Random violence stats I've compiled

[dudley0]

My guess is updates will not happen as the OP is in a different policing arena now.

Would be great if he wasn't so lazy and would just do all the work during his down time tho!

 

[Dingleberry]

Something similar from another site

 

[MCgrease08]

Something similar from another site

Excellent article. It reinforces a lot of what I've heard over the years in terms of the types of guns criminals carry. Good to see some solid numbers attached to it, even if it's a small sample size.

 

[KellyinAvon]

Excellent article. It reinforces a lot of what I've heard over the years in terms of the types of guns criminals carry. Good to see some solid numbers attached to it, even if it's a small sample size.

^^This!!^^

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Something similar from another site

Yup, that's good info. If you ever want a laugh, compare it to any number of "studies" done by criminologists. Those eggheads tend to do self-report surveys and then believe the incarcerated individuals are being truthful with them. They'll dutifully report the Glocks and .44 magnums those guys say they were carrying and never actually go the property room to see the broken Raven and .22 Rohm they actually had...

 

[MCgrease08]

It's a sample size of one, but when I finally had one of my stolen handguns (Bersa Thunder UC9) returned from the Marion County property room, the evidence box contained the ammo that was in the gun when it was recovered. If I remember correctly, it was a 11 rounds of mixed head stamp 9mm fmj, and a round of fmj .380 ACP.

It's also worth mentioning that the firing pin was broken, rendering it inoperable when I got it back. The gun was found under an overpass, so I was told it could have likely been tossed out the window of a passing car by someone looking to ditch it. I honestly have no idea if that's what broke the firing pin or if some mope had been carrying it in that condition. Everything worked prior to it being stolen.

 

[cmstuard]

Thanks...just the motivation I needed to keep training.

 

[HoughMade]

I don't know if this is the place for it, but I am curious.

I am aware of 2 situations where people are currently recovering from what is being called a "gun cleaning accident."

My spidey sense tells me that most "gun cleaning accidents" are either a suicide attempt gone wrong, or someone screwing around, more often the former. Is my instinct anywhere near correct?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I don't know if this is the place for it, but I am curious.

I am aware of 2 situations where people are currently recovering from what is being called a "gun cleaning accident."

My spidey sense tells me that most "gun cleaning accidents" are either a suicide attempt gone wrong, or someone screwing around, more often the former. Is my instinct anywhere near correct?

I evaluated both their statement and their injuries when determining if someone was telling the truth when they were shot. The vast majority of people who told me they were cleaning it or clearing it for storage had injuries that were consistent with that. They shot themself in their off hand while it was touching or near the slide, meaning they pulled the trigger while the hand was positioned for racking the slide pretty often. Shooting themselves in the thigh or foot was the next most common. Location of injury, angle of injury, powder burn, etc. would confirm that. None of those would be very "suicide-y" targeting locations.

 

[HoughMade]

I evaluated both their statement and their injuries when determining if someone was telling the truth when they were shot. The vast majority of people who told me they were cleaning it or clearing it for storage had injuries that were consistent with that. They shot themself in their off hand while it was touching or near the slide, meaning they pulled the trigger while the hand was positioned for racking the slide pretty often. Shooting themselves in the thigh or foot was the next most common. Location of injury, angle of injury, powder burn, etc. would confirm that. None of those would be very "suicide-y" targeting locations.

Ah. Thank you. Location, location, location.

The 2 situations I know of currently are head shots. One from under the chin.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Ah. Thank you. Location, location, location.

The 2 situations I know of currently are head shots. One from under the chin.

I would approach those as likely suicide attempts until proven otherwise, were I to be investigating them.

 

[dudley0]

Ah. Thank you. Location, location, location.

The 2 situations I know of currently are head shots. One from under the chin.

Guess I have been cleaning wrong this entire time

 

[Sitcomdad83]

Good stuff! With all the stats and studies out there it's amazing that people go about their lives with their heads in the sand.

 

[wcd]

Yup, that's good info. If you ever want a laugh, compare it to any number of "studies" done by criminologists. Those eggheads tend to do self-report surveys and then believe the incarcerated individuals are being truthful with them. They'll dutifully report the Glocks and .44 magnums those guys say they were carrying and never actually go the property room to see the broken Raven and .22 Rohm they actually had...

And the mismatched ammo…

 

[Dutchisaurus]

These are mostly cases I worked in some capacity (lead or assisting), but do include some from detectives I've asked to notify me of instances of citizens fighting back so that I can get information from Sex Crimes, etc. that I don't work.

19 total cases. I'd hoped for a larger sample, but after I culled domestics and criminal v criminal encounters I had fewer than I thought I would. I've gone through over 300 cases at this point to get these, which is a combination of two factors. Few people are targeted by random crime, and fewer fight back when they are.

Total shots fired:
N/A (weapon used was not a firearm) x5
0 shots x5
1 shot x4
3 shots x3
4 shots x1
11 shots x1


Number of shots to resolution (suspect disabled/began to flee or citizen disabled/disarmed):

0 shots x7
1 shots x6
3 shots x1

Distance at time of resistance
Contact x 7
0-3' x 5
3-7' x 3
7-21' x 3
21' + x1 (bad shoot)

Was speed of the draw a consideration in the outcome:
Yes, from body carry x5
Yes, from off body carry x2
No, had firearm in hand prior to need to engage x3
No, had other weapon in hand (knife, blunt, etc) prior to need to engage x 2
No, draw speed of weapon was not a consideration (disabled prior to beginning draw, bad shoot and suspects already fleeing before 1st shot, etc.) x5
N/A, unarmed resistance x2

Reload:

0 incidents

Additional equipment needed:

0 incidents

Win/loss/tie (tie defined as at least one party on both sides disabled/killed)

W x 13
T x 1
L x 5

Outcomes of win

Suspect fled without sustaining injury x6
Suspect killed x3
Suspect disabled/psychologically stopped due to injury x3
Suspect restrained (not seriously injured) x1


Outcome of tie:

Victim injured during commission of crime/suspect injured during flight

Outcome of loss
Victim failed to deactivate thumb safety, victimized
Victim carrying with empty chamber, killed
Victim killed reaching for weapon
Victim engaged 2 suspects he can see, shot from behind, suspects flee
Victim wrestled suspect, was shot, suspect fled.


Citizen weapon used:
Victim weapon
Handgun-pistol x7
Handgun-revolver x5
Handgun - other x1
Unarmed x2
Golf club x1
shotgun x1
knife x1
taser x1

Suspect weapon
Unarmed x13
handgun x7
unknown weapon x1

Number of victims

1 victim x14
2 victim x3
3 victim x2

Number of suspects

1 suspect x 10
2 suspect x 5
3 suspect x 4

Citizen averages vs single suspect:

0.67 shots

80% won encounter

Citizen averages vs multiple suspects:

0.57 shots
50% won encounter

Citizens with firearms won 64% of the time. However citizens who could employ their firearm (removing those reaching for off body carry, failing to deactivate safeties, etc) won 81% of the time. Other methods of resistance had an 80% success rate. The element of surprise was more important than the specific weapon employed, ie ambushing someone with a golf club and knocking their teeth down the stairs was better than attempting to reach for a handgun while under direct observation of an armed suspect. Citizens using other weapons were more likely to use ambush tactics and were also closer to their opponent.

Due to the small sample size, this should be viewed as preliminary information at best. I will attempt to build on this database and will attempt to update every 20 incidents, (ie next update at 40 incidents)

Is one of these me? I feel I am part of the sample.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Is one of these me? I feel I am part of the sample.

No. My stats were gathered from cases from 2012 to 2018. Note the post you quoted was from 2015.

I was promoted in 2018 and left that unit to return to the street. I was promoted again this year and am back in Invest, but in a different capacity (I don't take cases any longer) and oversee a unit that deals exclusively with targeted crime. Unless I go back to my old unit again, it's unlikely any post-July 2018 cases will ever be included.

 

[dudley0]

No. My stats were gathered from cases from 2012 to 2018. Note the post you quoted was from 2015.

I was promoted in 2018 and left that unit to return to the street. I was promoted again this year and am back in Invest, but in a different capacity (I don't take cases any longer) and oversee a unit that deals exclusively with targeted crime. Unless I go back to my old unit again, it's unlikely any post-July 2018 cases will ever be included.

It is a shame that nobody from your prior unit decided to pick up the torch as it were. Very interesting data and I for one am curious what has changed with the current climate.

Thanks again for dedicating the time you did.

 

[STEEL CORE]

Fantastic article thank you, this is stuff we see but nobody breaks it down the way you have.
Then comes the “everything out the window situation”, I don’t want to be in, but with my luck?!?

 

[Brad69]

BBI,

You ever gonna “teach“ again?

 

[cdhayes2]

7 years later, this is super interesting.