2021 Debt Ceiling Showdown

[buckwacker]

Zerohedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero

www.zerohedge.com

This got me thinking. Will Dems refuse to raise the debt ceiling and force a default unless they get their massive spending bills pushed through? For those that think the last two years have been orchestrated to take the US off its pedestal on the world stage, would this be game, set, match? Is it a heads I win, tails you lose proposition?

 

[jake blue]

That is a theory and there are things happening in the global economy which suggest that's the direction we're heading whether it's an agenda or just the natural consequence of a century of loose fiscal policy.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

Zerohedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero

www.zerohedge.com

This got me thinking. Will Dems refuse to raise the debt ceiling and force a default unless they get their massive spending bills pushed through? For those that think the last two years have been orchestrated to take the US off its pedestal on the world stage, would this be game, set, match? Is it a heads I win, tails you lose proposition?

Eh, I doubt it. Have you ever known a Dem to vote for less spending? They'll want the debt ceiling raised or suspended. I don't think they'll vote for default.

 

[BigRed]

Every one of these ******** needs to be hanged for generational theft.

 

[jwamplerusa]

I am demanding my Congresscritters NOT vote to raise the debt ceiling. NO MORE! Cut the Communists (AKA Democrats) off where it hurts, the printing press.

I've made it clear, shut it ALL down. If the Dept. of Ed and Dept. of Labor want to work for free to do his highnesses bidding, they can have at it.

(And yes, there is a degree of hyperbole in the above, but I am also somewhat serious. This is war, and those who want the Constitution to mean ANYTHING, need to gird themselves for a fight and pain. Better budgetary and fiscal, than kinetic.)

 

[Shadow01]

I’m close enough to retire if I choose. I have been fortunate enough to have excellent retirement. No kids or grandchildren to worry about shouldering the burden. Raise that ceiling as high as you can. Print that money like you are fueling a fire to beat back the cold from the winter of 78. I shall not see or have family that deals with the aftermath of the debt load. It’s time to allow a few younger generations see and feel what the burden of their choices entails. Enjoy what you voted for on the left. I hope the debt load is enough to choke the spirit of living from some.

 

[jsx1043]

Eh, I doubt it. Have you ever known a Dem to vote for less spending? They'll want the debt ceiling raised or suspended. I don't think they'll vote for default.

There was a time a couple of years ago where I would have agreed with this from a simple common sense standpoint, just know how politics works. But over the course of the last few years every decision made out of DC always seems to be the exact opposite of common sense.

I mentioned the debt default back near the end of July when it was due to expire. I’m still of the mindset that just like anything else, it’ll be used as a way to gain more power and sow division, regardless of what the vote is. It’s not like raising the debt ceiling actually does anything other than allow them to keep printing away (which of course in and of itself is horrible for the bottom line,) we know that they aren’t beholden to sound fiscal management and if it’s a topic that can be used to gain more power, then it will be wielded like club.

For those in the Great Reset mindframe, just add the default on to the other litany of poor decisions since January of this year that have destroyed the country’s ability to remain solvent. I’d dare say that Hanlon’s Razor can only be used as an excuse for so long.

Just as a pop culture note, the US debt default is what causes the global economic collapse scenario in the book series Patriots by James Wesley, Rawles.

 

[Flash-hider]

Don't worry, there will be plenty of Mitt Romney types who will fall on every grenade the democrats toss on the floor to save the day and advance marxism another 10 steps.

 

[Ark]

Shut it down forever until Biden and his cabal of tyrants drop ALL their covid crap, FOREVER. No masks. No shots. No restrictions. No mandates. Return to normal or burn the federal government down and secede.

 

[Shadow01]

The real problem is a “shutdown “ is not really a full shutdown.

 

[jwamplerusa]

The real problem is a “shutdown “ is not really a full shutdown.

If CAN BE, with enough will.

 

[buckwacker]

Previously I would have had a hard time believing that elected, and unelected, US government officials could attempt to bring about the collapse of the country. Sure I've said it before, but it was mostly hyperbole. Over the last several years I blamed it on Trump hatred. Now he's gone, and they've kicked it into high gear. I'd like to blame incompetence or coincidence now, but I can no longer do that because the data isn't scattered about the mean. Every single thing happening seems to be geared toward pushing us over the edge. That's why I think the dems in Congress will insist on the multiple trillions of new spending or they'll refuse to raise the debt ceiling. Both options are terribly detrimental to the stability of country so I'm left with the only possible explanation: they want to bring it down.

 

[amboy49]

I am a time in my life where I can loan money TO the banks. Currently CD rates are practically non existent. I can remember when the Prime Rate was 21% and 30 year fixed rate mortgages were 16%.

Inflation is occurring now - and will continue. Those who are voting for Democrats have never experienced inflation at 1980’s levels. If it does occur it will actually benefit me as investment rates will increase. It, however, will cripple our economy and place a horrible burden on those less financially independent. It will directly impact my children and grandchildren for decades to come.

I‘m glad I’m going out instead of coming in.

 

[manifest destiny]

I suspect the debt ceiling will be raised some how, some way. But only after maximum discord, division and deals made. The kind of deals that benefit the pols and does NOTHING for the average citizen. Remember The O Great One shutting down veterans memorials and national parks? Then turn around and backpay the entrenched bureaucrats that we're furlowed. If one wanted to destroy this country, would that person do anything different than what this current administration has done?

 

[jake blue]

The debt ceiling is really just the government's 'credit limit' for funding current agencies and functions. 'Shutting it down' is in a metaphorical sense the desired result but in a real and practical sense the government doesn't actually shut down. In fact, the people who suffer the most from such actions are the civil servants who get deemed 'essential' and then are required to keep showing up in spite of the fact that they're not getting paid on time. Even if the promise is that paychecks will catch up eventually, it's still a financial difficulty for many during the impasse. These are everyone from soldiers to secretaries who depending on their job and department may not have the choice to stay home and collect unemployment.

My brother-in-law is a prime example of this. As the site manager for a FEMA distribution facility, he's deemed essential and has to continue showing up for work. However, his site uses a labor contract for the workers and subcontractors are one of the first budget cuts made during a shutdown. IF a natural disaster were to strike during a government shutdown, he'd be sitting on all the water and medical supplies and temporary housing needed with no way to load it onto trucks to get it where it needs to go. It's not just his bank account that's suffering, now it's the suffering of tens of thousands of victims of a natural disaster who wonder why their government has failed them in their hour of need.

This is the kind of scenario politicians HOPE for! The best way for them to push through an unpopular political agenda is to backdrop it with human suffering as the consequence of inaction. It's how we arrived where we are today debating if we even have freedom regarding our own bodies because in the wake of 9/11 politicians easily passed the most anti-constitutional law ever, ironically entitled the Patriot Act. 20 years later we're reaping the rewards of absolute presidential empowerment with a dictator-in-chief who's so unhinged out own allies are afraid he's going to push the button and nuke the planet.

I am all for reigning in our bloated government but the debt ceiling debate doesn't accomplish that goal. The government doesn't shrink just because they stop paying their bills - they just rob Peter to pay Paul until the pain trickles down to the common man who then demands action. And if the pain isn't felt immediately, it will in the long run as most government debt is held by our pension funds, the social security fund, etc. A true government default would wipe out most of our retirement plans as if some of us were ever going to be able to afford to retire in the first place.

THAT'S the great reset - equality in bankruptcy as everyone starts over with nothing. So whether that occurs by spending America into oblivion or defaulting, both accomplish the same goal which is to start over from zero. That's what I think is going to be the motivation behind cryptocurrency - just like when past currencies were discontinued in favor of the dollar, there will be a short period of opportunity when you can convert your cash to FED-crypto (at less than optimal exchange rates no doubt) after which your dollars will be worthless paper. The biggest question in that scenario is whether America's cryptocurrency will be the international standard for exchange and I'm guessing probably not. Who's going to trust the currency of a nation that can't even balance their own budget!

 

[ditcherman]

The debt ceiling is really just the government's 'credit limit' for funding current agencies and functions. 'Shutting it down' is in a metaphorical sense the desired result but in a real and practical sense the government doesn't actually shut down. In fact, the people who suffer the most from such actions are the civil servants who get deemed 'essential' and then are required to keep showing up in spite of the fact that they're not getting paid on time. Even if the promise is that paychecks will catch up eventually, it's still a financial difficulty for many during the impasse. These are everyone from soldiers to secretaries who depending on their job and department may not have the choice to stay home and collect unemployment.

My brother-in-law is a prime example of this. As the site manager for a FEMA distribution facility, he's deemed essential and has to continue showing up for work. However, his site uses a labor contract for the workers and subcontractors are one of the first budget cuts made during a shutdown. IF a natural disaster were to strike during a government shutdown, he'd be sitting on all the water and medical supplies and temporary housing needed with no way to load it onto trucks to get it where it needs to go. It's not just his bank account that's suffering, now it's the suffering of tens of thousands of victims of a natural disaster who wonder why their government has failed them in their hour of need.

This is the kind of scenario politicians HOPE for! The best way for them to push through an unpopular political agenda is to backdrop it with human suffering as the consequence of inaction. It's how we arrived where we are today debating if we even have freedom regarding our own bodies because in the wake of 9/11 politicians easily passed the most anti-constitutional law ever, ironically entitled the Patriot Act. 20 years later we're reaping the rewards of absolute presidential empowerment with a dictator-in-chief who's so unhinged out own allies are afraid he's going to push the button and nuke the planet.

I am all for reigning in our bloated government but the debt ceiling debate doesn't accomplish that goal. The government doesn't shrink just because they stop paying their bills - they just rob Peter to pay Paul until the pain trickles down to the common man who then demands action. And if the pain isn't felt immediately, it will in the long run as most government debt is held by our pension funds, the social security fund, etc. A true government default would wipe out most of our retirement plans as if some of us were ever going to be able to afford to retire in the first place.

THAT'S the great reset - equality in bankruptcy as everyone starts over with nothing. So whether that occurs by spending America into oblivion or defaulting, both accomplish the same goal which is to start over from zero. That's what I think is going to be the motivation behind cryptocurrency - just like when past currencies were discontinued in favor of the dollar, there will be a short period of opportunity when you can convert your cash to FED-crypto (at less than optimal exchange rates no doubt) after which your dollars will be worthless paper. The biggest question in that scenario is whether America's cryptocurrency will be the international standard for exchange and I'm guessing probably not. Who's going to trust the currency of a nation that can't even balance their own budget!

I'm not sure you're reading hard enough into what Ark and Wampler are saying; when you say "all for reigning in our bloated government" they are saying "full stop", "burn it down", at least that's how I read it. May be I read it that way because I see that's the only way out and up.
Under their scenario, your brother in law doesn't have a job because it's not governments job to take care of everything, that belongs to the individual.
Hard to imagine, from where we are now, I know.
Extreme pain.

 

[jake blue]

I think I understand the perspective of burning it all down and if that's the only solution painful though it may be then that's what will have to happen. I'm probably just an optimist hoping that people will come to their senses before they have to get that bad.

 

[buckwacker]

I think I understand the perspective of burning it all down and if that's the only solution painful though it may be then that's what will have to happen. I'm probably just an optimist hoping that people will come to their senses before they have to get that bad.

Well then they'd better hurry, because we're getting pretty close.

 

[jake blue]

"Our patience is wearing thin" LoL

 

[NKBJ]

Perhaps I have low expectations...