Can't wear a Jesus Saves shirt in the Mall of America?

[BehindBlueI's]

That's the basis of EVERY religion. Every religion that I know of anyway. (and I'm not saying I'm all knowing) They pretty much all teach their followers to have faith in their teachings, and that any other belief is false.

Respectfully, I that is much too generalized. Some may argue the difference between a religion and a philosophy , but I don't intend to go down that rabbit hole and think it's something of a semantics argument that's really tough to get any conclusion on. The exclusionary idea of religion has ebbed and flowed over human history but is not universal by any means in place and time and the idea that "all paths lead up the mountain" is represented quite well on a wider timeline.

As an example, Mohammed originally did not allow Christians or Jews to convert to Islam. Only pagans were to be converted, as Christians and Jews already believed in the same God and if they were Jews God wanted them to be Jews, if they were Christians God wanted them to be Christians, etc. Early Protestants and Muslims were sometimes more similar than Protestants and Catholics, as rejection of the trinity was a hot topic for them both. Wahabi Islam would strongly disagree with that idea today. Sufi Islam would be much more inline with it.

It is sometimes too easy to present any religion as monolithic, but some version of "Unitarianism" tends to exist in any of them. Sometimes as a minority, of course, but it's usually there in some capacity.

 

[Shadow01]

That's not how that works at all. Churches get tax breaks, yet we certainly don't demand anyone can say anything. Same for a small bakery or wedding venue. Do you really want the government to dictate what speech you are required to allow in your business or organisation just because of your tax status? Are you really asking for more government control?

And besides, if we hold the mall of America to be like a school, then yes, the guy would be asked to cover or remove his shirt.

I prefer that all available funding dry up. But if you stick you hand out to get money taken from my pocket I have no problem injecting my take on life into your business. If that bothers you, don’t hold your hand out.

 

[ZurokSlayer7X9]

In that case, it was found that the State Constitution provided the right "petition" at the shopping center, not the 1st Am. of the U.S. Constitution.

However, the Supreme Court found that the shopping center's 1st Amendment and private property rights were not violated by the State Constitution.

It's a kind of convoluted issue.

Appreciate that clarification. Have to agree it's tricky terrain any way you slice it.

 

[JettaKnight]

I prefer that all available funding dry up. But if you stick you hand out to get money taken from my pocket I have no problem injecting my take on life into your business. If that bothers you, don’t hold your hand out.

The problem is, it's not your take, but the Feds. Do you really want that? Even if it means all the LBGTQIA+ that comes with it?

 

[JettaKnight]

I don't care what people's shirts say.

The fact that most people are slobs and generally clueless/self centered jerks in their general behavior.............thats what I find offensive.

Then there's that hygeine thing......

A veteran of gun shows, huh?

 

[JettaKnight]

I had read the news story well before reading this thread. Not trying to be insulting, but it seems that most here are discussing the headline only, and not taking all the information in the article into account.

This person was kicked out and trespassed from Mall of America for 24 hours, less than a week prior due to proselytizing and generally bothering other customers, which is against their code of conduct. I seriously doubt that was the first run-in he had had with security. I suspect he is well known with security and they are just DONE with his antics, regardless what his shirt says. They very well may have had complaints from businesses "He's back and dressed to intrude!"

Now the Mall is stuck no matter what happens. People would complain that if the mall didn't address disruptions (people shouting news in the common area), and another group complains when they do. I'm very much a Christian and first amendment supporter, but I have to side with the mall on this one. Not because of the shirt, but because of the person's previous actions and suspected intent.

--Rick

Paul Harvey likes this post.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I had read the news story well before reading this thread. Not trying to be insulting, but it seems that most here are discussing the headline only, and not taking all the information in the article into account.

This person was kicked out and trespassed from Mall of America for 24 hours, less than a week prior due to proselytizing and generally bothering other customers, which is against their code of conduct. I seriously doubt that was the first run-in he had had with security. I suspect he is well known with security and they are just DONE with his antics, regardless what his shirt says. They very well may have had complaints from businesses "He's back and dressed to intrude!"

Now the Mall is stuck no matter what happens. People would complain that if the mall didn't address disruptions (people shouting news in the common area), and another group complains when they do. I'm very much a Christian and first amendment supporter, but I have to side with the mall on this one. Not because of the shirt, but because of the person's previous actions and suspected intent.

--Rick

Did you read it at a different source? Just curious, I read the article in the OP but through the lens of the media generally tries to rile us up with the most slanted and designed to cause offense/emotional reaction possible hence my reference to not judging because who knows what happens before the cameras came on.

 

[chipbennett]

Fed lawyers also invented the right to ban marijuana growing and sales. It was well established and a similarly farcical political landscape.....until people told the feds to get f*****.

The people can totally ignore federal overreach if they have the guts to do it.

To be clear, I really enjoy reading Chips perspectives on things and i do not want my tone here to appear combative towards Chip.

There are multiple ways to deal with government overreach. With respect to the "right of accommodation", I favor forcing that "right" to be applied as often and as equally as possible.

I hold the same view of Obergefell, and am eagerly looking forward to someone using it as the basis to force states to recognize state-issued firearm carry licenses.

 

[chipbennett]

Can you show where that has actually happened?
The "malls" have it in their policy (in Indiana), that weapons, including guns, are prohibited.
An offender can be asked to leave, and be trespassed if they don't. I haven't heard of them being sued, so what's the difference?

Prohibitions against (and trespassing for) firearms are different from "we reserve the right to refuse service to anyone".

 

[chipbennett]

If you're referring to the people who complained about the "Jesus Saves" shirt, then you're right!

 

[chipbennett]

I prefer that all available funding dry up. But if you stick you hand out to get money taken from my pocket I have no problem injecting my take on life into your business. If that bothers you, don’t hold your hand out.

How does an entity getting a tax break (i.e. sending less of their own money to the government) constitute taking money out of your pocket? Please show your work.

 

[schmart]

Did you read it at a different source? Just curious, I read the article in the OP but through the lens of the media generally tries to rile us up with the most slanted and designed to cause offense/emotional reaction possible hence my reference to not judging because who knows what happens before the cameras came on.

Likely. I haven't clicked the link provided by the OP, but rather read about it on one of the national news feeds I review in the AM.
My brother has been in TV news industry for decades, and even he agrees with your view about media.

 

[JettaKnight]

Report from a local TV station:
https://www.kare11.com/article/news...d-out/89-be3f1eea-af7b-4a7b-8c5b-b46e1308786b

 

[Ziggidy]

Report from a local TV station:
https://www.kare11.com/article/news...d-out/89-be3f1eea-af7b-4a7b-8c5b-b46e1308786b

If true, I am glad; however, this never should have been an issue to begin with. Definite case of persecution.

 

[JettaKnight]

If true, I am glad; however, this never should have been an issue to begin with. Definite case of persecution.

So I just read a story that Islamist killed 14 people in a church in Congo.


I'm guessing that persecution is relative to your situation.

"My whole family was killed in an explosion at church!"
"I hear you sister, I got kicked out a shopping mall."

 

[Expat]

I wouldn’t have paired soliciting with Jesus Saves. By that logic, every shirt that showed some product or brand name would violate their no soliciting policy.

 

[Ziggidy]

So I just read a story that Islamist killed 14 people in a church in Congo.


I'm guessing that persecution is relative to your situation.

"My whole family was killed in an explosion at church!"
"I hear you sister, I got kicked out a shopping mall."

Foolish reply......

 

[bgcatty]

$cr$w the wokes and libtards seeking to destroy our country. Too bad their butts hurt!

 

[ancjr]

Pretty much sums it up

 

[DadSmith]

So I just read a story that Islamist killed 14 people in a church in Congo.


I'm guessing that persecution is relative to your situation.

"My whole family was killed in an explosion at church!"
"I hear you sister, I got kicked out a shopping mall."

Definition of PERSECUTE

to harass or punish in a manner designed to injure, grieve, or afflict; specifically : to cause to suffer because of belief; to annoy with persistent or urgent approaches (such as attacks, pleas, or importunities) : pester… See the full definition

www.merriam-webster.com

to harass or punish in a manner designed to injure, grieve, or afflict

to annoy with persistent or urgent approaches (such as attacks, pleas, or importunities) : PESTER