Un-chambered and OC reasoning

[dclaarjr]

Here's my

The FBI crime statistics show that the average encounter between a CHL holder and an assailant lasts an average of 2.5 seconds. I truly believe that not having a round in the chamber puts you at a serious disadvantage, especially if you normally have children with you.

The BG's are not going to wait for you to rack the slide to chamber a round. IMHO by the time you get a round chambered, you or a loved one will be wounded or killed. As a person committed to defending yourself and your family, I believe you owe it to yourself to give you every advantage possible to survive.

 

[ryanmercer]

Well now, wouldn't this be a difficult thread to follow if Mr.Hoppes hadn't been quoted a few times?

Tell me about it... I open it to try to read it... and can't make much sense out of it since he re-did all his posts

 

[GetA2J]

mr hoppes, please don't confuse passion for abuse. some of these comments can be a bit misconstrued, or not i suppose, but i think that the majority here want to share discussion with you. iif you are solid in you belief then leave the posts, just don't rise to the bait. i didn't get a chance to view your posts prior to your deleting them. if they were provocative, then consider rephrasing rather than deleting. most of the discussions on this board have at least a glimmer of important data in them.

to those taking an agressive stance in reply to mr hoppes, please rephrase or refrain.

i personally don't agree with all you've written, as i replied earlier, but i'm with coach in supporting your decisions. we look forward to working with you and discussing just these sorts of issues with you.

 

[cosermann]

What the?

 

[Rookie]

Situations of high risk...

My dad is a pastor in Columbus, Ohio. A few years ago, he was driving to the church. He pulled into the church which has a long driveway to the parking lot. As he was driving, a man jumped out in front of him causing him to stop quickly. The man ran around to the driver's side, opened the door, and attempted to pull him out of the car. My dad had his seat belt on which made it impossible for the man to get him out, so he jumped in over my dad to undo the seatbelt. Dad immediately drove to the church where he could get some help. The man saw a screwdriver in the floorboard of the passenger seat and decided that he would get it as a weapon. My dad pulled up to the church, saw what the man's intentions were and jumped on top of him. As they were struggling, my dad managed to lay on the horn with his feet which alerted a guy in the church. He saw what was going on, yelled for help, and went out with about three others to assist my dad. A lady that was in the church, called her husband who is a Columbus police officer and told him what was going on. He basically called officer needs assistance and raced to the church (with half the department on his heels). The man was quickly arrested and carted off to jail. I asked my dad why in the world did he not let the man have the car and his response was that there was a ladies' get together and he was concerned for their safety.

This happened at a church, in broad daylight. High risk situations cannot always be avoided...

 

[melensdad]

The ONLY time I can see carrying empty chamber while OC is if I attend an INGO OC event and we decide to inspect each others weapons.

Any other time simply makes no sense to me.

If there is a situation where there is a high risk of having the gun snatched, such as in a heavy crowd, then the person doing the OC should either NOT carry openly or should carry in a retention holster that prevents a gun grab.

 

[Bigum1969]

Situations of high risk...

My dad is a pastor in Columbus, Ohio. A few years ago, he was driving to the church. He pulled into the church which has a long driveway to the parking lot. As he was driving, a man jumped out in front of him causing him to stop quickly. The man ran around to the driver's side, opened the door, and attempted to pull him out of the car. My dad had his seat belt on which made it impossible for the man to get him out, so he jumped in over my dad to undo the seatbelt. Dad immediately drove to the church where he could get some help. The man saw a screwdriver in the floorboard of the passenger seat and decided that he would get it as a weapon. My dad pulled up to the church, saw what the man's intentions were and jumped on top of him. As they were struggling, my dad managed to lay on the horn with his feet which alerted a guy in the church. He saw what was going on, yelled for help, and went out with about three others to assist my dad. A lady that was in the church, called her husband who is a Columbus police officer and told him what was going on. He basically called officer needs assistance and raced to the church (with half the department on his heels). The man was quickly arrested and carted off to jail. I asked my dad why in the world did he not let the man have the car and his response was that there was a ladies' get together and he was concerned for their safety.

This happened at a church, in broad daylight. High risk situations cannot always be avoided...

Great example. Danger can lurk anywhere.

 

[Integraholic]

That's why when I have my license, I carry in church. If you want to shoot a deer, go to where the deer are. If you want to shoot some kids, go to a school. If you want to shoot some christians, go to a church.

 

[KevinH]

I have had debates about carrying with a loaded chamber in a GLOCK with no safeties or anything! How dangerous! I do keep my shotgun loaded but none in the chamer. I'd rather pump one in hoping the inturder hears it an leaves rather than see what made the noise. The best outcome is for the threat to leave. But I keep the Glock loaded and ready for a threat. I have found that consistant practice with my presentation has given me the confidence that I will have my finger on the index point and not on the trigger until I am ready to shoot when the gun is unholstered. My dad taught me at an early age (6 or 7 when flint locks were just coming out) about fire arms. I've had them around all of my life, fortunately. My wife shoots and has taken classes with me as well. I carry at home. I carry TO work and back. I rarely don't carry. I carried at a wedding in South Dakota this summer. OK, it was a Walther PPK in an ankle holster, but I carried. My brother-in-law half joking asked if he needed to frisk me. I said no, cause I didn't need to be frisked. It wasn't a shotgun wedding anyway. When it gets down to it, like they said before, you won't have much time to make a decsion when the bad guy or guys come calling. Take a defensive pistol course that incorporates a live-fire house and see how much time you have to decide to shoot or not to shoot. It's not being paranoid, just ready.

 

[Coach]

Situations of high risk...

My dad is a pastor in Columbus, Ohio. A few years ago, he was driving to the church. He pulled into the church which has a long driveway to the parking lot. As he was driving, a man jumped out in front of him causing him to stop quickly. The man ran around to the driver's side, opened the door, and attempted to pull him out of the car. My dad had his seat belt on which made it impossible for the man to get him out, so he jumped in over my dad to undo the seatbelt. Dad immediately drove to the church where he could get some help. The man saw a screwdriver in the floorboard of the passenger seat and decided that he would get it as a weapon. My dad pulled up to the church, saw what the man's intentions were and jumped on top of him. As they were struggling, my dad managed to lay on the horn with his feet which alerted a guy in the church. He saw what was going on, yelled for help, and went out with about three others to assist my dad. A lady that was in the church, called her husband who is a Columbus police officer and told him what was going on. He basically called officer needs assistance and raced to the church (with half the department on his heels). The man was quickly arrested and carted off to jail. I asked my dad why in the world did he not let the man have the car and his response was that there was a ladies' get together and he was concerned for their safety.

This happened at a church, in broad daylight. High risk situations cannot always be avoided...

A great point.

 

[rhino]

The FBI crime statistics show that the average encounter between a CHL holder and an assailant lasts an average of 2.5 seconds.

Do you happen to have a source you can reference for that? I was unaware that the FBI had stats on private citizen encounters like that, and I'd really like to read through it. The only things I've seen from them and other fed agencies are stats on incidents involving police officers and fed agents.

 

[dclaarjr]

IIRC it is included in this report.

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/pdf/cvus06.pdf

This thing is huge and I do not have time to find it. The statistics I quoted are also included in some of my training materials, but they can't be accessed on line.

 

[cosermann]

This thread reminds me of one of Jon Farnam's quips from last year:
John Farnam's Quips - 19Sept07.html - Fantasyland!