Will Memphis Burn? Man Allegedly Beat to Death, Five Memphis PD Officers Fired

[bobzilla]

What is going on here lol?

ACAB’s are coming out of the woodworks with their typical vitriol and bs. Same as always.

 

[manifest destiny]

IMPD has it's faults, but post-Bisard they took some valuable lessons and applied them. IMO, officers exposed to trauma are treated better, generally, today than they were at the beginning of my career. Not always, but they try.

I don't want to misunderstand you. As I read the above, I took it to mean Bisard was exposed to on-the-job trauma, thus his actions and behavior resulted from that trauma. Since then, IMPD has made it easier for officers to not follow the path Bisard traveled by offering additional resources to affected officers. Did I misunderstand?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

As far as I know, there is no space limit here. Hell, PM me, I'll give you my email address, write me a letter ( I'll send you a self addressed, stamped envelope).

I simply don't care enough to engage in the topic in a short form written format. If you want to learn, start here: then branch out from there on topics and subtopics that interest you. If you want to argue, I'm not your guy.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I don't want to misunderstand you. As I read the above, I took it to mean Bisard was exposed to on-the-job trauma, thus his actions and behavior resulted from that trauma. Since then, IMPD has made it easier for officers to not follow the path Bisard traveled by offering additional resources to affected officers. Did I misunderstand?

In broad strokes, yes. I can't completely say Bisard's actions were due to trauma on the job but he was certainly exposed to it and many felt it was a contributor. We were not friends off duty, but I worked adjacent to him and knew him on the job. I was completely shocked by his DUIs, it just didn't click with the officer I had known a few years before (I transferred districts before his on duty crash with the motorcyclists)

 

[XMil]

I simply don't care enough to engage in the topic in a short form written format. If you want to learn, start here: then branch out from there on topics and subtopics that interest you. If you want to argue, I'm not your guy.

Fair enough, I respect that. I'm not looking to argue but this forum seems to have degenerated pretty badly so I can see why you are afraid.

All I really have to say is that people don't hate people that protect them and to pretend like there is no problem with policing in America is willful blindness.

 

[jamil]

this forum seems to have degenerated pretty badly so I can see why you are afraid.

Into what?

 

[KLB]

Fair enough, I respect that. I'm not looking to argue but this forum seems to have degenerated pretty badly so I can see why you are afraid.

All I really have to say is that people don't hate people that protect them and to pretend like there is no problem with policing in America is willful blindness.

You don't think there can be issues with policing AND the police protect the citizens of their jurisdictions?

That sounds like more bigotry to me. Bigotry against police is just as bad as any other.

 

[Creedmoor]

It's retention. IMPD is having a real problem keeping officers with less than 10 years on. Neighboring departments with a fraction of the run load and few "dangerous" residents are now paying what IMPD pay. PLUS new vehicles and other equipment. So once this contract expires, the CIty will have to agree to a SIGNIFICANT bump in pay across the board just to retain officers, maybe attract new ones. The department is nearing a staffing crisis with no relief is sight.

I really don't care that these other jobs pay less. No one is rushing to the line to get hired as a police officer. Once there were thousands of applicants for a 70 person recruit class but now that is down to about 200. You do that math. I'm not seeing tradesmen or engineers leaving their "low paying" jobs to work for us.

I get it, only so many citys can afford to pay that, we cant come close to that in Alexandria. What we have seen here are new officers starting around 36,000 and they have been promised a new takehome Tahoe.
I brought up at a town meeting to mabe have our HS have trade classes and rehab or build small say 1,000 sf homes and give new officers a huge discount on rent for a period of time.
We also have a huge turnover with trained officers heading to the bigger paying citys.
Its a problem in many places that dont have the tax revenue to support big wages.

 

[KG1]

Wonder if that’s the cop who deployed the taser and told the other cop he hopes they kick his (Nichols) ass when they catch him. Or something to that effect.

Pretty sure it is. I saw the story somewhere else. I believe he was in on the initial scene when they first pulled him over and he deployed the taser and was the one seen pouring water in the other black cop's eyes in one of the bodycam clips who presumably must've gotten in the way of a pepper spray attempt. I read he wasn't at the second scene where the gang murder took place though.

 

[KG1]

Into what?

Discussions about pineapple on pizza.

 

[jbombelli]

The first rule of finding yourself in a bad situation is this: Don't make things worse for yourself. You will never win the fight at the side of the road; that's what lawyers are for.

Comply or die? More like comply or be forced to comply, and sometimes **** happens when the cops have to use force because you're an idiot.

Don't make things worse for yourself.

That said, sometimes cops too far, and in this instance that certainly seems to be the case.

 

[manifest destiny]

First, I just want to once again point out that the system is working. These officers were fired- quickly. They were charged- quickly. The charges are significant. The system worked here, at least on the back end, post crime. The front end could probably use some improvement with regard to better recruiting and better training. But violent riots shouldn't occur when the system is working.

Comply or die? More like comply or be forced to comply, and sometimes **** happens when the cops have to use force because you're an idiot.

I cannot agree with comply or die. This isn't a case of wrestling between a LEO and a perp trying to gain control of the LEO's gun. We rarely put to death convicted murderers. Resisting in Indiana is a misdemeanor unless it becomes life and death (use of cars, deadly weapons, etc). Are we to execute misdemeanors with the punishment of death? Right there on the side of road? Should a patrolman be tasked with judge/jury/executioner decisions because a person runs on foot away from a traffic stop and when caught fights, squirms attempting to avoid being handcuffed? Heck, you and I can use deadly force when someone is attempting to run us over with a car, or beating us while attempting to gain control of our EDC. But if I inspect a bump in the night and find two jerks running away from my house with my pot-o-gold, guess what I can't do? Street cops have it tough so they should be given a long leash with regard to decision making. But with all the extraordinary authority availed to sworn officers there should be extremely high expectations their discretion is used responsibly. This isn't a cop-bashing post. The LEO's on here will likely say, "you're not a cop, you don't understand." Those that back the blue unconditionally and without reserve will likely say, "just do what the cop says. It's that simple." The acab types probably won't say anything at all. So where do citizens like myself, who simply want a balance between authority and application of authority, fit in?

 

[Creedmoor]

I don't see a lot of 21 year old kids with a high school diploma making it, and never have. Typically you need military, college, or some significant life experience. But as hiring standards lower, maybe you'll see more of them. And everyone knows how great at problem solving in complex situations under severe stress 21 year old high school grads are as a group. Nothing to go wrong there.

Policing is not like the military where you can take a bunch of dumbasses, stick them with an NCO, and let the NCO de-dumbass them over time before their general dumbassery causes significant issue. Policing requires a lot more decision making independently and with more complex parameters than most enlisted meatheads are doing. Says a former enlisted meathead dumbass and security contractor.

That said, while pay is part of it there's also the social contract. Like the military, you can throw money at people to an extent, but if they don't think they'll live to spend it, are afraid they'll be imprisoned or abandoned for it, or will be **** on by society at large for it, money becomes a very secondary concern. Police used to not have to compete on pay because prestige and social standing compensated for some of it, much like soldiers. No longer on either front. Now there's $50k signing bonuses for soldiers and they are still way off goals. Police are the same. Our political structure and media has undermined our institutions to the point that qualified candidates are repelled.

Maybe a 50g bonus over 4 years if your mos is in need and to recruits that have the scores to fill that empty mos.
Both of mine earned good enlistment and one reenlistment bonuses. They both were Grunts like dad and worked to become NCO's.

Still a starting gig at 50+ thousand is a damn good gig in Indiana.

 

[Creedmoor]

Discussions about pineapple on pizza.

The discussion shouldn't be about pineapple on pizza, it should be what other toppings are on the pineapple pizza. Mine needs nothing more than ham and bell peppers amongst the chunks of fresh pineapple.

 

[BankShot]

The discussion shouldn't be about pineapple on pizza, it should be what other toppings are on the pineapple pizza. Mine needs nothing more than ham and bell peppers amongst the chunks of fresh pineapple.

Somebody needs to stop you. You're pushing this stuff on two different threads at the same time now.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Still a starting gig at 50+ thousand is a damn good gig in Indiana.

Depends on where in Indiana. Henryville, yeah. Carmel, not so much. However the results are pretty easy to see. The job is such a good gig the applicant pool is about 2" deep and dropping. So good IMPD has nearly 300 empty authorized slots due to lack of qualified candidates to fill them and people are exiting the field faster than people are entering it. Throwing money at it will help some, but it's not the root issue. There were thousands of applicants when vs the hundreds now when pay was much lower, comparatively. Being a 1st responder, police/fire/ems, was never just about the money for anyone worth a damn at it. EMTs especially, tough to make a living at that if you're not also a firefighter. EMS was my introduction into the 1st responder world, I stumbled ass backwards into police work years later.

 

[Leadeye]

Much like the armed forces of the 70s society has made law enforcement an unattractive profession. Maybe that will change down the road.

 

[freekforge]

Depends on where in Indiana. Henryville, yeah. Carmel, not so much. However the results are pretty easy to see. The job is such a good gig the applicant pool is about 2" deep and dropping. So good IMPD has nearly 300 empty authorized slots due to lack of qualified candidates to fill them and people are exiting the field faster than people are entering it. Throwing money at it will help some, but it's not the root issue. There were thousands of applicants when vs the hundreds now when pay was much lower, comparatively. Being a 1st responder, police/fire/ems, was never just about the money for anyone worth a damn at it. EMTs especially, tough to make a living at that if you're not also a firefighter. EMS was my introduction into the 1st responder world, I stumbled ass backwards into police work years later.

When I came onto my department we had 11 slots open and they only had like 15 applicants and a couple were dropped for their background checks. Only 3 of us showed up for testing. One guy failed every portion of the Ilea exit standards (entrance standards too for that matter). So only two of us were picked. When sketchy stuff happened and I left the guy that they hired to replace me was fired within a month for using a racial slur. Within a year all but two officers I worked with had quit. They got the number back up to 9 officers total but they lost a bunch again and are down to 1 paid guy and 1 reserve. Nobody wants the job anymore it seems.

 

[bobzilla]

When I came onto my department we had 11 slots open and they only had like 15 applicants and a couple were dropped for their background checks. Only 3 of us showed up for testing. One guy failed every portion of the Ilea exit standards (entrance standards too for that matter). So only two of us were picked. When sketchy stuff happened and I left the guy that they hired to replace me was fired within a month for using a racial slur. Within a year all but two officers I worked with had quit. They got the number back up to 9 officers total but they lost a bunch again and are down to 1 paid guy and 1 reserve. Nobody wants the job anymore it seems.

I can’t blame them. We see it here the way they’re treated. If, we as fellow gun owners can’t even treat police with sone dignity and modicum of respect how can you expect the msm brainwashed masses to?

 

[PRasko]

Man I wish I would have taken bets.

Told ya they'd blame it on whitey...