School Bullying laws are sweeping the nation

[POC]

I *was* the picked on kid. The Nerd. Geek. (And now I'm a nurse...gee...you'd think I'd learn....) Whatever they were in your neck of the woods. I was a tall skinny kid about #140 in high school. I was teased, taunted, kicked, hit, spit on, given "wedgies", you name it. I told the teachers and I knew most of them outside of school. My class only had 49 kids in it when I graduated. If someone actually saw someone doing something, they'd say something. But between classes in the hallways, in gym class, practices after school, it was awful.
I had a miserable school time. The bus was just as bad.
Up until my Junior and Senior year I was still being picked on. By then I had risen somewhat. I was more popular, had a decent car, was good in track and band.
I never fought back because that was the way I was raised.
"If someone strikes you on the cheek, turn the other to him also. If someone takes your coat, give him also your cloak."
I know that God was watching out of me, and for some reason that I don't understand, I had to endure those times in school. I endure the problems, trials and tribulations of everyday life. I have a long fuse. So long, I don't remember when it has actually gone off.
Why did I write this? I've forgotten now....
More rules are not the answer, rules were in place then, they are still in place now. If those in charge at school won't enforce them, it does no good. If parents won't MAKE their kids mind at home, it is never gonna get any better.

I see this all the time at work, parents telling their kids, "don't touch that."
"Don't touch that."
"Don't touch that."
But never any punishment. If you tell a kid not to cross a line, and then they do, you have to "smack" them. (However you see fit, corporal punishment, time-outs, take away TV, whatever.)
It is ridiculous.

 

[Boilers]

Anyone else noticing this? I've seen stories on bullies on several different news stations in the last week, and I typically do not watch TV at all.

Doing a little research, I noticed that this year has been a big year to push brand new laws to criminalize teasing.

How do you feel about this movement?

Yes. Bullying is one of the current 'memes'. Get ahead of the curve and let Adam and John hook you into the next memes that are up and coming ... "No Agenda" links below.

One of their bullying meme shows. And they mention the "Salt meme" on there, too.

They are live/on today! iPhone App will signal you when they are/begin streaming a new show; twice weekly. Actually, on the way back from Knob Creek Machine Gun Shoot yesterday, it also signaled of Adam's Daily Source Code which is neither daily nor any sort of source code; but him just spinning (DJ'ing) the hits.

Look at first video on this site, John's site: hilarious today Dvorak Uncensored: General interest observations and true web-log.

Also, ALL their own content can be posted here since they let anyone and EVERYONE use what they create for free, and they are advertiser free.

Again, bullying meme has been mentioned quite a bit by them.

 

[Blackhawk2001]

The ones that get punished are the ones that don't take any crap and won't put up with smart mouth chumps. Your supposed to be the whippin post and like it. Any kind of defense is a no no.

The "zero-tolerance" approach advocated by lawyers and school administrators has taken all the common sense out of school discipline. The kid who forcefully resists the bully gets the same punishment. Who do you suppose the zero-tolerance policy deters, the bully or the bullied?

Does anyone see the parallels between zero-tolerance rules and our current raft of gun control laws? Seems to me they both only restrict the ones who play by the rules without noticeably slowing down the ones who don't.

 

[360]

I think you guys are all missing the boat here.

Bullying has taken on a new meaning.

It's more along the lines of slander, libel, and defamation nowadays with the internet.

Without making 101 examples, kids are doing things today that we didn't do (or have the means to do) when we were younger. Digital "everything" has created a whole new wave of trouble for today's kids. They do dumb stuff, it's caught on camera, and it's posted on YouTube. Next thing you know, the kid is hanging him/herself because of it.

This is what has to stop. It has nothing to do with beating another child, or calling another child names, or the simple playground bullying we were all subjected to at some point.

Laws are already in place for this crap. They just need to be enforced, and the people involved need to be the ones who pay the price. Hold the adults responsible? Maybe. After all, they could possibly be the enablers by allowing the kids to have the means to post all of this crap on the internet.

I don't like to see anyone take their own life. No matter the circumstances.

 

[Blackhawk2001]

Up until I was about 13, I refused to fight. Got beat up alot. Most memorable was when the shortest kid in the neighborhood decided to beat me up after we got off the school bus. Long story short: I threw my lunchbox at him and cut open his ear; the rest of the kids piled on me, and I was "saved" by my grandmother chasing them off with a broom.

By the time I was 13 I'd had enough. Got into 3 fights with my "favorite" bullies in 4 hours one day. Never was bothered by them again. My last fight was in high school. A guy picked a fight w/me off the school grounds. Since I'd been wrestling for 6 years by that point, I took him down and controlled him until my wrestling coach happened by and broke it up. I got a 3-day suspension.

In his senior year in high school, my son got suspended for 3-days for verbally intervening when a girl was being harassed by three guys. I went to the School Board over the suspension, but they made it stick, despite the complaints of the girl's father.

I've had no use for the public school system for a long time...

 

[SavageEagle]

I think you guys are all missing the boat here.

Bullying has taken on a new meaning.

It's more along the lines of slander, libel, and defamation nowadays with the internet.

Without making 101 examples, kids are doing things today that we didn't do (or have the means to do) when we were younger. Digital "everything" has created a whole new wave of trouble for today's kids. They do dumb stuff, it's caught on camera, and it's posted on YouTube. Next thing you know, the kid is hanging him/herself because of it.

This is what has to stop. It has nothing to do with beating another child, or calling another child names, or the simple playground bullying we were all subjected to at some point.

Laws are already in place for this crap. They just need to be enforced, and the people involved need to be the ones who pay the price. Hold the adults responsible? Maybe. After all, they could possibly be the enablers by allowing the kids to have the means to post all of this crap on the internet.

I don't like to see anyone take their own life. No matter the circumstances.

Very true. But we should most CERTAINLY hold parents accountable for their kids bullying. However, if kids are hanging themselves over something stupid they did that got caught on camera and aired to the world, . How would these kids react as an adult to a situation like that? Shoot themselves? The person that did it? The parents have a responsibility to know what's going on with their kids and act accordingly.

Yes, laws need to be enforced. But what law is broken by airing someone's stupidity over the internet? None that I can think of. So what do we do? Create MORE laws? I hope not. There's only one thing you can do. Bring back The Family. Educate. Be a friend. Teach your kids to be a friend.

I too don't like to see someone take their own life and I'm sorry if what I say seems harsh. However, it is reality. It is fact. How else are you going to solve this problem? Creating more laws is NOT the answer and enforcing existing law is still useless.

 

[360]

Very true. But we should most CERTAINLY hold parents accountable for their kids bullying. However, if kids are hanging themselves over something stupid they did that got caught on camera and aired to the world, . How would these kids react as an adult to a situation like that? Shoot themselves? The person that did it? The parents have a responsibility to know what's going on with their kids and act accordingly.

You have to keep in mind that in most cases, your dealing with a different level of maturity between adult decision making and that of a child. It's not necessarily the same for a reasonable adult who has "been there, done that" to act out this way. On the flip side, you will see children who have lived a life of hell, who are hardened by these instances, and merely turn a blind eye at it.

Yes, laws need to be enforced. But what law is broken by airing someone's stupidity over the internet? None that I can think of. So what do we do? Create MORE laws? I hope not. There's only one thing you can do. Bring back The Family. Educate. Be a friend. Teach your kids to be a friend.

Again, see libel, slander, defamation.

Let's make an example of a 16 years old. Somehow (doesn't matter how, really) a video is made of them experimenting with sex, with a person of the same sex. This video is posted on the internet for all the world to see without their permission. You tell me why that should be legal, just because a camera "caught" it. Whatever happened to behind closed doors? Now, you might argue they should not have been doing it in the first place, but that is beside the point. The fact is, a recording was made of it, without permission, with no intent other than posting in for the world to see. The whole situation changes if they willingly recorded themselves, and it "leaked" out to the web.

I too don't like to see someone take their own life and I'm sorry if what I say seems harsh. However, it is reality. It is fact. How else are you going to solve this problem? Creating more laws is NOT the answer and enforcing existing law is still useless.

I never said anything of creating more laws. I stated that the ones we have should be enforced.

Laws Right here in Indiana:

Indianapolis - One may only throw a stone at a bird in self-defense.

Evansville - While driving on Main Street you may not have your lights on.

Beech Grove - It is forbidden to eat watermelon in the park.

South Bend - It is illegal to make a monkey smoke a cigarette.

Warsaw - No one may throw an old computer across the street at their neighbor.

At some point in time, there was a reason these laws were passed. But can we ask why, and what were the reasons? And why are they not enforced?

 

[Htrailblazer]

With the internet and cell phones kids cant get away from bullies. This creates a new dynamic that previous generations didn't have to deal with. It has also created a much bigger audience for the bullies to get the attention they are craving. this makes it much more stressful on the kids and they are not prepared for the relentless attack. Parents need to be the ones to teach our kids right and wrong. If a kid is doing wrong in school there is school punishment but what is happening outside of school isn't being punished by the parents. These kids need to be punished somehow. I will teach my son to defend himself with force if necessary and how to deal with what people will say. I was teased in school for being short. I could handle myself so bullies never messed with me more than once physically but that didn't stop them trying to use words. "sticks and stones can break my bones but words will never hurt me."

 

[Bill of Rights]

You have to keep in mind that in most cases, your dealing with a different level of maturity between adult decision making and that of a child. It's not necessarily the same for a reasonable adult who has "been there, done that" to act out this way. On the flip side, you will see children who have lived a life of hell, who are hardened by these instances, and merely turn a blind eye at it.



Again, see libel, slander, defamation.

Let's make an example of a 16 years old. Somehow (doesn't matter how, really) a video is made of them experimenting with sex, with a person of the same sex. This video is posted on the internet for all the world to see without their permission. You tell me why that should be legal, just because a camera "caught" it. Whatever happened to behind closed doors? Now, you might argue they should not have been doing it in the first place, but that is beside the point. The fact is, a recording was made of it, without permission, with no intent other than posting in for the world to see. The whole situation changes if they willingly recorded themselves, and it "leaked" out to the web.



I never said anything of creating more laws. I stated that the ones we have should be enforced.

Laws Right here in Indiana:

Indianapolis - One may only throw a stone at a bird in self-defense.

Evansville - While driving on Main Street you may not have your lights on.

Beech Grove - It is forbidden to eat watermelon in the park.

South Bend - It is illegal to make a monkey smoke a cigarette.

Warsaw - No one may throw an old computer across the street at their neighbor.

At some point in time, there was a reason these laws were passed. But can we ask why, and what were the reasons? And why are they not enforced?

Libel and slander are moot; truth is a defense. If the video is of that person, merely making it public is neither a libel nor a slander.

Defamation, at least in Indiana, seems to be a charge that can be brought against newspaper publishers, news services, and TV and radio broadcasters, but not against another citizen not in those fields.

(Indiana Code TITLE 34, Article 15 Table of Contents)

The advice I got growing up was to never do anything that you wouldn't want to see on the front page of the newspaper. It's still sound advice. As to why it should be legal, I would say it should because we don't need more laws making things illegal. If nothing else, the 16 year old in your example could perhaps seek damages in court as there was a reasonable expectation of privacy and that was invaded, but I don't know that that would be addressed in the IC. At a minimum, the subject of such a video could contact youtube or whoever the host-site is and ask them to remove it. If they refuse, they may be named in the suit as well.

As for the laws you cited, they're prime examples of someone legislatively closing the barn door after the horse is gone. Those laws were clearly written because someone did those things and someone with a little bit of power didn't like it for some reason.

I hasten to mention yet again the standard disclaimers: I am not a lawyer, this post is not legal advice.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[rambone]

Often the bully and the victim both suffer the same punishment. Defend yourself and get suspended also. Imagine how this will play out when Law Enforcement is involved.

 

[SavageEagle]

Let's make an example of a 16 years old. Somehow (doesn't matter how, really) a video is made of them experimenting with sex, with a person of the same sex. This video is posted on the internet for all the world to see without their permission. You tell me why that should be legal, just because a camera "caught" it. Whatever happened to behind closed doors? Now, you might argue they should not have been doing it in the first place, but that is beside the point. The fact is, a recording was made of it, without permission, with no intent other than posting in for the world to see. The whole situation changes if they willingly recorded themselves, and it "leaked" out to the web.

I agree that some current laws should be enforced. Others, not so much. However I think BoR summed it up nicely.

I would like to point out that your example is something punishable by law. It's almost the same as those stupid Carmel kids that got off scot free but are now about to be tried here in Hendricks County. HOWEVER, if you're at school or out in public and are caught doing something or saying something you don't want anyone to see or hear and it gets spread on the net, or you get picked on every day, what laws are broken?

Like Bill said, you shouldn't do anything in public you don't want the world to see. If you do, you run that risk. Sure, kids don't always realize this. It was a good thing they didn't have video camera phones when I was in HS cause I would probably have been on the net too. The problem though, is not the kids. I still maintain that it's the parents.

Remember the case of the girls mom who taunted the other girl and the girl killed herself? Not only was the parent ragging on the girl herself, but she was encouraging her own daughter to do the same. Now here's a part no one talks about. The girl that committed suicide had no online supervision. None. How do we know? The mother and father admitted as much. They had NO CLUE what their daughter was doing or what was going on in her life. Ok, well, they knew she was getting teased, but not to what extent.

It's all about the parents. Not the schools, not the laws, not the teachers, and I'd ALMOST go as far as to say not the kids. However, the kids learn from each other. Those kids that teach other kids learn from their home life.

It all originates in the home. Every single case.

 

[dross]

Putting aside the legal aspect of things for a moment, I hope I can teach my daughter how to deal with bullies. It's such a simple thing, such an easy formula. It's just overcoming your fear that allows you to do it.

If a bully understands that every time he f***s with you, you will inflict as much physical pain upon him as possible, it will stop immediately. This formula works even if the bully is capable of beating you to a pulp. It's fun to push people into lockers, it's no fun to do it when you know you're going to get the edge of a textbook slammed into your nose.

In today's environment, I think I would first go to the school and give them a shot at fixing it.

A friend found out a few years ago that her daughter was involved with a ring of female bullies who were singling out and picking on other girls who didn't wear nice clothes to school. She made her daughter give all her clothes away, then they went and bought all her clothes secondhand, everything old and ill-fitting, and she wore those to school for the rest of the year.

 

[SavageEagle]

In today's environment, I think I would first go to the school and give them a shot at fixing it.

My wife and I do the same. It's not always best to let the school get first dibs if you know you can talk with the parents. If you can talk to the parents, do so first. If it can be stopped at that level first, it's almost always best. No one likes getting a call from the school, THEN dealing with parents second. At least if you give them a heads up, maybe they can stop it and the bully change before it does any harm to either the bullied or the bully. However, if the parents DON'T act, then by all means, go higher.

A friend found out a few years ago that her daughter was involved with a ring of female bullies who were singling out and picking on other girls who didn't wear nice clothes to school. She made her daughter give all her clothes away, then they went and bought all her clothes secondhand, everything old and ill-fitting, and she wore those to school for the rest of the year.

That's AWESOME!

 

[BigMatt]

You can't legislate everyone into getting along. It is part of the process.

(this applies to everything)

 

[whiteglobe]

I think kids just need a little disciplining personally...either by parents or by the school. Although, there are always exceptions and those who overstep.

 

[9lock]

A friend found out a few years ago that her daughter was involved with a ring of female bullies who were singling out and picking on other girls who didn't wear nice clothes to school. She made her daughter give all her clothes away, then they went and bought all her clothes secondhand, everything old and ill-fitting, and she wore those to school for the rest of the year.
__________________

Great story!
They also need to do something about the "Educated Adult" staff doing the same thing to the minors, I had to deal with that in a small xenophobic town west of here.

 

[WillBrayJr]

They ABSOLUTELY need to do something about Bullying. Teasing is one thing but when it goes too far it turns into Bullying. Alot of people rag on me being a 26 year old Virgin and fine I'm fine with that because it's true. When you hit "Below the Belt" with words, it's altogether different. Being Sexually Abused by my 1st Stepfather only to turn around to my peers calling me names like Gay and Fag, THAT'S Bullying.

 

[JetGirl]

The kids who never got picked to play kickball are in charge now. What did you think would happen?

There's a lot of truth in that ^.

 

[WillBrayJr]

Well, let's define safe. Certainly beating kids up should not be tolerated. But words? Jokes? Nicknames?

Yes, even words, jokes, and nicknames. I can care less says something about me as long as it's true. You can only go so far before you cross the line.

 

[WillBrayJr]

Then we need to vote these four-eyed pansies out!!
lol

Ah, Ignorance at it's best.