Can you carry at events at the American Legion Mall?

[BADWOLF]

I was just wanting to know for this summer and all I could find on here was a 2 entry thread from 2010

 

[Outlaw]

I don't see why not. It's state owned property.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

If it is state property, then the state could prohibit carry.

Who runs the mall property?

 

[GIJEW]

If it is state property, then the state could prohibit carry.

Who runs the mall property?

I think we've been 'round&'round this before but...paraphrasing (because I'm being lazy and not getting the exact quote), the state constitution says that the right of the people, as individuals, to keep & bear arms for their defense shall not be infringed. Given that, unless there is some particular security issue: jails, court rooms, etc, HOW can the state lawfully prohibit carrying firearms? Being an 800lb gorilla and doing it just cuz they want to is another thing.

 

[lonehoosier]

 

[Kirk Freeman]

I think we've been 'round&'round this before but...paraphrasing (because I'm being lazy and not getting the exact quote), the state constitution says that the right of the people, as individuals, to keep & bear arms for their defense shall not be infringed. Given that, unless there is some particular security issue: jails, court rooms, etc, HOW can the state lawfully prohibit carrying firearms? Being an 800lb gorilla and doing it just cuz they want to is another thing.

Ok, want to be certain I understand. Do you believe that the STATE OF INDIANA cannot prohibit carry on STATE property?

If so, you are incorrect. Please do not transpose preemption of lesser units of government into some sort of prohibition on the State making regulations.

So, back at it, who owns/manages the mall?

 

[MarkC]

I think we've been 'round&'round this before but...paraphrasing (because I'm being lazy and not getting the exact quote), the state constitution says that the right of the people, as individuals, to keep & bear arms for their defense shall not be infringed. Given that, unless there is some particular security issue: jails, court rooms, etc, HOW can the state lawfully prohibit carrying firearms? Being an 800lb gorilla and doing it just cuz they want to is another thing.

Ok, want to be certain I understand. Do you believe that the STATE OF INDIANA cannot prohibit carry on STATE property?

If so, you are incorrect. Please do not transpose preemption of lesser units of government into some sort of prohibition on the State making regulations.

So, back at it, who owns/manages the mall?

Oh my, another variation on the "what part of 'shall not be infringed' do you not understand?" argument. His attention is invited to IC 35-47-11.1, the chapter entitled "Local Regulation of Firearms, Ammunition, and Firearms Accessories." The very first section:

IC 35-47-11.1-1
Application
Sec. 1. This chapter applies to a political subdivision (as defined
in IC 3-5-2-38).


Or is this an Article 1, Section 32 issue and I missed it?

 

[Tactically Fat]

This is akin to the completely valid "ban" on firearms at the State Museum and State Historical Sites.

The ban is valid at the STATE level. Preemption doesn't include the STATE/State agencies from doing it.

 

[MarkC]

This is akin to the completely valid "ban" on firearms at the State Museum and State Historical Sites.

The ban is valid at the STATE level. Preemption doesn't include the STATE/State agencies from doing it.

And other state buildings, such as the Statehouse and the buildings at the Government Center campus. However, if someone tried to enter with a prohibited item, we would just make them take it back to the car. No freak outs.

 

[eldirector]

Good grief, folks.

The property is owned by the State, managed by a State Commission, and operated by a private non-profit. There is nothing in IC or IAC that prohibits carry on the property or in the buildings. There is nothing on-line at Indiana War Memorials Foundation | IWMF regarding ANY policies. The non-profit could still have a policy, if they wanted. If there is one, it does not seem to be widely published. If one was truly concerned, one could ask:
CustomerService@indianawarmemorials.com

IMHO: it would be pretty hypocritical to forbid carry at a War Memorial. But, I've seen stranger.

 

[cooltools]

Good grief, folks.

The property is owned by the State, managed by a State Commission, and operated by a private non-profit. There is nothing in IC or IAC that prohibits carry on the property or in the buildings. There is nothing on-line at Indiana War Memorials Foundation | IWMF regarding ANY policies. The non-profit could still have a policy, if they wanted. If there is one, it does not seem to be widely published. If one was truly concerned, one could ask:
CustomerService@indianawarmemorials.com

IMHO: it would be pretty hypocritical to forbid carry at a War Memorial. But, I've seen stranger.

 

[GIJEW]

I'm not talking about preemption against local units of government, I'm coming at this as a "philosophical" discussion about the relationship between people and government.

1)Government (federal or state) doesn't own anything and doesn't have rights, it has powers that are delegated to it by we the people.

2)The Constitutions are contracts under whose terms we grant government officials the authority to govern

3)If the government then goes and makes a regulation--or law if they want to call it that--that contradicts the Constitution, it arguably has all the legitimacy of obama abusing his pen and phone to order the Border Patrol NOT to enforce the law and secure the border.

Like I said, what government does and what is "lawful" aren't always the same thing. Note that I wasn't talking about particular security concerns/situations: jails, court rooms, etc

 

[Outlaw]

Ok, want to be certain I understand. Do you believe that the STATE OF INDIANA cannot prohibit carry on STATE property?

If so, you are incorrect. Please do not transpose preemption of lesser units of government into some sort of prohibition on the State making regulations.

So, back at it, who owns/manages the mall?

Sorry I was vague in my response. I didn't mean to imply the state could not prohibit carry. My thinking is, I know it is gifted to the Legion by the state but they still own the property and it's not listed in the IC as a prohibited place. I know the war memorial runs the block south of North street but the state maintains the property between north and St Clair. My wife and I are on this property everyday Monday through Friday. Employees of the American legion or prohibited from carry on the property but as far as I can tell non-employees are not.

Ianal this is simply my semi educated opinion

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Ok, State owns it. IC or IAC?

 

[Thegeek]

This falls under the irony that by definition these are public places and should be the last place rights are ever denied. The entity which is supposed to ensure our rights is the first to deny them.

 

[BADWOLF]

But does the company or group who rents the space for a " concert " or other reason have any say since it still is public space?

 

[eldirector]

But does the company or group who rents the space for a " concert " or other reason have any say since it still is public space?

Yes. They can have any policy they want.

 

[BADWOLF]

OK what if the contract they sign states they will abide by all state laws?

State laws and constitution both dictate that a licences person can carry anywhere in public places as long as it is not a prohibited place set forth by the state.... I thought?

+ excerpt from contract. And I quote

" The IWMC operates and maintains 24 acres in the heart of downtown Indianapolis. The IWMC’s mission is to honor and commemorate the fidelity, valor and sacrifice of Hoosier Veterans. The User must use the facilities in a manner that is keeping with the spirit of patriotism, citizenship, and good will to others. "

What's more patriotic than exercising your constitutional rights fought for by the men and women that the area honers?