New Local Ordinance

[Bob45]

I live in Brookville, in Franklin County and just noticed a small article in the local weekly paper that the town council has passed an ordanace forbidding the carrying of deadly weapons on town property or in town meetings. Anyone suspected of carrying a weapon would be subject to a pat down or wand search and their weapon would be confiscated and returned when they left town property. This seems strange to me, I dont even know what town property is, and it seems like a license for the town police to search anyone they want whenever they want. I wonder what other constitutional right they will forbid next

 

[clelaj]

Sounds like this local ordanance is direct conflict with 2nd Amendment and you should pursue that with town council.

 

[INGunGuy]

Sorry to burst your bubble, but they can regulate firearms on city/county owned property.

IC 35-47-11-2
Regulation of firearms by units other than townships
Sec. 2. Notwithstanding IC 36-1-3, a unit may not regulate in any manner the ownership, possession, sale, transfer, or transportation of firearms (as defined in IC 35-47-1-5) or ammunition except as follows:
(1) This chapter does not apply to land, buildings, or other real property owned or administered by a unit, except highways (as defined in IC 8-23-1-23) or public highways (as defined in IC 8-2.1-17-14).
(2) Notwithstanding the limitation in this section, a unit may use the unit's planning and zoning powers under IC 36-7-4 to prohibit the sale of firearms within two hundred (200) feet of a school by a person having a business that did not sell firearms within two hundred (200) feet of a school before April 1, 1994.
(3) Notwithstanding the limitation in this section, a legislative body of a unit other than a township may adopt an emergency ordinance or a unit other than a township may take other action allowed under section 6 of this chapter to regulate the sale of firearms anywhere within the unit for a period of not more than seventy-two (72) hours after the regulatory action takes effect.
As added by P.L.140-1994, SEC.13.

INGunGuy

 

[Bob45]

Any idea what town property is? The sidewalk, the street? I really dont know and it really seems pretty vague to me, also I dont like the idea of a town cop giving me a search because he suspects me of carrying a weapon, what is this suspision based on?

 

[INGunGuy]

Any idea what town property is? The sidewalk, the street? I really dont know and it really seems pretty vague to me, also I dont like the idea of a town cop giving me a search because he suspects me of carrying a weapon, what is this suspision based on?

Well as it states in the Indiana Code, that "(1) This chapter does not apply to land, buildings, or other real property owned or administered by a unit, except highways (as defined in IC 8-23-1-23) or public highways (as defined in IC 8-2.1-17-14)."

Jeffersonville, adopted a local ordinance forbidding any kind of a weapon, handgun, rifle, knife, etc within the City/County building, I wanted to know the legal standing of that particular ordinance, because the City/County building houses the Property tax office, the sewer offices, etc... Well the 2nd floor is where the courtrooms were and the scanners, and metal detectors were on the 2nd floor, they moved them to the first and open only 1 set of doors to get into the building. There is a sign stating that weapons are forbidden and if found will be confiscated and NOT returned. Well I wanted to know about the NOT returned part, and found the local ordinance, and it stated that someone can refuse to be searched, but would then be forbidden from entering the building. And the ordinance also stated that the weapon would be returned when the person left the building, BUT that a 250-500 fine would be imposed on the person bringing the weapon into the building. So, the police manning the doors say they keep all weapons, but the ordinance calls for their return.

INGunGuy

 

[Bob45]

do you kow what the state of Indiana considers a deadly weapon and is the town bound by their defintion, I always carry a pocket knife clipped in my pocket so I guess that would get me searched. I understand the reason for not carrying in the courthouse or the sheriffs office or the police department but I think this is over the line.

 

[Scutter01]

I understand the reason for not carrying in the courthouse or the sheriffs office or the police department but I think this is over the line.

What reason is that, exactly? What is it about those locations that is likely to cause me to turn from highly law-abiding into a potential murderer?

 

[GuyRelford]

do you kow what the state of Indiana considers a deadly weapon and is the town bound by their defintion, I always carry a pocket knife clipped in my pocket so I guess that would get me searched. I understand the reason for not carrying in the courthouse or the sheriffs office or the police department but I think this is over the line.

IC 35-41-1-8
"Deadly weapon" defined
Sec. 8. (a) Except as provided in subsection (b), "deadly weapon" means the following:
(1) A loaded or unloaded firearm.
(2) A destructive device, weapon, device, taser (as defined in IC 35-47-8-3) or electronic stun weapon (as defined in IC 35-47-8-1), equipment, chemical substance, or other material that in the manner it is used, or could ordinarily be used, or is intended to be used, is readily capable of causing serious bodily injury.
(3) An animal (as defined in IC 35-46-3-3) that is:
(A) readily capable of causing serious bodily injury; and
(B) used in the commission or attempted commission of a crime. (4) A biological disease, virus, or organism that is capable of causing serious bodily injury.
(b) The term does not include:
(1) a taser (as defined in IC 35-47-8-3);
(2) an electronic stun weapon (as defined in IC 35-47-8-1);
(3) a chemical designed to temporarily incapacitate a person; or
(4) another device designed to temporarily incapacitate a person;
if the device described in subdivisions (1) through (4) is used by a law enforcement officer who has been trained in the use of the device and who uses the device in accordance with the law enforcement officer's training and while lawfully engaged in the execution of official duties.
As added by P.L.311-1983, SEC.9. Amended by P.L.318-1985, SEC.1; P.L.140-1994, SEC.4; P.L.156-2001, SEC.8; P.L.123-2002, SEC.33; P.L.143-2006, SEC.1.

 

[Bob45]

I always assumed that the reason for not carrying into courts and law enfocement facilities was so that the guns couldnt be smuggled into jails or obtained by the inmates or criminals, as well as the security of judges, prosecutors etc, if it was up to me there would be no restrictions on carry anywhere, thats why this new law bothers me it seems like the first step on a slippery slope, i hate laws that allow my rights to be taken away

 

[GuyRelford]

do you kow what the state of Indiana considers a deadly weapon and is the town bound by their defintion, I always carry a pocket knife clipped in my pocket so I guess that would get me searched. I understand the reason for not carrying in the courthouse or the sheriffs office or the police department but I think this is over the line.

By the way, it's clear that a knife is a "deadly weapon" under Indiana's definition. As recently stated by the Court of Appeals in Martin v. State (unpublished, 2007),

"First, although the word 'knife' is not specifically set forth in the statutory definition of deadly weapon, there is no question that it is a weapon that is 'readily capable of causing serious bodily injury.' . . . . Moreover, this court has held on a number of occassions that a knife is a deadly weapon. See Hall v. State, 831 N.E.2d 823,827 (Ind. Ct. App. 2005)."

 

[sporter]

Is there an IC they can stick on you if you are clearly permitted(ala LTCH) by law to carry?

 

[Bob45]

The article in the paper said that it was forbidden even if the person was licesened by the state

 

[Scutter01]

Is there an IC they can stick on you if you are clearly permitted(ala LTCH) by law to carry?

IC 35-47-11-2 as noted above.

 

[phatgemi]

I live in Brookville, in Franklin County and just noticed a small article in the local weekly paper that the town council has passed an ordanace forbidding the carrying of deadly weapons on town property or in town meetings. Anyone suspected of carrying a weapon would be subject to a pat down or wand search and their weapon would be confiscated and returned when they left town property. This seems strange to me, I dont even know what town property is, and it seems like a license for the town police to search anyone they want whenever they want. I wonder what other constitutional right they will forbid next

Welcome to the Peoples Republic of Brookville! If you have ever attended any local govermental meetings you would understand how they react. I also live in Franklin county. Truly a step backwards and could become an issue during the next years elections.

 

[Bob45]

do you know who in local government is responsible for this?

 

[cce1302]

What means does the town have to enforce this petty ordinance?

 

[Farmritch]

We knocked this down in Mishawaka last spring , This is the reason we need to keep our ears open and get involved with the 2nd ammendment patriots state wide.
To keep a villigant watch on government no matter how large ( federal) or small ( town board ) and GET INVOLVED people !!!!
This should have never been allowed to happen.
WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!!
This seems to be the same wording they came up with here (wonder why?) and we asked just what city property they were talking about it basicly allowed the city to make up what ever and where ever that wanted to with a simple stroke of the pen

 

[phatgemi]

We knocked this down in Mishawaka last spring , This is the reason we need to keep our ears open and get involved with the 2nd ammendment patriots state wide.
To keep a villigant watch on government no matter how large ( federal) or small ( town board ) and GET INVOLVED people !!!!
This should have never been allowed to happen.
WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!!
This seems to be the same wording they came up with here (wonder why?) and we asked just what city property they were talking about it basicly allowed the city to make up what ever and where ever that wanted to with a simple stroke of the pen

And how did you go about getting it knocked down?

Secondly I am having trouble applying this:


IC 35-47-11-2
Regulation of firearms by units other than townships
Sec. 2. Notwithstanding IC 36-1-3, a unit may not regulate in any manner the ownership, possession, sale, transfer, or transportation of firearms (as defined in IC 35-47-1-5) or ammunition except as follows:
(1) This chapter does not apply to land, buildings, or other real property owned or administered by a unit, except highways (as defined in IC 8-23-1-23) or public highways (as defined in IC 8-2.1-17-14).
(2) Notwithstanding the limitation in this section, a unit may use the unit's planning and zoning powers under IC 36-7-4 to prohibit the sale of firearms within two hundred (200) feet of a school by a person having a business that did not sell firearms within two hundred (200) feet of a school before April 1, 1994.
(3) Notwithstanding the limitation in this section, a legislative body of a unit other than a township may adopt an emergency ordinance or a unit other than a township may take other action allowed under section 6 of this chapter to regulate the sale of firearms anywhere within the unit for a period of not more than seventy-two (72) hours after the regulatory action takes effect.
As added by P.L.140-1994, SEC.13.

INGunGuy


I guess I'm having trouble understanding this as I read.

1. Sec 2. says a unit may NOT regulate except as follows.........Ok, then how MAY they regulate???

2. Sec 2 (1) says this chapter does NOT apply to land, buildings or other real property own, etc et.........Ok, if it does NOT apply then how can they regulate??? Also the other two IC's referenced just define what a highway or road is. Not applicable to property.

3. Sec 2 (2) refers to zoning and planning with respect to sale of firearms near a school. Ok, I'm sure this does NOT apply.

4. Sec 2 (3) refers to passing an ordinance to regulate the sale of firearms.
This also applies to the sale of firearms. Not applicable!

So, maybe I'm dense but I just don't see how this code applies.

 

[ocsdor]

Post signs throughout town saying: Attention, Criminals! Unarmed, wealthy victims waiting for you at town hall."

And, walk around, with the sign, outside of town hall every time the council has their meetings.

 

[AFA1CY]

And how did you go about getting it knocked down?

Secondly I am having trouble applying this:
... snip ...INGunGuy


I guess I'm having trouble understanding this as I read.

1. Sec 2. says a unit may NOT regulate except as follows.........Ok, then how MAY they regulate???

2. Sec 2 (1) says this chapter does NOT apply to land, buildings or other real property own, etc et.........Ok, if it does NOT apply then how can they regulate??? Also the other two IC's referenced just define what a highway or road is. Not applicable to property.

3. Sec 2 (2) refers to zoning and planning with respect to sale of firearms near a school. Ok, I'm sure this does NOT apply.

4. Sec 2 (3) refers to passing an ordinance to regulate the sale of firearms.
This also applies to the sale of firearms. Not applicable!

So, maybe I'm dense but I just don't see how this code applies.

You did not quote the first section

IC 35-47-11-1
Applicability of chapter
Sec. 1. (a) Section 2 of this chapter applies to all units (as defined in IC 36-1-2-23). All other sections of this chapter apply to all units other than townships.
(b) This chapter applies only if a statute expressly grants a legislative body the authority to adopt an emergency ordinance under this chapter.
(c) This chapter does not affect the validity of an ordinance adopted before, and in effect on, January 1, 1994.
As added by P.L.140-1994, SEC.13.

IC 35-47-11-2
Regulation of firearms by units other than townships
Sec. 2. Notwithstanding IC 36-1-3, a unit may not regulate in any manner the ownership, possession, sale, transfer, or transportation of firearms (as defined in IC 35-47-1-5) or ammunition except as follows:
(1) This chapter does not apply to land, buildings, or other real property owned or administered by a unit, except highways (as defined in IC 8-23-1-23) or public highways (as defined in IC 8-2.1-17-14).

Real simple. Per IC a city can regulate the ownership, possession, sale, transfer, or transportation of firearms or ammunition on their (the city's) property. If the city doesn't want you co carry at the city hall all they have to do is say so.