Looking Guilty Upheld In Ohio

[mrjarrell]

Guess Ohio cops can retire those radar guns and video now. A guesstimate is good enough to convict. Wonder how else they'll apply this? That slippery slope does exist.

via Dayton Daily News

COLUMBUS, Ohio — Ohio's highest court has ruled that a person may be convicted of speeding purely if it looked to a police officer that the motorist was going too fast.
The Ohio Supreme Court ruled Wednesday that an officer's visual estimation of speed is enough to support a conviction if the officer is trained, certified by a training academy, and experienced in watching for speeders. The court's 5-1 decision says independent verification of a driver's speed is not necessary.
The court upheld a lower court's ruling against a driver who challenged a speeding conviction that had been based on testimony from police officer in Copley, 25 miles south of Cleveland. The officer said it appeared to him that the man was driving too fast.

 

[IndyMonkey]

Guess Ohio cops can retire those radar guns and video now. A guesstimate is good enough to convict. Wonder how else they'll apply this? That slippery slope does exist.

via Dayton Daily News

You realize that ISP does that too right?

They have to ride with a supervisor one day and guess the speeds of cars as part of there training.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

I always like the "appeared too fast" cases.

You can do the pen trick or the "when were your eyeballs calibrated last?" question. Judges love it.

 

[jontheturboguy]

You realize that ISP does that too right?

They have to ride with a supervisor one day and guess the speeds of cars as part of there training.

Any you know this 100% how?

 

[IndyMonkey]

Any you know this 100% how?

why would I make it up?

 

[rambone]

Wow, what a crock.

Is there a way to prove a cop even touched his radar gun anyways? It always seemed like it was the cop's word against yours, no matter what. Which sucks. The cop might as well have said he used the radar gun. Nobody would be able to say differently.

How do you disprove that you were speeding? What evidence can you possibly bring to court to defend that case?

I will simply *sigh* and say that I agree with the "What's the point?" thread.

 

[smoking357]

I always like the "appeared too fast" cases.

You can do the pen trick or the "when were your eyeballs calibrated last?" question. Judges love it.

But the client is still out $500 for prep and a trial, and few people are willing to pay it, so the cops get to steal money from the 99% of citizens who can't afford the lawyer.

Further, in Marion County, "Judge" Bill Young will punish you for hiring an attorney and defending the case. Plus, he's a government employee, so he always sides with other government employees. You know, kind of like the Ohio Supreme Court.

The greatest attack on our freedom has not come from any Liberal, but from the constant sapping of armed guards watching our every move.

 

[smoking357]

Wow, what a crock.

Is there a way to prove a cop even touched his radar gun anyways? It always seemed like it was the cop's word against yours, no matter what. Which sucks. The cop might as well have said he used the radar gun. Nobody would be able to say differently.

How do you disprove that you were speeding? What evidence can you possibly bring to court to defend that case?

I will simply *sigh* and say that I agree with the "What's the point?" thread.

For centuries, the rule was "when there is only one witness, there is no witness, at all."

In police-state America, we have no use for such principles of limited government.

 

[level.eleven]

Any you know this 100% how?

I believe it is a very common practice for those that will be doing traffic enforcement. Enforcers can become certified and they are given an error factor of +/- X mph that they can then use in traffic court. At least this is what I have read recently in an edmunds.com article. Of course, you can debate the usefulness of self-certification, it certainly is a no-no in many private sector industries. That's why there is an entire industry devoted to validation.

 

[Denny347]

Hmm, I am a certified radar operator and as part of my exam, I had to correctly guess the speeds of 10 vehicles. I had to be within 5mph on all of them. You run enough radar it is quite easy to estimate their speed accurately. When I used to have a radar in my car, I would just sit and estimate speeds. I would then activate the radar to get the actual speed. Always within 3mph or so. Now that i don't own a radar anymore or run traffic, I have gotten out of practice but I'm still pretty good. I'll just pace a car with mine if I want a speed reading.

 

[BtownBlaster]

Wow, what a crock.
How do you disprove that you were speeding? What evidence can you possibly bring to court to defend that case?

The whole point is, it's not your duty to prove your innocence, it's up to the state to prove your guilt. Not saying that's how it works in the real world, and that's the whole problem. The land of the free ain't so free anymore.......

 

[kabrown]

The greatest attack on our freedom has not come from any Liberal, but from the constant sapping of armed guards watching our every move.

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

 

[smoking357]

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

Careful, saying that will get you in the MIAC Report.

 

[smoking357]

Hmm, I am a certified radar operator and as part of my exam, I had to correctly guess the speeds of 10 vehicles. I had to be within 5mph on all of them.

That's a 10 mph spread. Hardly impressive. That manner of permissible error is why it's easy for the charlatans at the carnival to guess weight and age within their posted limits.

 

[dross]

Hmm, I am a certified radar operator and as part of my exam, I had to correctly guess the speeds of 10 vehicles. I had to be within 5mph on all of them. You run enough radar it is quite easy to estimate their speed accurately. When I used to have a radar in my car, I would just sit and estimate speeds. I would then activate the radar to get the actual speed. Always within 3mph or so. Now that i don't own a radar anymore or run traffic, I have gotten out of practice but I'm still pretty good. I'll just pace a car with mine if I want a speed reading.

What is the standard for writing a ticket based only on the officer's judgment?

Also, are you saying you could judge a car traveling 70mph within 3mph as often as you could judge a car going 20mph within 3mph? Because that wouldn't make sense.

Please say more.

 

[hornadylnl]

Wow, what a crock.

Is there a way to prove a cop even touched his radar gun anyways? It always seemed like it was the cop's word against yours, no matter what. Which sucks. The cop might as well have said he used the radar gun. Nobody would be able to say differently.

How do you disprove that you were speeding? What evidence can you possibly bring to court to defend that case?

I will simply *sigh* and say that I agree with the "What's the point?" thread.

No need to worry. When they get done installing the gps tracking devices that will tell the .gov how much you owe in fuel taxes, they will put something in it that limits your speed to the current road you're on.

 

[level.eleven]

No need to worry. When they get done installing the gps tracking devices that will tell the .gov how much you owe in fuel taxes, they will put something in it that limits your speed to the current road you're on.

Looks like 2015 is the target date if Congress passes such requirements. Oh yeah, initial cost estimates puts the new black boxes at $5000 and swell to the size of a shoebox.

Report: U.S. safety bill could triple cost of automotive black boxes to $5,000 — Autoblog

Auto-safety bill headed to full U.S. House

All a bunch of knee-jerk legislation spawned by a couple people having problems with applying the breaks on their Toyota.

 

[moischmoe]

How do you disprove that you were speeding? What evidence can you possibly bring to court to defend that case?

If you have a GPS unit, you can download your "track" into Google Earth. It will show your heading, speed, and it is timestamped.

 

[indykid]

So in Arizona it is illegal to ask someone for papers who a police person thinks is an illegal alien, but it is ok to stop anyone for driving a automo-cash-cow because they look like they are speeding?

And I thought the greatest generation fought this in a country in Europe and the isles of the Pacific to stop this crap!

 

[Boilers]

Again, buy this/these for as much proof in your defense as you can muster.

Of course that means you have to DRIVE THE SPEED LIMIT in order to sanely use it.

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