What is your ideal political structure?

[jamil]

I don't understand your question in regards to individual taxes. Under a flat tax, everything is based on purchases. You pay tax on what your buy, instead of being taxed on income, property, etc. No need for deductions under such a scenario. Also gets rid of loopholes and things like that. Everyone pays when they buy stuff, even drug dealers, pimps and people who get their incomes under the table. At least this is the flat tax I've heard of and agree with, not certain if that's what jamil was referring to.

No, when I say flat tax I mean the tax rate on income/profit is a flat percentage, not graduated. So no tax brackets. Everyone pays the same low percentage regardless of taxable income. But, the sales tax I think is a better way to fund basic government. And then every government expense above basic government must be funded by the choice of the taxpayer. If you want to redistribute your money, then you get your form, check your boxes, write in your amounts and send your check. Or maybe you go online and make your selections and pay there.

 

[jamil]

Is a business not taxed?

I addressed this but just superficially. Businesses consume government too. So yeah, they should participate in funding basic government. I'm kinda on the fence on allowing businesses to be part of voluntary funding though. I mean, government has programs for businesses and those should definitely be voluntarily funded. But I mean at that point you have what is essentially an association that doesn't need and should not have the power of the state.

 

[wtburnette]

I prefer it as a tax on sales, but anything that improves over what we have is okay with me.

 

[jamil]

It just seems to me that because I’m spending 2.94 million on fertilizer, seed, and drain tile, my tax bill would go way up. I’m obviously not making lawyer money here, and I feel my tax should be based on my personal income; if a flat tax scenario the 60k I’m living on to buy groceries and guns gets taxed. (if I had as many boats as Houghmade and Kirk then my taxes would be higher)
If I and every other business are paying the same rate on inputs to make a widget as the consumer is to buy toilet paper, I’m not very motivated.
What am I missing?

You were missing the details that I didn't mention in the general explanation. You'd be taxed on income - expenses.

 

[jamil]

TBH I have no idea how the business side of it works. I'm assuming you're talking about spending that money as a business, or farmer, or something along those lines. I don't know how that would be done.

The problem I have with income tax is that it's tied to things like tax code and bureaucracy like the IRS, neither of which is needed. We should be able to simplify things to where we not only have taxes coming out of our paychecks, but we can better control our portion of taxes. Flat tax on the individual does that as any discretionary spending controls your contribution to taxes. The essentials you need to pay for, but anything over that you have more control over. Plus it provides a more level playing field. You don't get people with huge incomes paying attorneys and tax consultants to find loopholes to avoid paying taxes. You pay when you buy stuff, ensuring everyone is paying their "fair share". Like I said, even the pimps, drug dealers and illegal aliens would then be paying into the system their taking advantage of.

If we were flat-taxed on income/profit, at least the payroll income would be simple enough. One way it could work, and this is just the most simple scenario. For employees on a payroll, the government sends you a monthly bill based on your payroll earnings for the previous month. Of course, if you earned money from other sources, like self employment, you'd have to figure that out yourself and pay your bill.

I think regardless there has to be an IRS-like department to handle government revenue intake, even if the only federal tax structure was VAT. I would not give the IRS or any such government agency police powers. The only police powers the federal government would have would be within the justice department.

Anyway, the idea is that you pay the tax bill instead of your employer deducting it from your paycheck. And there's no settling up with the government once a year. You just pay as you earn payroll income or profit. For large businesses, it could be anualized. Smaller businesses, quarterly. But individuals you would pay monthly. And if we took all the bloat from government I think maybe 5-7% would be the flat rate.

Like I said though, I do like the VAT or sales tax better. Because then when you right your check to fund a study on the impact of cow farts on climate change, it's not as easy as checking a box while filling out your tax form for the month. You'll have to decide to do that.

 

[Creedmoor]

Not quite everything.

Apple Pie. I rest my case.

What kind of apples?

 

[jamil]

What kind of apples?

I don't really like a very tart apple pie. I like my apple pie to have just a hint of tartness. Most recipes call for granny smith apples, which are usually more tart than I like.

I prefer something like jonagold when you can find them, because they're crisp and naturally sweet, but not too tart.

I mean, I've had an apple pie made with gala apples, which are, IMHO the best apples just to eat. Not necessarily the best for pie. Don't get me wrong, that was a fine pie. Great flavor, not real tart. But it was a bit too mushy. The apples didn't stay firm.

 

[Creedmoor]

I don't really like a very tart apple pie. I like my apple pie to have just a hint of tartness. Most recipes call for granny smith apples, which are usually more tart than I like.

I prefer something like jonagold when you can find them, because they're crisp and naturally sweet, but not too tart.

I mean, I've had an apple pie made with gala apples, which are, IMHO the best apples just to eat. Not necessarily the best for pie. Don't get me wrong, that was a fine pie. Great flavor, not real tart. But it was a bit too mushy. The apples didn't stay firm.

We tend to use Galas or Honey Crisp.
Extra Cinnamon.

 

[jamil]

We tend to use Galas or Honey Crisp.
Extra Cinnamon.

Oh yeah. Honey Crisp are good ones too. But don’t you find the gala ones a bit too mushy?

We gathered a bunch of Golden Delicious apples one year and made apple sauce and pie. The applesauce was simply amazingly good. The pie was good. Not the best. Probably more cinnamon would have made it better.

 

[Creedmoor]

Oh yeah. Honey Crisp are good ones too. But don’t you find the gala ones a bit too mushy?

We gathered a bunch of Golden Delicious apples one year and made apple sauce and pie. The applesauce was simply amazingly good. The pie was good. Not the best. Probably more cinnamon would have made it better.

No we dont, as a kid we made gallons if apple cider and apple sauce each year. My great aunts canned for weeks late summer and fall.

 

[wtburnette]

I've always heard a mix of apple types makes for the best apple pie. I don't worry about specifics, I just enjoy being a consumer...

 

[jamil]

No we dont, as a kid we made gallons if apple cider and apple sauce each year. My great aunts canned for weeks late summer and fall.

Never been a big fan of apple cider. But I could see where gala apples would make a good sauce. And like I said, I think gala’s are probably the best apple just for eating. Reasonably crisp, sweet, and not too tart.

 

[wtburnette]

Never been a big fan of apple cider. But I could see where gala apples would make a good sauce. And like I said, I think gala’s are probably the best apple just for eating. Reasonably crisp, sweet, and not too tart.

I actually like a softer apple. Kroger had a variety a couple years ago that was wonderful, but I forgot to make note of it and now have no idea what it was. It was Very sweet, juicy and delicious. The texture was softer, almost like a ripe pear. Whatever it was it was the best apple I've ever eaten and I wish I remembered the name so I could find them elsewhere. Freaking Kroger, always getting rid of what I enjoy

 

[Ingomike]

I've always heard a mix of apple types makes for the best apple pie. I don't worry about specifics, I just enjoy being a consumer...

This is true. Proper amounts of sugar and salt are crucial also…

 

[Ingomike]

Never been a big fan of apple cider. But I could see where gala apples would make a good sauce. And like I said, I think gala’s are probably the best apple just for eating. Reasonably crisp, sweet, and not too tart.

I love me some unpasteurized fresh cider, not that crap sold in big box stores. Have you had that?

 

[wtburnette]

I like hard cider, does that count?

 

[Blazer90]

We need a parliamentary system. More parties to choose from and spread the power structure of peoples representatives. The ability to hold a “no confidence vote” would be a very powerful tool in upsetting a situation like we face now.

 

[jamil]

I love me some unpasteurized fresh cider, not that crap sold in big box stores. Have you had that?

Yeah. We made cider when I was a kid. Just never cared for it.

 

[Cozy439]

I like hard cider, does that count?

Anyone in NE Ind have a cider press? Depending on how this season goes...May have some extra and this would be my choice use for it.

 

[BigRed]

Anarcho capitalism is impossible. It is incompatible with human nature. Don’t get me wrong. I wish it could work as well as the deluded inventors of it dream it would. That would be swell.

Whom are these angels that should rule us?