary to a few exceptions that the press points out the bio-male athletes will dominate. In time the bio-females and their parents will realize they're being denied scholarships and recognition that would be theirs otherwise. Pressure will come to the schoolboards to fix the problem.

This is example 16,732 of where Libertarianism doesn't work. Sometimes, believe it or not, people are actually preyed on by other people instead of the government, and need government to protect them from the transgressors.

On this issue, the problem will not always self-correct because the population harmed is small, schools are afraid of civil rights lawsuits, and individual girls are scared to speak up for fear of being ostracized.

It's a clear case where feckless Libertarian abstraction needs to be abandoned in favor of obvious, logical action. Why sit around and wait for a deserving girl to be deprived of a championship? Take action, stand up for what is right and move on.

 

[KLB]

This is example 16,732 of where Libertarianism doesn't work. Sometimes, believe it or not, people are actually preyed on by other people instead of the government, and need government to protect them from the transgressors.

And why do you think Libertarians are against laws that protect people from being preyed upon?

 

[Cameramonkey]

And why do you think Libertarians are against laws that protect people from being preyed upon?

I think he is lumping the anarchist Libertarians with ALL Libertarians.

 

[Destro]

You're kidding, right?

Apples and oranges.

I read that probably 3 times, and I don't understand. Im sorry.

 

[Destro]

And why do you think Libertarians are against laws that protect people from being preyed upon?

The free market will sort that out.

 

[Cameramonkey]

I read that probably 3 times, and I don't understand. Im sorry.

allowing a physically inferior sex into a sport dominated by stronger sex OK. No unfair advantage. (e.g. a girl playing (boys) football)
Allowing a physically stronger sex into a sport dominated by weaker sex, NOT OK.

So if allowing biological males into girls sports is OK, then something like allowing a grown ass man into a youth league is OK too? Both have the same problem.

 

[Ingomike]

I read that probably 3 times, and I don't understand. Im sorry.

I thought the ultimate end to all this would be a group of 25-40 year old men, that never went to college, so still have legal eligibility, and are great at basketball identifying as women, go win an NCAA Women’s basketball championship. Yep, strong fully developed males beating up on young twenties women. That sounds fair…

 

[Destro]

allowing a physically inferior sex into a sport dominated by stronger sex OK. No unfair advantage. (e.g. a girl playing (boys) football)
Allowing a physically stronger sex into a sport dominated by weaker sex, NOT OK.

So if allowing biological males into girls sports is OK, then something like allowing a grown ass man into a youth league is OK too? Both have the same problem.

I never advocated for that point.

My point is that I think all transgender athletes should play on boys/male teams exclusively.

I don't believe transgender athletes of any kind should play on girls/female.

If that is what you took from my statement, I guess some introspection is in order on my part.