OC Black Friday Meet and Lunch 11/26/10 Discussion Thread

[Frank_N_Stein]

I think a VERY worthwhile side effect, and one of the objectives of this event that was achieved, is that during the course of setting this up, the organzer was able to educate some cops on things they needed to know, but did not. One example is that the officers apparently were not aware of the fact that the address on the LTCH does not have to match our current address. IOW, they thought we were required to obtain an updated LTCH when we moved instead of merely notifying the state police. As a result of this event, at least some IMPD cops may now be able to avoid arresting someone they incorrectly thought had an invalid LTCH.

I can't speak for every other cop, but I could care less what address is on your LTCH. As long as it is valid there won't be a problem.

 

[Joe Williams]

Side note and idea for next time that came to me today:

On the backside of your flyers, you should get a local company or restaurant to sponsor some coupons. That way, people will be less likely to walk around the corner and dump it in the trash. I'm thinking a place like Dick's BBQ, Papa Roux, etc.

Another plus is that people might read the information more in detail when they get home and put their new "coupons" away.

Just a thought.

Speaking of Dick's BBQ, they REALLY welcomed us today. They deserve the support of gun owners when downtown, and it couldn't hurt to tell them why you patronize them, aside from the absolutely yummy food.

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

I just read the posts on officer.com and it was a bit shocking. I really had no idea that cops were so arrogant. We are "social retards" in their eyes because we choose to exercise our 2nd. My impression of cops has changed and not for the better. I will no longer use the term "leo" because it is obvious to me that they have no concept of actual law enforcement.

I WILL attend the next walk and I think we should get shirts made that say "Social Retard".

Taking the comments of 2 or 3 cops on officer.com and applying it to the rest of us is about as ignorant as me taking the comments of 2 or 3 INGOers and applying it to the rest of them. Opinions are like *******s, everyone has one and most of them stink.

 

[johnb62]

Taking the comments of 2 or 3 cops on officer.com and applying it to the rest of us is about as ignorant as me taking the comments of 2 or 3 INGOers and applying it to the rest of them. Opinions are like *******s, everyone has one and most of them stink.

Well said. Rep inbound!

 

[johnb62]

Congrats on a good showing. I have been anxious to hear how it turned out.

 

[smitty12b]

I can't speak for every other cop, but I could care less what address is on your LTCH. As long as it is valid there won't be a problem.

Frank, I have a serious question for you, how many bad guys have you arrested that were OCing? How often do you see a gang banger or whatever they are called walking down the street with their hi-point on their hip?

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

Frank, I have a serious question for you, how many bad guys have you arrested that were OCing? How often do you see a gang banger or whatever they are called walking down the street with their hi-point on their hip?

I have arrested one guy that was OCing. He was a convicted felon (robbery and aggravated assault), had an outstanding aggravated assault warrant, and had 11 grams of crack in his sock.

I don't see too many OCers while I'm at work, I mostly see them when I'm off-duty and out running errands. Those I have seen while at work did not have the "gang-banger" look, but one guy was a little "thuggish."

 

[smitty12b]

Taking the comments of 2 or 3 cops on officer.com and applying it to the rest of us is about as ignorant as me taking the comments of 2 or 3 INGOers and applying it to the rest of them. Opinions are like *******s, everyone has one and most of them stink.

If it were just 2 or 3 I would agree but as I read other threads on that sight it seems to be a pretty common and disturbing attitude.
I am not a cop hater, I have never been arrested and at 45 I have only gotten 2 tickets . I was raised to respect cops and that is how I raised my kids but to see that there is no respect for the people they are supposed to be protecting really has me rethinking things.

 

[Que]

What do you feel was not properly addressed this time? [STRIKE], aside from the fact that the organizer was blindsided by anti-gun activity from some gun owners? How do you propose we handle people people we should be able to trust spreading non-factual information to city council members about our intent? We expect and can handle that sort of thing from the Brady Bunch. It's worse when it comes from our own ranks, and harder to deal with.

The police were involved and briefed. Unlike other events, this one had news coverage, which we will have to wait for another hour or so to see if it was positive, but I suspect Fox59's will at least be balanced. I didn't talk to the Channel 6 dude, so don't know what their take on it was.

There was sufficient crowd control, the public got to see Americans exercising several Constitutional rights, and the news coverage will do more to spread our word to the general public than any amount of preaching to the choir by holding shooting events such people will never hear about could do, though such events have their own place and importance.

[/STRIKE]

Great question Joe! I wouldn't say that anything in particular was not properly addressed, from my point of view. However, as one who attended the event, along with others, you may be able to provide some input. I believe any successful event can/should be analyzed in order to produce an even better result the next time. I'm not referring to any finger pointing or intentionally combative dialogue, but true constructive criticism.

I believe SJ did a great job and I will be soliciting his help in organizing an event I have in mind to take place in the spring.

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

If it were just 2 or 3 I would agree but as I read other threads on that sight it seems to be a pretty common and disturbing attitude.
I am not a cop hater, I have never been arrested and at 45 I have only gotten 2 tickets . I was raised to respect cops and that is how I raised my kids but to see that there is no respect for the people they are supposed to be protecting really has me rethinking things.

Its a forum for cops, you are going to get a lot of threads that you won't appreciate or agree with. Just my opinion, but I would advise you not visit over there and leave them to themselves.

 

[smitty12b]

Its a forum for cops, you are going to get a lot of threads that you won't appreciate or agree with. Just my opinion, but I would advise you not visit over there and leave them to themselves.

That is a sad statement Frank. One good thing has come from my visit to the sight, they have helped create a new OCer.

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

That is a sad statement Frank. One good thing has come from my visit to the sight, they have helped create a new OCer.

Well I'm glad they helped you out with something.

 

[smitty12b]

Well I'm glad they helped you out with something.

Yea but now I have to buy a new holster

 

[Joe Williams]

[/strike]

Great question Joe! I wouldn't say that anything in particular was not properly addressed, from my point of view. However, as one who attended the event, along with others, you may be able to provide some input. I believe any successful event can/should be analyzed in order to produce an even better result the next time. I'm not referring to any finger pointing or intentionally combative dialogue, but true constructive criticism.

I believe SJ did a great job and I will be soliciting his help in organizing an event I have in mind to take place in the spring.

Constructively, I truly believe this board should be more proactive in helping events like this. There are people who have the ears of folks in charge, people who have experience organizing such things, people who have experience with the media, and the clout this board has can help such events take place peacefully, without a confrontational attitude with the city (though this and the previous events have done very well in this regard,) and I think a board that can get 50-100 and more people together for picnics and shoots should be able to use it's clout to generate sizable turnout for OC and CC, or combined, events.

This event and the ones in the past went well. Need more turnout from gun owners. It's an hour and half to take a walk downtown. With eleven thousand members, if the drama that took place prior to this event is avoided it should be an easy matter to have a hundred people get together to take a quick and pleasant walk. The news won't come out again for such a small turnout, and we need their presense to have a truly far reaching effect.

This is the third time one of these events have been held. Every time, they've be preceeded by a great wailing and gnashing of teeth. It should be obvious that the events can be held without incident. The "trial runs" have been done. These are an effective way of getting our message out to the general public. It's time to put all the energy that goes into trying to quash the events out of fear into making them bigger, better, and fine tuning our message. We need professional speakers to take the lead in speaking to the media, and there are some here. We need a big enough turnout next time to make the one after that worth getting the permits to hold signs and have a true demonstration.

 

[Cru]

I'm gonna watch the news, but we'll see how much coverage it gets since there was no drama.

Glad you guys had a good event.

 

[Que]

Constructively, I truly believe this board should be more proactive in helping events like this. There are people who have the ears of folks in charge, people who have experience organizing such things, people who have experience with the media, and the clout this board has can help such events take place peacefully, without a confrontational attitude with the city (though this and the previous events have done very well in this regard,) and I think a board that can get 50-100 and more people together for picnics and shoots should be able to use it's clout to generate sizable turnout for OC and CC, or combined, events.

This event and the ones in the past went well. Need more turnout from gun owners. It's an hour and half to take a walk downtown. With eleven thousand members, if the drama that took place prior to this event is avoided it should be an easy matter to have a hundred people get together to take a quick and pleasant walk. The news won't come out again for such a small turnout, and we need their presense to have a truly far reaching effect.

This is the third time one of these events have been held. Every time, they've be preceeded by a great wailing and gnashing of teeth. It should be obvious that the events can be held without incident. The "trial runs" have been done. These are an effective way of getting our message out to the general public. It's time to put all the energy that goes into trying to quash the events out of fear into making them bigger, better, and fine tuning our message. We need professional speakers to take the lead in speaking to the media, and there are some here. We need a big enough turnout next time to make the one after that worth getting the permits to hold signs and have a true demonstration.

You may have a valid point, but did anyone contact the owner of this forum to discuss these points? Besides, to he honest Joe, I don't think it's INGO that keeps these activities from achieving more turnout. Based on your past posts, I would venture to say it's POSSIBLY you and people such as yourself, along with several other possible reasons.

Everyone will not agree with anything. But, even if I don't necessarily agree with how the event takes place, I could support SJ, Cru and other organizers like them. They have their heads on straight and understand that an adverse opinion can provide some though for consideration and is not always a personal attack.

I am in the process of developing some thoughts for an event and will contact the owners of INGO, INS and other forums, to solicit their support. Does that mean that every member of their forums will agree or support? No! But, I would like to at least approach them to see about garnering their personal support and the use of their site names. They may say no and if so, that will not make them my enemy or the enemy of gun rights. It just may mean they don't like or appreciate my idea.

Also, what could INGO have done to be "more proactive in helping" this event be successful? That is information that could be useful next time.

 

[Joe Williams]

I'm gonna watch the news, but we'll see how much coverage it gets since there was no drama.

Glad you guys had a good event.

Cathy and Sean are sitting here glued to the screen, and I told them not to be too disappointed if they don't get on since nothing happened LOL.

They still think it's cool that the guy who interviewed them is the Fox59 anchor.

 

[Militarypol21]

I have arrested one guy that was OCing. He was a convicted felon (robbery and aggravated assault), had an outstanding aggravated assault warrant, and had 11 grams of crack in his sock.

I don't see too many OCers while I'm at work, I mostly see them when I'm off-duty and out running errands. Those I have seen while at work did not have the "gang-banger" look, but one guy was a little "thuggish."

You don't happen to be talking about the hoodlum "walking to the gas station" at 2am with a .40 shoved down the front of his pants that were down around his knees?

 

[Joe Williams]

You may have a valid point, but did anyone contact the owner of this forum to discuss these points? Besides, to he honest Joe, I don't think it's INGO that keeps these activities from achieving more turnout. Based on your past posts, I would venture to say it's POSSIBLY you and people such as yourself, along with several other possible reasons.
snip.

Well, I reckon we'll have to disagree on that. I'll discuss it on another board if you wish, where you and another mod in particular cannot abuse your mod authority here.

 

[IndyMonkey]

They still think it's cool that the guy who interviewed them is the Fox59 anchor.

Apparently they have not have enough interactions with the media to know they were being interviewed by a scumbag.