Four Minneapolis officers fired after death of black man part II

[IndyDave1776]

I kinda agree. Personally, I think Chauvin is the only officer who should be on the hook for this. I don’t think it’s murder, but I think manslaughter is a real possibility. Leaning on a guys neck with your body weight for 9 minutes ain’t good no matter how you try spin it.

I took this perspective as an article of faith until I watched the video for the first time a couple days ago, along with commentary from a retired prosecutor. I found it compelling to at least revisit that conclusion upon seeing Floyd being able to move his head and neck up and down while Chauvin was applying knee.

I would also see a valid argument in that Floyd had by that point claimed most every inconvenience and infirmity this side of PMS which would lead the officers to discount his protests of breathing difficulty not knowing that he was going into drug-induced pulmonary edema. I see it as a simple matter of immediate consequences for lying to the police who presumably do not have clairvoyant powers.

 

[SheepDog4Life]

I kinda agree. Personally, I think Chauvin is the only officer who should be on the hook for this. I don’t think it’s murder, but I think manslaughter is a real possibility. Leaning on a guys neck with your body weight for 9 minutes ain’t good no matter how you try spin it.

Serious question... why do you think he had his full or even most of his body weight on his knee? I'm doubting that because several times it looked like Chauvin nearly lost his balance when Floyd raised up which makes me think the majority of his body weight was back. Doubly so that Floyd was able to raise at all against 140 lbs with his hands cuffed behind his back.

Also, the autopsy didn't reveal any bruising, which I'm not an ME, but I would think there would be if it was his full or majority of his body weight for that long.

I'm hung up on the fact that the knee was in MPD training... which is still hard for me to grock... but it was, so it's hard to argue that the technique, in itself was a "crime" or "depraved" no matter how bad it looked. But, yeah, 9 minutes, Jesus! FWIW, that seems like this should be about culpable negligence - which from what I read is manslaughter 2 in Minnesota.

But, there is still the open question of whether Floyd was a dead man walking from the meth/fentanyl speedball that he "hooped". Prosecutors indicated in their opening statements that they would show evidence the knee caused death.

 

[churchmouse]

I took this perspective as an article of faith until I watched the video for the first time a couple days ago, along with commentary from a retired prosecutor. I found it compelling to at least revisit that conclusion upon seeing Floyd being able to move his head and neck up and down while Chauvin was applying knee.

I would also see a valid argument in that Floyd had by that point claimed most every inconvenience and infirmity this side of PMS which would lead the officers to discount his protests of breathing difficulty not knowing that he was going into drug-induced pulmonary edema. I see it as a simple matter of immediate consequences for lying to the police who presumably do not have clairvoyant powers.

Watched it a few times. I see several issues all around but yes, the big man was a well known AssHat. Chauvin knew this from personal issues with the man in the real world as to how he enjoyed inflicting pain on others. Read to many statements as to this fact but they have mostly been scrubbed away.....go figure.

Yes he had motion and yes the knee is a known restraining technique but hey, lets ride this all the way to the next Peaceful protests at the local Target OK.

I would love to just for once see an actual trial based on fact and no outside influences being brought to bear by a group just stewing for conflict.
Let the real facts fall where they may and put the law in front. Just for once OK. It might put just a small modicum of faith back in the system. As of now I have less than zero.

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

Seems to me he has a bias against the police.

What's his INGO handle?

 

[Leadeye]

Seems pretty complex to me, when you have several different factors involved in a death, how do they figure responsibility? Somebody swallows cyanide, then is shot, who is guilty the poisoner or the shooter? 50-50?

 

[KittySlayer]

...how do they figure responsibility?

The one wearing the police badge is guilty.

Next question?

 

[churchmouse]

Seems pretty complex to me, when you have several different factors involved in a death, how do they figure responsibility? Somebody swallows cyanide, then is shot, who is guilty the poisoner or the shooter? 50-50?

The shooter gives traction to a movement of crap sacks looking for a fight just to start a fight. In the fighting some narratives are invented and an entire political movement is fostered to ruin the rest of what little republic we have to hold onto.

Show me where I am wrong in this. I will listen.

 

[Ark]

Seems pretty complex to me, when you have several different factors involved in a death, how do they figure responsibility? Somebody swallows cyanide, then is shot, who is guilty the poisoner or the shooter? 50-50?

It is, and that's what makes this kind of situation so rife for grifters and people trying to set a narrative. The police are not blameless, but they are also not primarily to blame. People don't like that, they want to decide on a clear answer immediately and not worry about updating it for new information or parsing out nuance.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Seems pretty complex to me, when you have several different factors involved in a death, how do they figure responsibility? Somebody swallows cyanide, then is shot, who is guilty the poisoner or the shooter? 50-50?

I am going to say that it depends on your point if view. At this point it appears that Floyd was a walking dead man from the moment he, well, administered the drugs to himself. Unlike being shot I doubt Officer Chauvin's knee would have been anything approaching fatal, even looking at it through the lens of my relatively poor health.

Returning to your hypothetical, with the added complication of both acts being lethal in nature, for my own purposes, I am going to say it is a 100/100 split just as if two shooters fired simultaneously. I wouldn't be surprised to see a court hand out murder to the shooter and attempted murder to the poisoner. In today's political environment, my guess is that the guilty party is whoever the mob says it is.

 

[KittySlayer]

In today's political environment, my guess is that the guilty party is whoever the mob says it is has the deepest pockets.

FIFY

Let's face it, the families (and their lawyers) are looking for a big payout too. They want justice for perceived bad acts but take no responsibility themselves for raising a thug and a drug addict.

 

[IndyDave1776]

FIFY

Let's face it, the families (and their lawyers) are looking for a big payout too. They want justice for perceived bad acts but take no responsibility themselves for raising a thug and a drug addict.

Absolutely! And Officer Chauvin is a terrorist for not having clairvoyant powers. Further, i would like to see an analysis on Floyd's chances of surviving the overdose had Chauvin magically known what was happening the second his boots hit the pavement and called for an ambulance as he was getting out of his car.

 

[nonobaddog]

... but take no responsibility themselves for raising a thug and a drug addict.

That too is somebody else's fault. It is always somebody else's fault.

 

[Leadeye]

We'll just have to see how it sorts out, but I don't see the BLM gang being happy with any result less than the cop spending the rest of his life in jail. As was mentioned upthread some people just look for reasons to go nuts.

I remember as a young man getting the short end of a business deal and saying that it wasn't fair. My boss at the time told me fair is a word for children and has no meaning in the real world. The law is like that.

 

[IndyDave1776]

We'll just have to see how it sorts out, but I don't see the BLM gang being happy with any result less than the cop spending the rest of his life in jail. As was mentioned upthread some people just look for reasons to go nuts.

I remember as a young man getting the short end of a business deal and saying that it wasn't fair. My boss at the time told me fair is a word for children and has no meaning in the real world. The law is like that.

Yes. Same with justice or truth.

 

[Ark]

Prosecutor who charged Derek Chauvin in George Floyd death sold Minneapolis home amid protest security concern

The prosecutor who first charged former Minneapolis police officer Derek Chauvin in George Floyd’s death was forced to sell his home and upped security measures after crowds of hundreds to over a thousand protesters repeatedly showed up at his doorstep last summer.

www.foxnews.com

Fun fact, the prosecutor who first charged Chauvin has sold his home in Minneapolis and blown town. The house sold at $150k below asking and at less than they bought it for in 2007.

Hope the new buyers paid up their insurance.

 

[KLB]

FIFY

Let's face it, the families (and their lawyers) are looking for a big payout too. They want justice for perceived bad acts but take no responsibility themselves for raising a thug and a drug addict.

They already got their payday.

 

[Jaybird1980]

They already got their payday.

That's only the first installment

 

[rooster]

Anyone watch the trial today? Apparently it’s being live-streamed.

 

[IndyDave1776]

They already got their payday.

The problem is that they aren't satisfied with money. They also want blood

 

[SwikLS]

Anyone watch the trial today? Apparently it’s being live-streamed.

I'm just interested in the riots. Its a hoot watching these D strong holds implode on themselves.