police scanner info

[Destro]

Although it is a fuzzy area I believe apps that can receive streams of police traffic are okay.

It's actually pretty clear that it's prohibited

 

[Joniki]

Careful, carrying a scanner in public that can receive police traffic is illegal in Indiana outside of your property. I believe you could lose your scanner and face a fine or even jail time. .

It is perfectly legal for me to carry my scanner because I am a licensed amateur radio op.

 

[TheSpark]

It's actually pretty clear that it's prohibited

Actually it is not and if it is to be interpreted as being illegal it has a wild twist almost no one thinks about.

IANAL

First the law:

IC 35-44-3-12
Unlawful use of a police radio; exemptions; "police radio" defined
Sec. 12.
(a) A person who knowingly or intentionally:
(1) possesses a police radio;
(2) transmits over a frequency assigned for police emergency purposes; or
(3) possesses or uses a police radio:
(A) while committing a crime;
(B) to further the commission of a crime; or
(C) to avoid detection by a law enforcement agency;
commits unlawful use of a police radio, a Class B misdemeanor.
(b) Subsection (a)(1) and (a)(2) do not apply to:
(1) a governmental entity;
(2) a regularly employed law enforcement officer;
(3) a common carrier of persons for hire whose vehicles are used in emergency service;
(4) a public service or utility company whose vehicles are used in emergency service;
(5) a person who has written permission from the chief executive officer of a law enforcement agency to possess a police radio;
(6) a person who holds an amateur radio license issued by the Federal Communications Commission if the person is not transmitting over a frequency assigned for police emergency purposes;
(7) a person who uses a police radio only in the person's dwelling or place of business;
(8) a person:
(A) who is regularly engaged in news gathering activities;
(B) who is employed by a newspaper qualified to receive legal advertisements under IC 5-3-1, a wire service, or a licensed commercial or public radio or television station; and
(C) whose name is furnished by his employer to the chief executive officer of a law enforcement agency in the county in which the employer's principal office is located;

(9) a person engaged in the business of manufacturing or selling police radios; or
(10) a person who possesses or uses a police radio during the normal course of the person's lawful business.
(c) As used in this section, "police radio" means a radio that is capable of sending or receiving signals transmitted on frequencies assigned by the Federal Communications Commission for police emergency purposes and that:
(1) can be installed, maintained, or operated in a vehicle; or
(2) can be operated while it is being carried by an individual.
The term does not include a radio designed for use only in a dwelling.

The key to all this is the last part "(c)". Police radio is defined as a radio capable of sending or receiving signals transmitted on police frequencies. Mobile devices, such as a phone, are NOT capable of receiving these signals. However, the argument against that is because the app receives those signals retransmitted it does qualify as a police radio. Okay, lets go with that and assume they are illegal.

Key word is "capable". For example take the stream available for my county. All that is required is a internet connect (I have that), a speaker (have it), web browser (have it), and a media player (have it). My phone is capable even if I'm not listening or even if I don't know about the availability of the stream. Keep in mind the law does not say it is illegal to listen it says it is illegal to have a device that is "capable".

So if a court ever convicted someone on this law for listening then almost all of us are just as guilty even if we have never listened to a police stream with our phone. When this (stupid) law was written no one foreseen everyone carrying around phones "capable" of doing this. However, since the law has not been rewritten it is illegal to have a smart phone in Indiana because of this law if you interpret it to mean mobile scanner apps or streams are illegal to listen to.

If this ever came to a court they would have to determine if the rebroadcasted internet audio streams are the same as the "signals transmitted" by police.

As they say we all break laws everyday we didn't know about. This may just be one of those Indiana laws we all break on a daily basis.

 

[Paul30]

It is simply a streaming media of the audio, not reception of the actual transmission on their frequency. Yes, the law has not caught up with technology, but then again if I had my way all laws would be revisited often to verify if they are even needed as times change. Another work around would be a short delay on the rebroadcast. Then technically it is not a live broadcast, simply listening to a previous recording, even if it is only a 2 second delay. I like that the app records so if you miss something you can play it back. It even has the ability to download and save prior days through another subscription service. If you want to listen to something that happened 9 days ago, you select the date you want and download and listen. I like the app because on occasion all hell breaks loose and police cars, fire trucks, etc. are moving quickly and lots of them. It's nice to know if an armed subject is being chased on foot in your area, or if your home may be on fire. As mentioned, if you want to mount a real scanner in your vehicle with no legal issues simply get your ham license and you are good. They are good for 10 years, and renewals don't require a test so you only have to pass the test once in your life.

As mentioned above, if they consider a smart phone capable, every smart phone out there would be illegal since you only need to download the app with no modifications.

 

[TheSpark]

As mentioned above, if they consider a smart phone capable, every smart phone out there would be illegal since you only need to download the app with no modifications.

Or in some cases no app at all. My county does not require an app. So it is, or can be, illegal even if you don't have any app installed or have never listened to one or even know they exist if the law is interpreted to apply to rebroadcasted streams. Regardless, I still think a court would rule they are not illegal but you never know. If they were to rule they are illegal I do know that would mean all cell phones with an internet connection are illegal in Indiana.

Also, by the very nature of internet streaming there is a delay of at least a few seconds and most likely 10 or so seconds (especially for cellular internet).

One more note. There was a guy arrested a few years ago in Indiana who was part of a felony, I think robbing a place. Getaway driver I think. He was charged by the police with listening to police traffic on phone. Prosecutor choose not to prosecute on that charge. Why? Not sure. I suspect though the prosecutor knew that charge wouldn't hold up.

 

[shootersix]

It has been several years ago that my friend was pulled over for a minor infraction with me in the passenger seat. He and I both were asked for ID and when they called mine in the dispatcher came back with my info and included that I had a LTCH. I heard it myself so I know it does happen.

I also have heard Social Security numbers read over the airwaves on many occasions, mostly if the person does not have a drivers license.

20 years ago, my ex and i were in a car, she was driving, and as she backed out of the parking space, she hit another car, the police showed up, both she and the other driver got in the police car to fill out the report, they called in both of their info, then the officer asked for my name, and ran my info, it came back that i had a "permit", the officer never asked her if i had a gun, never said a word to me, and i didnt even know he called me in till the wife told me, now what did **** me off was that the officer called in my info, but the passenger in the other car!

btw it was evansville pd

 

[Overwatch]

some individual policemen wouldn't mind having their 20 year old police cars and walkie talkie batteries that only last 1/2 hour replaced too....all this stuff costs money

You mean I could get a Tahoo? Sweet!

 

[mainjet]

I am not sure if this is what the OP is talking about but - I hear on the scanner all the time that they announce not the party that the call is about but other non related parties on the same street that may have a gun permit. I hear this on the Hammond radio a lot. When sending an officer to an area they come back and call it a "hazard" and say something to the effect of on the same street there are LTCH.

ETA - if they ever get called to my house they are going to have to say - "watch out, everyone there has a LTCH". lol. They have nothing to worry about. I am a very peaceful individual.

 

[TheSpark]

I am not sure if this is what the OP is talking about but - I hear on the scanner all the time that they announce not the party that the call is about but other non related parties on the same street that may have a gun permit. I hear this on the Hammond radio a lot. When sending an officer to an area they come back and call it a "hazard" and say something to the effect of on the same street there are LTCH.

ETA - if they ever get called to my house they are going to have to say - "watch out, everyone there has a LTCH". lol. They have nothing to worry about. I am a very peaceful individual.

Just seems silly to me for them to even know though. When it comes to guns if I was a police officer I would be concerned more for my safety if the person did not have a LTCH.