No, the ATF wouldn't have a searchable gun database, would they?

[TheGrumpyGuy]

 

[BigMoose]

The rumor is, that the ATF has all the returned 4473s (the ones when a gun shop is closed).
Well they don't keep all that paper. They put them on special microfiche on a special custom machine that can scan the special microfiche for stuff they are looking for.

Is this technically by the letter of the law a electronic database. No. But its got the same features.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

They admitted to its existence in 1995 in an NBC news program called Day One.

 

[BigMoose]

They admitted to its existence in 1995 in an NBC news program called Day One.

Yeah its pretty much well known. Though its not by the letter of the law an electronic database. As I said its a special system to search a microfiche like film.

They have used technology to skirt the spirit of the FOPA... they took our right to make new MGs, and still got their effective database.

 

[KellyinAvon]

ATF is a rogue agency. Burn it to the ground, salt the earth where it once stood.

 

[Cameramonkey]

ATF is a rogue agency. Burn it to the ground, salt the earth where it once stood hand over the property to whatever Indian tribe it was taken from.

FIFY and made some hippies happy. LOL

 

[BigMoose]

That said they don't have all the info. Here is how they get it.

FFL closes and turns in their 4473
Multiple Handgun Purchase form
Law Enforcement collects the info

There is only so much you can do about the top one. The reaper eventually gets a lot of FFLs, big and small.
Gander Mountain, Indy Trading Post, on and on.. they likely have some of my 4473s.
But sometimes its less conspicuous. Sometimes a business of gun shop will change hands. The old FFL is given up, the new owner gets rid of hordes of crap they have to store, so yeah to them its perfect for them. Bad for us.

Now obviously the second one, its easy to avoid. Never buy multiple handguns. EVER, just don't do it.. spread them out.

The last one. I think you know how it happens. That is the whole IMPD property room deal. (And similar rooms)

 

[KellyinAvon]

FIFY and made some hippies happy. LOL

I can get onboard with that!

 

[TheGrumpyGuy]

...

The last one. I think you know how it happens. That is the whole IMPD property room deal. (And similar rooms)

I don't think I've seen any update on that story, either. Maybe time for Mr. Essex to do a follow-up article.

 

[jcj54]

FFL closes and turns in their 4473
Multiple Handgun Purchase form
Law Enforcement collects the info

And the ATF inspectors doing a routine FFL inspection photographing 4473 forms and bound books. Both specifically prohibited by the 1986 Firearm Owner Protection Act, but occurring routinely these days.

 

[manifest destiny]

With or without the 4473 forms, wouldn't NICS have record of the call? Meaning if John Doe is getting clearance for a purchase, NICS would be able to see that John Doe at least has interest in buying a gun and likely has bought a gun. Suppose the call logs show John Doe having dozens of NICS calls over a decade... I'm sure the fed prefers to have a database of the forms, but it's not like they couldn't easily determin if Manifest Destiny has ever purchased or attempted to purchase (at the retail level). Or maybe I'm missing something like NICS doesn't keep a record of the call from the FFL??? I mean, the calls are so curt and only really offer SS# (if buyer gives) and long/short gun type, so maybe they don't keep the call log.

 

[jcj54]

The FBI NICS system requires the name of the buyer, and the take the SSN if supplied AND the number from the the ID used and recorded on the 4473.
Anyone who thinks they don't keep a record of this needs to be less naive.

 

[TheGrumpyGuy]

The FBI NICS system requires the name of the buyer, and the take the SSN if supplied AND the number from the the ID used and recorded on the 4473.
Anyone who thinks they don't keep a record of this needs to be less naive.

But would that include the S/N of the firearm being purchased? Seems the other info wouldn't be of much use without it

 

[jcj54]

Since they know you filled out the form and were approved for the purchase, they have a 99% certainty you took a gun home and know if it is a long gun, handgun, or "other".
Exactly what is less important than the system knowing you were approved for it.